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I am trying to find a source for quality midi sounds. I have the forte application in real band. Those are pretty good but not totally convincing.
All I’m doing is using BIAB to create the background. I’m playing some instruments livr. The melody or a solo is often supplied by a midi Source.
It is that Source that I’m trying to develop into a more quality sound.
I see all kinds of packages online but I don’t know which one to select nor do I know how much horsepower they demand from a processor.
Any suggestions?
Thanks.
Michael
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core Processor. 3.79 GHZ; RAM = 32.00 GB; 64 Bit Operating System; Windows 10; Focusrite 8i18 External Card; Real Band; Band in a Box; Coyote Forte Wave Table; Oxygen 49 MIDI Controller
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I downloaded Kontact Player and some free library How do you use in Real Band?
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core Processor. 3.79 GHZ; RAM = 32.00 GB; 64 Bit Operating System; Windows 10; Focusrite 8i18 External Card; Real Band; Band in a Box; Coyote Forte Wave Table; Oxygen 49 MIDI Controller
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The same as any other DAW, you assign the Kontakt VSTi to each MIDI track you want to use the Kontakt player on. Sounds (no pun) like you are new to MIDI, DAW's and VSTi's? Try watching this youtube all the way and don’t get flustered other him using Abelton and not Realband - a MIDI track is still a MIDI track https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zFecOaD4CULarry
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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Well I tried that as you said. I picked Kontact.
It shows in the midi track.
I selected an instrument that is in the library package which was a muted trumpet.
When I try to play the track the view meter for the midi shows that there’s signal but I can’t hear anything. What am I doing wrong?
Thanks.
Michael
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core Processor. 3.79 GHZ; RAM = 32.00 GB; 64 Bit Operating System; Windows 10; Focusrite 8i18 External Card; Real Band; Band in a Box; Coyote Forte Wave Table; Oxygen 49 MIDI Controller
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Are we talking RealBand or BIAB? I'll assume RealBand. I'll also assume you have your AUDIO set up properly so when RealBand actually has audio it can be heard (when there is audio)
When you are playing a song in RB and you see the VU meters for that MIDI track moving do you ALSO see the VU meters in the Kontakt Player moving for that instrument? If not then the MIDI data is not being HEARD by Kontakt. RB and Kontakt are not on same channel, or same port, or both. Try setting Kontakt channel to OMNI to see if its getting ANY MIDI data in at all
If not try this maybe you haven't told RB which DEVICE to send MIDI data to. A couple ways to get to same effective place depending on HOW you set Kontakt to the track:
1) In RB Preferences, MIDI Devices have you checked the box next to:
"Re-Route MIDI playback to default DXi/VSTi synth"
and then below that selected Kontakt as your default DXi/VSTi? If not you may have to reload the SONG (then it should all work)
or
2) more simply right click on track in RB, then specify which VSTi by selecting: "Specific VSTi/DXi synth for MIDI track"
then scroll down to Kontakt VSTi
Now open the Kontakt Player GUI by again right clicking on track and coming down to (again verify RB sending and Kontakt receiving channels): "Open VSTi/DXisynth panel configuration"
Larry
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Is what you say required to use MMA, or can you use ASIO?
For some reason mine seems to work better in ASIO or at least better than MME. Actually either doesn’t work well at all but that’s another story.
So anyway, Which should I use for your fix?
Thanks.
Michael
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core Processor. 3.79 GHZ; RAM = 32.00 GB; 64 Bit Operating System; Windows 10; Focusrite 8i18 External Card; Real Band; Band in a Box; Coyote Forte Wave Table; Oxygen 49 MIDI Controller
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There was no "fix" I was just explaining a few ways to make sound with MIDI using RB and Kontakt. ASIO or MMA are immaterial to your current MIDI problem. ASIO, MMA, WDM are just different AUDIO drivers (they have nothing to do with MIDI) those drivers are what the PC uses to allow you to HEAR the audio (more complex than that - but for now lets stick to one "problem" area at a time. Although if you you really want more info on AUDIO MMA, WDM, ASIO differences: https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/roland-difference-between-asio-wdm-mme-drivers/Your current "problem" is, with very high probability, a lack of proper MIDI routing and MIDI configuration from RB into Kontakt to allow it to trigger ANY AUDIO driver, irrespective of whether it is MMA, WDM or ASIO. Lets go back to basics and verify pure AUDIO first - without confusing it with MIDI troubleshooting. Find a BIAB or RB song and make sure it has at least one AUDIO track, don't worry about any MIDI tracks it might or might not have, then make sure you can play the song from within RB and hear audio with at least one of your AUDIO drivers, then leave the audio settings alone for now until you get your MIDI configured properly. BTW did you watch that video I linked to previously?? if not watch it end-to-end a few times until you UNDERSTAND what's being explained with respect to MIDI, MIDI data, MIDI channels, MIDI routing, etc. Larry
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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HI If you are going to have ago at Kontakt in realband. You may find my post below useful Some of it may seem a bit heavy at the moment. But it should help with assigning kontakt , to multiple tracks in realband. Don worry to much a about multi voiced instanes of kontakt (Multi) these are a bit more tricky. Fine tuning the Realband’s handling of Midi and Vst plug ins in tracks.https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=63093&Number=421946#Post421946Have fun Mike
BIAB2021 UltraPlus,AsusN55S1Tbssd, W10/64,Akai EIEpro Yamaha CVP405,SquireStrat, CoolsoftVMidSynth Novatation Impulse61 Ctr kbd, Cwalk blab Kontakt http://mikesmusic.byethost16.com/
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Thanks for the reply.
I understand that some things are on the midi side and some things on the output side. However to a new user not everything in that vein is apparent.
For example in Kontact you have a bunch of drop-down menus that ask for specific parameters. Are those on the input side? Are they on the output side? None of that’s obvious just by looking at.
As far as pure audio is concerned, RB is recording and playing back fine. So I don’t think that would be the issue.
I did watch the introductory video about Midi and yes it was very informative. A lot of the commentary, necessarily had to do with the specific devices and applications the presenter was using. So while the education was informative, it is hard to transfer the information to completely different applications and devices.
I think a lot of the problem stems from the fact that there are duplicative items across the applications which makes it confusing. For example say you have a midi track that is labeled piano. If you open the parameters for that track you’ll see that the piano patch is selected. You will see that it is assigned to particular channel. Then if you look in Kontact you see that there are channel references there also. Obviously too there are patches listed there. So which parameters control by? The ones in real band ? The one in Kontact? Do you select a patch in real band? Do you select a patch in contact? Do you select the patches in both? Do the channels have to be designated in both applications?
Concluding, things may be very obvious when you are just using real band. But when you are using a program within a program it’s difficult to figure out whether one is controlling or whether both are controlling, whether both have to match etc.
Last edited by goofeyfoot; 04/03/20 04:04 AM.
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core Processor. 3.79 GHZ; RAM = 32.00 GB; 64 Bit Operating System; Windows 10; Focusrite 8i18 External Card; Real Band; Band in a Box; Coyote Forte Wave Table; Oxygen 49 MIDI Controller
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Many plugins have many settings. In the case of Kontakt various libraries have different knobs and choices. A lot of VSTs have heaps of settings, there is not one size to any of them.
Unfortunately one really cannot learn this stuff overnight nor can one learn it from the top down. It is important to go through the basics to get the best out of the tools available. There is no one answer to all of this.
Having said that there are many good resources out there. In my opinion one of the best places to go is Groove3.com. At US$15 a month which is cheap and some of the best money you’ll spend. There is enough training to keep you occupied for years. Groove3 covers every aspect of music production from setting up your PC, to DAWs, plugins. production, how to record, mix and master. Even music theory and books on songs. Most manufactures and many, many tools are covered.
My suggestion to you is to got to Groove3.com sign up for a month and see how you like it. Nearly all your questions will be answered in one place.
My thoughts
Tony
Keep safe all
Last edited by Teunis; 04/03/20 10:47 AM.
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Probably a good idea because there’s no introductory way to get into all the stuff. It’s not like there’s a learning mode for everything or something like that.
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Probably a good idea because there’s no introductory way to get into all the stuff. It’s not like there’s a learning mode for everything or something like that. There is a lot of free information on the Internet. Google/Bing one or more of the following: Intro to MIDI MIDI basic Using MIDI
My boss calls me "the computer".
Nothing to do with intelligence. I go to sleep if left unattended for 15 minutes.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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After many years with BIAB and MIDI I finally realized that the only to way to get good midi quality and solve other problems like latency etc was to get a hardware synth (I use a Roland SD-50) Software synths just weren't worth the frustration. I also think the same about RT's - get a sound module (I use Focustrite), but that's another story.
Tony
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So do you think that instead of building a new computer a person should get a hardware syn?
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I think that you might find that a hardware synth is like many of the software based VSTI's mentioned above....the prices and quality vary greatly....from hundreds to thousands.
You can see from my "sig" below, I have a fairly robust computer that can handle multiple VSTis at once with little to no latency issues. But I have to be honest, 90% of the time I use my hardware based sounds from the Yamaha Motif and the Roland Fantom rack mount modules.
Both of these are "romplers" that is they have fixed sounds with little to no tweaking capabilties...the way they sound is the way they sound. And the sounds are fixed...that is you get what sounds they have, you can't add any more or new sounds. Still each has over 1000 sounds...plenty enough for me. And you never have to worry about computer resources, latency or any other computer issues as these are independent of the computer.
Overall, hardware based modules, compared to true synth keyboard synthesizers, seem to be a thing of the past. Very few new ones have been released in the last 10 years or so. My Motif XS rack was released some 10 years ago! But you can use a hardware based synth module with any kind of computer system...any version of Windoes, Mac, PC...doesn't matter...they never become obsolete. Heck the core of my system is based on a 35 year old DX7II keyboard I use as a mother board!
So to make a long story short, you can go the software based route from soundfonts to high end VSTi's or synth keyboards to modules. The choice and the cost is yours. I think in the end, as you continue your journey in this "hobby" you may find yourself like many of us...you'll end up with a combination of applications, hardware and software.
In looking back, some were good purchases and some...well not so much....but my hardware based modules have always stood the test of time and keep on giving.
Jeff
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2026, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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That is so interesting. On this end, I just bought all the parts for a new AMD 3900 computer. My existing computer was getting towards the end of it’s life anyway. I think I built about 15 years ago. So it doesn’t owe me anything.
Ultimately I think I’ll still use VST‘s for the moment. However I’m really curious about the hardware items. And being something of a hoarder, I expect I’ll have all of the above at some point!
Thanks for the insight. I’m learning something every day. The problem with all of this is that there’s no entry-level way to get into it. You’re in the deep end of the pool the minute you hit the water.
AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core Processor. 3.79 GHZ; RAM = 32.00 GB; 64 Bit Operating System; Windows 10; Focusrite 8i18 External Card; Real Band; Band in a Box; Coyote Forte Wave Table; Oxygen 49 MIDI Controller
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You’re in the deep end of the pool the minute you hit the water. I enjoyed your observation. The better you want your end result to be, the deeper you dive. We use hardware synths a lot here, FWIW Softsynth or Hardware; they are all tools in your tool belt. Both have trade offs, but we wouldn't be able to do what we do here without the hardware synths.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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You’re in the deep end of the pool the minute you hit the water. I enjoyed your observation. The better you want your end result to be, the deeper you dive. We use hardware synths a lot here, FWIW Softsynth or Hardware; they are all tools in your tool belt. Both have trade offs, but we wouldn't be able to do what we do here without the hardware synths. Rharv is right. The more you want a better MIDI sound the more you have to dig into MIDI controls. With a working knowledge of MIDI controls a fair sounding synth can be made into an good sounding synth. On he other hand a very expensive synth playing BiaB MIDI tracks as is may sound bland. Different strokes for different folks; I have a few hardware synths but I use virtually all soft synths. My advice is don't go out and purchase a lot of soft synths or hardware synths. Take the SFZ program, or any soft synth that you have, and learn some MIDI controls. Once you have a handle on that then consider purchasing something more expensive. YMMV
Last edited by MarioD; 04/06/20 02:26 PM.
My boss calls me "the computer".
Nothing to do with intelligence. I go to sleep if left unattended for 15 minutes.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
- Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
- RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
- SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
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