|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58
Enthusiast
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58 |
Just when I thought I was out—they pull me back in! So, I've had my travails in getting my KeyStation 88 to work with my Win10/SoundBlaster Z set up, but I finally have it where the sound works, works pretty consistently and at a reasonable volume. It also doesn't lag...much...at first! (Read in William Shatner's voice for best effect.) But...slowly...the lag appears...begins to embiggen...and pretty soon, I'm wondering if I've gone mad, or if I've gone sane in a mad world. (It IS actually, kind of funny, as I play slower and slower because the notes are coming out slower.) Actually, I think now (I've been mulling this for a few days) it's always a little laggy. I had a better pianist than I come in try it and she noticed immediately. It seems better or worse from moment to moment but I can't nail it down. So...how to troubleshoot this? These are my MIDI settings: - My MIDI Input Driver is "Keystation 88". That's the only thing I've found that works.
- My MIDI Output Driver is Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth or Microsoft MIDI Mapper.
- My Synthesizer/Sound card is Coyote WaveTable DXI. (I can use any of the others apparently; I haven't figured out the significance of this. Though it doesn't seem to matter vis a vis the lag.)
- I've checked Use VSTi/DXi synth.
- I've checked Route MIDI thru to MIDI driver.
- My GM2 Support is General MIDI 2 (GM2) support.
- Audio Settings are ASIO always.
1) If I exit BiaB and come back, the lag reduces, but never actually goes away AFAICT. 2) I'm using ASIO4All. 3) I can use the SBZ driver, too, but that doesn't seem matter much. 4) I set the quality settings to "Fast" 5) If I click the "Get from soundcard" button at any time, BiaB crashes. I am open to any solution to removing lag. Hardware/software/whatever.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,271
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,271 |
What are your computer specs? Ram? CPU speed? HD speed? etc
Does the slow down also happen in RB or any other DAW or music device?
Are there tempo changes in the song?
If there are no tempo changes and the song starts out OK but then slows down it sounds like you are pushing something to the limit. Maybe the CPU, sound card, RAM, HD, etc but without the computer spec information it is hard to many any conclusion.
I got banned from Weight Watchers for dropping a bag of M&Ms on the floor.
It was the best game of Hungry Hippos I've ever seen!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,370
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 10,370 |
Just when I thought I was out—they pull me back in! So, I've had my travails in getting my KeyStation 88 to work with my Win10/SoundBlaster Z set up, but I finally have it where the sound works, works pretty consistently and at a reasonable volume. It also doesn't lag...much...at first! (Read in William Shatner's voice for best effect.) But...slowly...the lag appears...begins to embiggen...and pretty soon, I'm wondering if I've gone mad, or if I've gone sane in a mad world. (It IS actually, kind of funny, as I play slower and slower because the notes are coming out slower.) Actually, I think now (I've been mulling this for a few days) it's always a little laggy. I had a better pianist than I come in try it and she noticed immediately. It seems better or worse from moment to moment but I can't nail it down. So...how to troubleshoot this? These are my MIDI settings: - My MIDI Input Driver is "Keystation 88". That's the only thing I've found that works.
- My MIDI Output Driver is Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth or Microsoft MIDI Mapper.
- My Synthesizer/Sound card is Coyote WaveTable DXI. (I can use any of the others apparently; I haven't figured out the significance of this. Though it doesn't seem to matter vis a vis the lag.)
- I've checked Use VSTi/DXi synth.
- I've checked Route MIDI thru to MIDI driver.
- My GM2 Support is General MIDI 2 (GM2) support.
- Audio Settings are ASIO always.
1) If I exit BiaB and come back, the lag reduces, but never actually goes away AFAICT. 2) I'm using ASIO4All. 3) I can use the SBZ driver, too, but that doesn't seem matter much. 4) I set the quality settings to "Fast" 5) If I click the "Get from soundcard" button at any time, BiaB crashes. I am open to any solution to removing lag. Hardware/software/whatever. Your problem is self inflicted. You are using 2 soundcards. One for input ... the KS88 and then you use the MS wavetable as the output. You really need to find ONE interface/card, which can support both in and out from the same card. I'd lay a bet that there is no clock sync between the 2 cards you are using. Since they both run at approximately the same clock speed, they start at the same time but the non-synced clocks soon start to wander out of sync and there you have it. The further you go, the worse it gets. Sound blaster cards can be made to work in some, perhaps even many cases but are not the ideal recording card to be using. That's why many folks have bought and use a third party external dedicated musical interface. I have a Focusrite Saffire to handle all of my musical input and output duties. It works exceptionally well. The only solution is to get, obtain, buy, beg, borrow, or steal, a decent interface that will permit you to do input and output of both audio and midi from the same card. Focusrite, M-Audio, Presonus, are all good options and will work well, use ASIO, and do the job. You can still send the KS88 midi into the computer via the interface. It uses a 5 pin midi connector so get an interface with a 5 pin midi input and you're golden. The software will be using the ONE interface for INPUT and OUTPUT so you won't have the clock sync issues.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 04/15/17 03:49 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 22,179 |
Never use MIDI Mapper unless there is no other choice.
That alone could cause your issue. PGMusic has said a couple times that simply using the MS GS Wavetable synth as the default instead (even if using a soft synth in the long run) has solved some issues like this.
Herb's solution is preferred, but thought I'd mention the above in case it helps you or others.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58 |
>> What are your computer specs? Ram? CPU speed? HD speed? etc I'm gonna go with "more than sufficient" but...it's a (multicore) i7-6700 @ 3.4 Ghz with 32GB of RAM. I have an SSD but I'm running BiaB off the traditional hard-drive which is a pretty usual 7200RPM. >>Does the slow down also happen in RB or any other DAW or music device? I don't really grasp DAWs but I managed to get sound out of a couple other MIDI-thru apps and they, too, lag. >>Are there tempo changes in the song? I'm not even at the "song" level. I'm just talking pressing keys on the keyboard and noticing a delay which seems to change (and mostly increase). >>If there are no tempo changes and the song starts out OK but then slows down it sounds like you are pushing something to the limit. Maybe the CPU, sound card, RAM, HD, etc but without the computer spec information it is hard to many any conclusion.<< It does sound like that, but the computer shows no signs of stress whatsoever. Like, the CPU sitting with BiaB open and idle looks exactly the same as the CPU sitting with BiaB open and me hitting the keys. I opened the Performance Monitor and added a few likely candidates that might be stressed and, no, there's not the slightest indication that BiaB even registers when I'm hitting keys, or when I'm generating and playing something random (except that when it's playing a full, randomly-generated piece, it reads more from the disk).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58 |
Your problem is self inflicted. This is not surprising. >>You are using 2 soundcards. One for input ... the KS88 and then you use the MS wavetable as the output. Am I? The KS88 has no sound card, it's just an input device, if I understand what you mean be "sound card" and also what the Keystation 88 is all about. >>You really need to find ONE interface/card, which can support both in and out from the same card. I'm not 100% sure I'm using ANY sound card, to be honest. You say, "hey, dsbw, you must be using SOME sound card 'cause, you know, you have sound!" But if the in is a sound-card-less KS88 and the out is the Microsoft GS Wavetable synth—which is a softsynth, IIRC—then I'm using as little sound card as it's possible to use, it seems to me. >>I'd lay a bet that there is no clock sync between the 2 cards you are using. Since they both run at approximately the same clock speed, they start at the same time but the non-synced clocks soon start to wander out of sync and there you have it. The further you go, the worse it gets.<< I like this explanation because I understand it, generally, if not which 2 cards are involved here. Anyway, I plugged in my kid's keyboard and found that it lagged (noticably, since it DOES have a built-in synth) and that led to a solution.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Beginners Forum
|
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 58 |
GOT IT! (And it was self-inflicted and I am a moron)
I plugged my kid's keyboard in and found the same lag, which eliminated the KS88 as the problem source.
Then I routed the sound through the monitor via the Onboard AMD sound processor and disabled the Sound Blaster.
Boom. Lag gone.
Sound Blaster does all this processing for games and movies (though I think the sync issues would drive me nuts there, too) so I just turned off all the special features and the lag went away.
Thanks for the walk-through, guys. That really helped me narrow it down.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
Check out all the 202 New RealTracks (in sets 456-467)
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
The 2025 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2025 49-PAK!
Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
Join the conversation on our forum.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums58
Topics84,379
Posts778,465
Members39,635
| |
Most Online25,754
Jan 24th, 2025
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean