I often read posts on the BIAB forums complaining about this or that. The software does not perform the way my thoughts perform. It gets to the stage where I think why would I bother with this stuff but, in reality it is not at all that way.
If something does not do what I want, then, what do I want. Two days ago I did a song the bass was not what I wanted (and using BIAB by itself never going to be.) I then used Amplesound Precision Bass to layer up the bass. (Created in Cakewalk and rendered)
Then I went back to BIAB and generated another 16 bars of drum fills (yep blue to blue, then green to green, then green to blue and blue to green and then some.)
I then pulled all the parts into a Reaper where I chopped, channeled and sculpted my way to a track that I thought worked. The next day got up listened again and in the clear light of day and thought I should chop out some parts to make dancing easier (for a concert I prefer what I had but for dancing the bar count was not as good as it should be.)
Now I have a song I’m proud of. Very simple olde style rock and roll. Did it happen out of the box? No. But, I learnt many years ago songs rarely work out on first attempts.
With the history of the song above it only took a short time to generate another song similar tempo and feel, different chords and key. But much of what I spent my time on could be reused.
Just a thought from a tired old wasted musician.
Tony
HP i7-4770 16GB 1TB SSD, Win 10 Home, Focusrite 2i2 3rd Gen, Launchkey 61, Maton CW80, Telecaster, Ovation Elite TX, Yamaha Pacifica 612 BB 2022(912) RB 2022(2), CakeWalk, Reaper 6, Audacity, Melodyne 5 Editor, Izotope Music Production Suite 4.1
Tony I think that is one of the best post I have read in a while. I often think when reading through threads here I remember when I was little I would complain about my food , maybe that the meat was cut up in big chucks, and I wanted smaller ones. Well my mom would say “do you want me to chew it for you too?” In other words fix it yourself.
You see people complaining (I have been guilty as well) that the program does not do exactly what they want or they want to do everything inside one program, or what if it did this or that! Just 60 years ago the folks had to play everything live and 4 track recording was a huge deal. What’s next a computer program where we type in the basic instructions, I want a modern country ballad with a fiddle lead, and it does everything else. It writes the lyrics, chooses the chords and melody, records all the tracks, even vocals, then mixes and masters and distributes and collects the money. All while we sit back and say “see what I created!” Heck BiaB almost does that now.
The other day I was working on a song idea and kind of fussing over the multiriff lead section I had generated. I was thinking this thing is kind of chopped up and doesn’t flow smoothly. I had sent it into Studio one and set up the 7 riffs as layers and comped them till it was close, but it still didn’t seem to flow it seemed like separate little sections that didn’t fully connect together properly. So I opened the comped track in Melodyne heck I didn’t even have to open it and wait for it to load like before I just right clicked the track and chose apply Melodyne. Grabbed a few of the little audio blobs and drug them longer, closing the gaps in a few places and slid one blob up a step or three and boom it sounded like a coherent smooth lead track. I thought hey I can really shred, well my computer can.
If we want our project to really sound great and be what WE want it takes some time and hard work. We might have to actually play a track or two, or use other resources to get that perfect baseline, or drum track.
Anyway just some musing from another tired old dude!
Last edited by Rob Helms; 01/30/2002:24 AM.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
For me, BIAB is a tool. If I find myself in a situation, that I would like it to do something and BIAB doesn't seem to do it, I immediately start thinking about "what I have" from BIAB and "what I want" that to become. I then start trying to work out how I might massage the first so that it becomes the second. There's usually a way!
Recently, I wrote a song and I wanted to have more control over the bass. With BIAB's rendered track, I could use either Melodyne in Reaper or I could use the Reaper plugins: Reatune, ReaVoice or ReaPitch.
Alternative, I could take the Bass's notation from BIAB as a MIDI file and then load the MIDI into Reaper and, with a suitable soundfont, or 'Jazz and Big Band 3' (or some other synth) the bass could be generated.
Finally, another option was to create loops of BIAB bass notes for each of the chords and riffs an then use those to give me what I wanted. Loops can be created in BIAB, Realband and Reaper.
I tried the various options on short segments of the bass line to see which one was best for me in my situation. It was fun to play around.
I don't know if this is sufficiently diverse enough to be described as...
...but it's fun to stretch the brain cells -- well what's left of them anyway
Just my 2 cents worth. Noel
P.S I read today that it seems that drinking tea can help stave off dementia. The statistics are amazing.
Tony I think that is one of the best post I have read in a while. I often think when reading through threads here I remember when I was little I would complain about my food , maybe that the meat was cut up in big chucks, and I wanted smaller ones. Well my mom would say “do you want me to chew it for you too?” In other words fix it yourself.
You see people complaining (I have been guilty as well) that the program does not do exactly what they want or they want to do everything inside one program, or what if it did this or that! Just 60 years ago the folks had to play everything live and 4 track recording was a huge deal.
I can very well remember plugging my “crystal mic” yep crystal (for those under 65 it was a little tube with chunks of carbon with a diaphragm at the end the same as the telephone transmitter). Into my amp. The lead singer also plugged into my amp he was my brother and bigger than me. And we thought we had technology beat. Over the screeches you almost heard the singing (ahh!!! We were made)
I’ll repeat, we are only restricted by our own imagination. (I even managed to get squeaks out of an 8086 if you can remember that far back.)
Tony
HP i7-4770 16GB 1TB SSD, Win 10 Home, Focusrite 2i2 3rd Gen, Launchkey 61, Maton CW80, Telecaster, Ovation Elite TX, Yamaha Pacifica 612 BB 2022(912) RB 2022(2), CakeWalk, Reaper 6, Audacity, Melodyne 5 Editor, Izotope Music Production Suite 4.1
Trevor, I would hate to see that thing crawling across the floor toward me.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
I remember my first recording setup a clarion 4 track cassette. Man I thought that thing was the snizzle!
Last edited by Rob Helms; 01/30/2003:11 AM.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
From our earliest explorations of RTs and RDs we’ve felt the simple fact that they can be regenerated (with different results) begs for DAW comping (cut/paste). Comping at the bar or even note level yields tracks that are much more supportive of one another and particularly the vocals. The possibilities are literally limitless...and it’s fun.
J&B
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos are here on our website.
Band-in-a-Box is a tool kit. You can't expect tools to do the work for you, but if you learn how to use the tools, you can do quite a bit with the BiaB tool kit.
But like any tool, you have to know it's advantages, it's limititations, how to use it, and use it for what it is best designed for.
Band-in-a-Box is a tool kit. You can't expect tools to do the work for you, but if you learn how to use the tools, you can do quite a bit with the BiaB tool kit.
But like any tool, you have to know it's advantages, it's limititations, how to use it, and use it for what it is best designed for.
Insights and incites by Notes
Yeah what he said!
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
Band-in-a-Box is a tool kit. You can't expect tools to do the work for you, but if you learn how to use the tools, you can do quite a bit with the BiaB tool kit.
But like any tool, you have to know it's advantages, it's limititations, how to use it, and use it for what it is best designed for.
Insights and incites by Notes
Yeah what he said!
Ditto!
I get most of my exercise these days from shaking my head in disbelief.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
There are limits to what BIAB can do. That being said those limitations typically have more to do with the creativity of the user than the tool itself.
If someone ONLY relies on the sounds in a specific style; and only uses whatever the first generation of that style would be...that's not the programs fault. It's like placing your finger on the C key on a piano, repeatedly only striking that note and complaining the piano doesn't do enough.
Then you have the person who not only plays the additional notes on the keyboard; but goes into the piano and starts plucking the strings, tapping on various part of the body, and/or adds distortion to get all sorts of sounds you wouldn't traditionally think of.
The same instrument different people. Such is BIAB.
The showcase has many examples of what is possible with creativity. It's impressive, IMO. If you aren't getting it to do what you want, don't blame. Learn. That's why I'm here. lol
Thanks for the topic Teunis!
(using text to speech so there may be errors.)
Last edited by HearToLearn; 01/30/2007:05 AM.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
Noel96, some people do not realise that in Reaper to alter the pitch of a note is extremely easy. Select the note and (off memory) shift 9 or shift 0 for a semitone you can find it in the Actions List. Shift 7 and 8 for a cent. This assumes that the Reaper Shortcut Key settings have not been altered in the Action List but just search for pitch in the action list. I find this quicker than going back to BIAB in case of a key change to the whole song. Or indeed quicker and simpler than going into Melodyne for a few notes. After all it is possible to do this on the fly.
It is also very simple to move notes. The stretching I don’t like that much as it is very easy to get unwanted artefacts.
I write this because some folks are unaware that these tasks are very simple in Reaper.
Of course if you are changing one note within a chord the Melodyne it is.
Tony
Last edited by Teunis; 01/30/2012:53 PM.
HP i7-4770 16GB 1TB SSD, Win 10 Home, Focusrite 2i2 3rd Gen, Launchkey 61, Maton CW80, Telecaster, Ovation Elite TX, Yamaha Pacifica 612 BB 2022(912) RB 2022(2), CakeWalk, Reaper 6, Audacity, Melodyne 5 Editor, Izotope Music Production Suite 4.1
Great points all. BIAB is intelligent, but it doesn't read minds. It delivers fantastic parts and ideas, but it remains to the "bandleader" (you and me) to choose how to use them, and to learn how that might be done.
The only thing I pretty much do every time religiously is make a copy of the song-file (as easy in Windows as copy/paste in the same folder) and either 1. Add extensions and/or slash chords. 2. Add new instruments/real tracks, midi, drums. 3. Create new sections, such as intros, endings, true change-up bridges, and/or short rhythmical passages.
Then loading all to DAW in such a way that working with all those tracks is not too cumbersome, putting on the "producer" hat, and building the song. Cut, paste, move, pitch-shift, whatever to get where you want to go.
Fortunately for me, I am just the band-leader, not the BAND. BIAB delivers not just tracks, but IDEAS. Listen to the band.
I don't really enjoy "mixing", but I do very much enjoy "producing". In truth, I'm already "producing" even while I'm in BIAB...thinking about making that call to the Sax player in RT whatever, or how to best utilize what the Band is giving me.
XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.
What are XPro Styles and Xtra Styles PAKs?
XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!
Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!
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Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Get Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 19 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!
Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:
Purchase your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac during our special to save up to 50% off your upgrade purchase and receive a FREE BONUS PAK of amazing new Add-ons. These include the 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK, Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana, Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes, MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano, Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7, Playable RealTracks Set 4, RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark, and more!
Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
Playable RealTracks Set 4
RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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