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OK....I'll try to make this as clear as I can.
Current Midi setup & modules patching to the Midisport 4x4:
Port 1: Roland JV30 (want to assign the JV880 module to this port)
Port 2: Roland MBD-1 Drum/Bass
Port 3: Roland MVS-1 Vintage Synth
Port 4: EMU Proteus FX
A music buddy sent me a Roland JV880 which I'd like to incorporate into the midi chain above.
I haven't used the JV30 patches in over ten years.
So...I'd like to assign the JV880 to Port 1 and just use the JV30 as a controller only for all (4) modules.
My confusion: if I replace the JV30 midi in/outs with the JV880 midi in/outs on the Midisport is it still possible to use the JV30 as a controller only when it's not patched to the Midisport itself?
I just can't wrap my neurons around how to route the controller into the chain so it all works while in Sonar X3.
Thanks to anyone who read this and any G2 is welcomed.
A good day to all.....
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Before I can make suggestions - why do you have each MIDI device on separate MidiSport ports?
Also I fairly certain the 4x4 doe NOT have a "merge" feature: i.e., when PC is off or not connected there is NOT WAY to route MIDI data from a controller, e.g., JV30 into the 4x4 and out to other devices - is there?
If the answer is NO you can not then maybe IF you put device THRU to next device IN then you could drive everything with the JV-30 even with MidiSport and PC off? You want to use the THUR's so you don't have to worry about control channels (as much)
THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE:
1. When connected to PC for Sonar (or other DAW use):
MIDIsport Port 1 -> JV-30 THUR out -> JV880 THRU out -> MVS-1 THRU out-> EMU Proteus FX THRU out -> MBD-1 Drum/Bass
2. When NOT connected to PC or the MIDISPORT is OFF:
MIDIsport Port 1 -> JV-30 OUT (not THRU) -> JV880 THRU out -> MVS-1 THRU out-> EMU Proteus FX THRU out -> MBD-1 Drum/Bass
Neither is NOT AN IDEAL path since there would some MIDI signal delay (3 to 5 ms per in to out) by time signal got from PC to last device of about 15ms - so putting drums last was a dumb example on my part - but you get the "picture"
You could LEAST used device at end
or you could get a MIDI Patchbay and then you can control anything with anything via a Patchbay Program ("patch") selection and then you really could use just a MIDI 1x1 to connect to PC
PC --> patch bay --> all, some, one (even with PC turned off)
Larry
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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Larry....
Thanks much for the time you took for these details.
Again....I didn't know if what I was asking was doable and even had difficulty explaining it clearly.
It appears from your details that it's actually not...especially given the latency using the 'thru' as an output.
I've used midi devices for a couple of decades and still my pea brain has a cloudy understanding of some of it.
I need to re-read your kind response more carefully.
Should I have success I'll update here.
Thanks again....
Last edited by chulaivet1966; 11/03/17 08:52 AM.
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Those delays are minor and vary a lot by DEVICE - some have very little some have a lot but remember anything under 8-9'ish ms you won't even notice and depending on what your use the last item FOR in a long chain like that, you may have no appreciable drawbacks, .e.g., if you used one of those sound modules for mainly pads or slow attack sounds anyway you'd never notice in actual use if it was last and other units before it had minimal delay in tote.
TRY it! Even with DRUM Module at end just to actually see how much delay you really do HAVE (is it noticeable). A drum beat e.g., Snare rim strick or bass drum hit is probably the best audible indicator of how much affect your chain really has at that point
You could play around with the order of your modules (with keyboard always being first) and see which unit has most noticeable delay and put it at END of chain like that.
=========
I have a lot o gear so I use a patch bay (actually two of them) one feeding the other. All "controllers" (4 keyboards and 2 MIDI guitar units and the PC attached to first patch bay and each can trigger the other via that patch bay and/or send MIDI to second patch bay to trigger none, one, some, all of the midi modules attached there and the second patch bay is the path back to the PC so I always have a MINIMUM of THREE MIDI devices in "chain" from PC to patch bay to one of the units to its patch bay then back to PC via second patch bay (again that's minimum for me) and in actual use I have never had a "timing" issue (that was appreciable).
Good Luck
Larry
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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I think the MVS-1 only uses 8 MIDI channels. If so I would daisy chain the JV-880 to the MVS-1. Assign MIDI channels 1-8 to the MVS-1 and channels 8-16 to the JV-880. If you need more than 8 channels for the 880 then this wouldn't work.
Ps - I have the 880 and it does have some decent sounds.
Dad, how will I know when I've become an adult.
When your day is ruined because they rearranged the grocery store.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Hey Mario.... Well.....the 880 was given to me by an old band member and even though it may be a bit redundant given what I already have I thought it would be worth some effort. I've listened to a few of the patches and I agree with your take. Got it....I saw the 880 only had 8 midi channels. Everything is unplugged and scattered everywhere right now. I'm currently re-arranging my setup as it needed a cleansing and face lift....similar to myself I might add. I still haven't caught the SOB who tangles all my patch cables when I'm not looking......hes' in deep mierda when I catch him!  Thanks for the tips.....
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Current Midi setup & modules patching to the Midisport 4x4:
Port 1: Roland JV30 (want to assign the JV880 module to this port)
Port 2: Roland MBD-1 Drum/Bass
Port 3: Roland MVS-1 Vintage Synth
Port 4: EMU Proteus FX
Nice, I still have my Proteus F/X too. One of my oldest pieces of gear. I still have an old Yamaha DX9 (even older) as it's controller.
 Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 4 TB M2 SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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You want to talk about old pieces of gear?
1-Yamaha TX81Z
2-Roland JV880
3-Roland M-SE1 string ensemble
4-Kawai Gmega
5-me
Dad, how will I know when I've become an adult.
When your day is ruined because they rearranged the grocery store.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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I just look at MVS-1 > It also has a THRU - so question me this, why would one need to pre-"assign" channels to either? Or am I being too literal do you simply mean as a mental day-to-day procedural "rule" for DAW & controller use of them kind of like "channel management" when building a sequence?
Because there is no reason in some songs you might not want to trigger BOTH at same time on same channel - but with different sounds or maybe even the same sound (layered, thicker, detuned-dual, ..) ?
Larry
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I just look at MVS-1 > It also has a THRU - so question me this, why would one need to pre-"assign" channels to either? Or am I being too literal do you simply mean as a mental day-to-day procedural "rule" for DAW & controller use of them kind of like "channel management" when building a sequence?
Because there is no reason in some songs you might not want to trigger BOTH at same time on same channel - but with different sounds or maybe even the same sound (layered, thicker, detuned-dual, ..) ?
Larry
Yes, for some songs you may not want to trigger both synths is one reason. The other is for program changes and numbers. For example if channel 1 on synth 1 is a piano and channel 1 on synth 2 is a double bass they will not sound good together, especially during chords. Note that many sounds are in ROM and can not be changed or moved. If one wants to detune sounds and/or layer them they will have to copy the MIDI track and assign each to the appropriate synth with the correct program changes. This is no different than have both synths connected separately and not daisy changed.
Dad, how will I know when I've become an adult.
When your day is ruined because they rearranged the grocery store.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Maybe I can join in on the old gear brag.
I have a Roland JV 1010 to go with my Ketron SD 2
The Roland might be old but it still has some amazing sounds.
The grand piano still sounds out of this world.
Bobby
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eddie1261
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It was always my practice to NEVER daisy chain. I always had a thru box. That delay from A to B to C to D may be slight, but by the time you add them up you may be at a very audible delay. I had a switchable thru box that allowed me to engage or disengage each slave as I needed or did not need them to play. Then I got a 2 in 8 out and I could also change masters, so if in "this" configuration I needed master 1 to control slave 2 and 3, and master 2 to control slave 1 and 4, I just had to flip some switches.
Lost in all those model numbers that mean nothing to me I couldn't tell if you have a thru box or not.
Last edited by eddie1261; 11/03/17 05:35 PM.
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Hi Eddie,
I don't daisy chain either now. That was just a suggestion for him to use with his current set up. Daisy chaining is an option that will work as I have done that in the past.
I have the MOTU MIDI Express 128 and a very old Nexus 3x8 MIDI switch:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/286754-REG/MOTU_4857_MIDI_Express_128.html?c3api=0980%2C%7Bcreative%7D
I have the Nexus out into the MIDI express 128 and I use it for MIDI devices that I plug in and out as needed. Everything plugged into the 128 is there permanently.
Dad, how will I know when I've become an adult.
When your day is ruined because they rearranged the grocery store.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Oldest "synth" gear I ever had, still have, is a GR-50. I got started late with these newfangled things called synths. In my rack now I have two JL Cooper MSB Rev2 8X8 patch bays and to/from PC a generic Chinese 4x4 USB (I think I paid $40'ish - cheaper than a MIDISport 4x4 - only "hassel" is two I/O's on front and two on back - I only use two to PC, so I use the ones on back leaves front open for "new toy" checkouts) https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00VHL5HOA/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1(I see they went up ~ $10) re: chaining: Agreed I haven't chained since "early" days when I only had 3-4 MIDI units but I went to patch bays for better routing and real-time configuration control (no plugging and unplugging) more than any real delay issues, UNTIL I added a Alesis D4, which had (has) a combined Out/Thru, that caused me headaches until I went to patch bays. Remember even the "high priced spread" patch bays, like a MOTU, adds some delay, small but not zero! Worst offenders for MIDI delay (talking from "in to out") are devices using COMBINED OUT/THUR because of the SW switching required(el cheapo mfg's saving a few bucks for on an extra 5-pin plug and some broad traces) Larry
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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