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Yeah, I know I am going to stir the pot here again. I am a believer that song lyrics should be copyrighted, but, I dont think melodies should be. Take tunes out of the copyright equation and we would have real original music all over the place again on radio. Just my 2 bits and I am sure I am in the minority here. Cliff
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Yep would make a very interesting world indeed 1000 songs different lyrics, but same melody. Think of all the time you would save playing an instrument just know the one melody and when people hear it, they could immediately try to guess what song it is from the 100's with the same melody but different lyrics. 
Last edited by musiclover; 11/10/20 07:55 AM.
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True, but, many songs are that way now, country songs of the 40's and 50's were notorious for that and no one listening seemed to mind, because, the songs became different themes, same tune.
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Most songs would not be completely copied even with no copyright, just parts pieced together much like now.
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With so few ways for composers to make a living now, you would remove one?
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At one time, composers and producers were not nearly as obsessed with copyright as we are now. Heck, orchestral music has places having whole lines copied and thought of as paying tribute -- sometimes twice or three times in a symphony.
A lot of water under the bridge between then and now. I've heard of suits where the plaintiff's case was based on "sounds too much like." The upside of that is most of the songs heard on the radio today, we don't even want to sound like.
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And if radio airplay is the goal, that’s one sure way the composers don’t get paid (in the USA, anyway). Someone else is making the money.
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Why would the melody be less copyrightable than the lyrics?
I think that musically, the melody is even more important than the lyrics.
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Why would the melody be less copyrightable than the lyrics?
I think that musically, the melody is even more important than the lyrics. Exactly! What about instrumentals? They should not be copyrighted? Lyrics without a melody is called a poem isn't it?
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I'm struggling to figure out how that would work with someone like (for instance) James Taylor, who writes both. So he would copyright his lyric but not his music?
Sorry, that makes zero sense to me.
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This subject shows that inconsistencies abound. Lyrics and music can be copyrighted but chord progressions can not. Terrestrial radio pays no royalties but satellite does (a pittance, but something).
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Surely lyrics without music are just poems?
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Terrestrial radio absolutely pays royalties to songwriters. That's where the big BMI/ASCAP checks come from.
What they DON'T do is pay the artist/record label a royalty, as is paid in most other countries. That's commonly called a "performance in a sound recording" royalty, and it's a non-starter in DC. I don't expect that to change anytime soon.
Last edited by Roger Brown; 11/11/20 06:31 AM.
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Somehow the O/P's suggestion suggests that a composer can write a melody and anyone can use it freely by just adding their own the words? No. I don't think so. This has happened in the music business before and it has been problematic (think litigation). Even people have innocently used small riffs from children's songs written decades ago, and been sued, years later. Think 'Down Under', written in 1980. Ten years after the 'Down Under' song was written, someone subsequently purchased the rights to another song, which was composed in 1932. Twenty-seven years later the connection to a small riff contained in 'Down Under' was discovered in an answer to a question on a musical quiz program, and the songwriters to 'Down Under' were subsequently sued. The outcome of the litigation actually resulted in a wonderful, talented musician eventually taking his own life. So it's hard enough for composers to remain independent, because someone will crawl out of the woodwork to get you - given a chance. Protection for composers is important. Don't give anyone an opportunity to take advantage. I wouldn't go there, ever.
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Interesting topic for discussion - I do think the whole copyright thing has gotten a bit out of hand. I've heard of the side-by-sides of cases and fail to hear it. When you start suing over a song's groove and feel...really?
Cheers,
Deryk
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Yeah, I know I am going to stir the pot here again. I am a believer that song lyrics should be copyrighted, but, I dont think melodies should be. Take tunes out of the copyright equation and we would have real original music all over the place again on radio. Just my 2 bits and I am sure I am in the minority here. Cliff Well.... without going off the deep end.... It doesn't matter what anyone "believes" to be the case.... there are laws that supersede those "beliefs". The more appropriate question would be ...Do you subscribe to your own beliefs? Do you place your music into the public domain from the very start? Personally, I don't copyright the songs and cues I write. No one is out there waiting for me to write something and steal it. It is, however, still protected by the copyright laws of the USA.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Yeah, I know I am going to stir the pot here again. I am a believer that song lyrics should be copyrighted, but, I dont think melodies should be. Take tunes out of the copyright equation and we would have real original music all over the place again on radio. Just my 2 bits and I am sure I am in the minority here. Cliff Well.... without going off the deep end.... It doesn't matter what anyone "believes" to be the case.... there are laws that supersede those "beliefs". The more appropriate question would be ...Do you subscribe to your own beliefs? Do you place your music into the public domain from the very start? Personally, I don't copyright the songs and cues I write. No one is out there waiting for me to write something and steal it. It is, however, still protected by the copyright laws of the USA. Well, nothing I have ever written as far as the tune goes is a problem with me for someone else to use. The lyrics a different matter. Most blues songs have pretty much the same tune, that 's why we love to jam them. I feel sure most of my tunes are peices of something I have heard before, nothing brand new. I still think a song should be copyrighted, just not sure the tune should be held as original work.
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A "song" is music. Tune, melody - semantics really. As others have said, lyrics without music isn't a song, it's a lyric or a poem.
I do believe that infringement cases have gotten out of hand, and I absolutely do not subscribe to the notion that chord progessions or rhythmic 'feels' should be covered under copyright law, but the melody is absolutely something that should be copyrighted, and infringements on them should be protected.
As for blues, a great deal of it is in the public domain, and is fair game (for good or for bad).
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A song is an entity. It's a bit like a marriage in that way. Doubt it?
Listen to an instrumental version of "Yesterday" and tell me it's not an instrumental version of A SONG. The song is "Yesterday". Arrange it differently, reharmonize it, slow it down, speed it up, embellish the melody--it remains "Yesterday".
In addition, print the lyric out, and it is the LYRIC of "Yesterday".
It isn't the lyric, and it isn't the tune that wholly makes the song "Yesterday". It simply IS "Yesterday". And that song is what is protected under copyright, such as it is.
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Yeah, I know I am going to stir the pot here again. I am a believer that song lyrics should be copyrighted, but, I dont think melodies should be. Take tunes out of the copyright equation and we would have real original music all over the place again on radio. Just my 2 bits and I am sure I am in the minority here. Cliff Well.... without going off the deep end.... It doesn't matter what anyone "believes" to be the case.... there are laws that supersede those "beliefs". The more appropriate question would be ...Do you subscribe to your own beliefs? Do you place your music into the public domain from the very start? Personally, I don't copyright the songs and cues I write. No one is out there waiting for me to write something and steal it. It is, however, still protected by the copyright laws of the USA. Yes you are right. As soon as you create a new piece of music the copyright is established. Whether you register it or not is up to you. The US Govt. charges way to much for us "normal" people to pay for every piece we create but it does not stop the law from protecting it. Just makes it harder to prove if we had to. Not that anybody is stealing anything I write either.
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
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Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
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XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!
Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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