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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Oct 2008
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Welcome to the forums. And you're right, re-invigorating old threads is not frowned on at all! You'll enjoy BIAB. There's a bit of a learning curve. If you're patient, though, the end result makes it well worth while taking the time to get to know the program. All the best, Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Dixiesatellite72,
Welcome to the PG Music forum. When you get a chance, visit the User Showcase section of the forum. There are a few forum members from Japan that post links to their compositions.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk Sonar - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: May 2018
Posts: 3
Newbie
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Newbie
Joined: May 2018
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Hi, thanks very much for the welcome  . Look forward to learning everything about BIAB. Ian B.
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 89
Enthusiast
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Joined: Dec 2013
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Backing tracks force you to be a little more disciplined in your rendering. It is unforgiving on timing and really hard on you if you slide on pitch. It is as much an art form as any other in my opinion. In the end it is your performance that counts in a live gig. The music is there to enhance the audience experience, not dominate it.
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 2
Newbie
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Newbie
Joined: Jul 2018
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What is live? What is cheating? Well , my questions are this; Is your voice live and can you mess up , lose your timing or pitch? Ever stand up in front of people and have that happen? The embarrassment will certainly be live. Are you playing an instrument? Did you miss a chord or a few notes in a lead guitar part, maybe a whole bar and there you stand with the music playing and your mouth hanging open, pretty live situation if you ask me. But then again I am just a beginner but been listening for almost 60yrs. So last but not least, whos opinion is most important the players or the listeners? Who are we doing this for again?
Just some thoughts......
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 144
Apprentice
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Apprentice
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 144 |
Playing in bands is overrated. They show up late or not at all, and when they do they always argue about something or other. ☹️
Having BIAB as your backup band is wonderful. No arguments, no complaints, no dilution of earnings. You are in complete control.
Cheers! -Alastair
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,173
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,173 |
Playing in bands is overrated. They show up late or not at all, and when they do they always argue about something or other. ☹️
Having BIAB as your backup band is wonderful. No arguments, no complaints, no dilution of earnings. You are in complete control. I read this and thought over many years of playing with a lot of talented people in a number of bands, boy haven’t I forged a lot of great lifelong bonds with some real characters. These days I create my backing tracks and often go out by myself. Very lonely compared to a bunch of guys joking, laughing and enjoying each other’s company. When it comes to is it cheating. Maybe I use BIAB incorrectly but rarely do I just enter a bunch of chords, pick a style and call it done. Usually I (and I’m sure a lot of others) enter chords, pick a style, then think maybe this part could be made better by substituting a RealTrack or putting the track in RealBand and regenerating a part. Sometimes it is still not right so you write a bit using midi. We may put the song into a DAW and further edit the tracks, cut and paste, adjust timing, etc. Now the song sounds the way we like it, then we mix and master it, put it the way we like it. Then with a number of songs in mind we get them to the same level so there is no sudden rush to a volume knob. At last with all that done it is time to perform. In my case that means singing, playing guitar (lead breaks etc) and generally entertaining a room full of people. I really don’t see all this as cheating. It is in fact easier to stand there with a few of your mates sharing the load and having a good time playing music. The good thing is BIAB does not get moody, drunk or wish it was somewhere else. I can wake up at some ungodly hour put on headphones and design another song without disrupting other folk. BIAB has given me a new lease but I really don’t see it as cheating. My thoughts Tony
Last edited by Teunis; 08/21/18 12:41 AM.
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Jun 2012
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I guess it always depends on what the listener expects (and has paid for!) If I am having a few drinks with friends and we are enjoying each other's company then, as a listener I don't care if it is one guy with backing tracks or the radio playing over the bar's speakers. On the other hand, if I purchased a ticket and will be there to watch & listen to a performance, I'm not really very keen on seeing & hearing someone sing along to prerecorded tracks. Not saying it is bad or wrong...just that I would not pay to see/hear it!
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Joined: Dec 2011
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Irrespective of the intrigue, arguments, hassles, etc of the band world part of a live music experience for me is seeing folks work off of one another musically. Everything from the perfect little fill to the inspired solo to that something extra in a vocal I do realize that a burnt out live group (been in them) is not gonna provide that but when everybody is hittin' the note for us it doesn't get much better. But, hey, good music manifests itself in a zillion genres and configurations...I'm one old phart with an opinion and that is all.
Bud
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos are here on our website.
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,588
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,588 |
I'm an even worse cheat now - even my guitar and vocal effects/harmonies are pre-programmed into my backing tracks on the Voicelive 3 Extreme. I'm no longere trying to press buttons etc but can focus on the audience. I have one unit that plugs into the PA between me and my guitar. If it breaks down it's me, my mic and old trusty
Windows 10 Home 20H2 Build 19042.487
BIAB 2021 (Build 818)
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 144
Apprentice
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Joined: Feb 2012
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“I read this and thought over many years of playing with a lot of talented people in a number of bands, boy haven’t I forged a lot of great lifelong bonds with some real characters.“ -Tony
I enjoy playing with other musicians as well Tony, but the opportunities are few and far between. I was being a bit facetious in my earlier post.
Playing in church or a CCC cocktail lounge, with BIAB backup, I have never once been accused of cheating. If anyone asks I say it was, “Pre-recorded”, which some of the guitar parts were actually pre-recorded by me.
Last edited by AlastairLC; 09/14/18 10:23 AM.
Cheers! -Alastair
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,753
Expert
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Joined: Mar 2004
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Since my last post in this thread over a year ago I have progressed (sarcasm) to not using backing tracks for almost a year now. It's just my voice, acoustic guitar, tambourine under my right foot and a microphone stuffed in a brief case with lots of padding inside under my left foot for a kick/bass drum sound. I do play both feet at the same time now and have even worked out a few various patterns for different songs. I mostly sing at restaurants and often enough there are people dancing for at least a few songs even though it's dinner hours. My acoustic guitar sound is very janglie when strumming with sufficient bass on the two low strings. For most songs I've worked on my right hand technique to simulate what a bass player would do while still strumming the rhythm. I guess I'll call it Travis Strumming. At times I miss having tracks because I have to avoid "void soloing" but I am getting better at chord soloing to make up the difference. Some have said I don't need the backing tracks. Others have said I'm better without them. No one has ever suggested I should go back to using tracks or that I should have tracks or try using them or anything like that.
But, I'm always considering putting basic drum patterns on a Beat Buddy just for drums alone. I don't think I would even use the Beat Buddy to it's full purpose. Just way to use my feet to start and stop simple patterns that I play along with using my foot percussion.
Anyway, that's me at this point.
As far as cheating goes. Getting Karaoke tracks for free from a download or a Karaoke Jockey buddy, setting yourself up with a small screen monitor and a PA system and performing like that. That's cheating. It's cheesy too. I've seen and heard it done. No matter how good the singer it's still cheating and I'll tell on you if I catch you doing it. We should have Entertainment Police we can call to have these people imprisoned. It's really bad.
Last edited by Tobias; 09/17/18 07:51 PM.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 144
Apprentice
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Apprentice
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 144 |
The value of backing tracks depends a lot on the type of performance. Someone singing and comping himself on guitar doesn’t need them. The melody and harmony are there (and some percussion if he gets his feet working). However, if someone is playing guitar instrumentally, as I do, either he’s a guitar virtuoso (which I’m not) or he needs some backup. Personally I’m not keen on guitar solos. I like to hear the piano, drums and bass in the background. As I play mostly jazz standards, that’s what works best, and the folks I play for prefer instrumentals to a singer as background music. When I play spiritual songs in church, a backing track of guitar and subtle bass works best. I either pre-record the guitar track myself, or if it’s just simple comping I let BIAB do it. I never use a BIAB guitar track that I’m not capable of doing myself. My audiences in both settings like it very much. No complaints yet!
Cheers! -Alastair
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 330
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 330 |
I agree with Alastair on this. I think the style of music has a lot to do with whether of not I would use backing tracks. I've been successfully gigging for years playing instrumental guitar along with my BIAB backing tracks. Especially in situations where "background music" is required, I can create a nice small band sound without being too loud. However, if i was to gig with my acoustic guitar and voice (finger picking folk, blues, country, etc.). I probably would not use tracks. My own style of singing is pretty laid back, and I don't want to be tied to a specific beat throughout a whole song.
But, I've also heard singers sound great using backing tracks.
"Different strokes for different folks".
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
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Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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