Try this and let BIAB do the transition for you by using the Song Medley Feature.
Tools| Song Form| Medley Maker
To make this work, you will need to save up to three versions of your project because Medley Maker will not start a Medley in 3/4 time So... for saved version 1
Select any RealStyle that's swing 8, 4/4 at 90 bpm and key signature A Save As - Silver Bells_4-4
From the original version of Silver Bells that you posted on line, Save As - Silver bells_A
The third song you'll likely have to experiment to make it sound to satisfaction because there are different ways to program the Medley Maker.
The options I see are:
Select the Silver Bells_A again and set your beginning bar at 53 and see if the Medley Maker plays the proper B Listen to the song in both keys, A and B and compare the results or Save As Silver Bells_B after transposing the original Chord Chart to B and change Bars 53 forward without the modulation
_____ For the first song, select beginning bar at 1 for two bars and no transition The second song is Silver Bells_A beginning at bar 1 for 51 bars and 1 transition The third song is Silver Bells _B in the key of B beginning at bar 53 for 36 bars and no transition ______
Once you generate the Medley Maker, it will create a new Chord Sheet composed of the Three songs as you've programed them. Bar 54 should be your 1 bar transition. Edit the transition bar to the held F3...
In testing, I also edited the 4/4 first two Bars to having only an A. Chord and only the drums generated to make editing out those two bars easier. I've included a screen shot of my Medley Maker settings.
_____
Sometimes you can achieve the desired results and have BIAB perform with different songs (or different versions and sections of the same song ) something BIAB can't accomplish within a single project. I hope this helps you get the results you're looking for even though you may have to experiment a bit. Good luck.
I appreciate the input and I will try the things Ian and Charlie suggested.
That said, I simply can't believe that a program designed to generate music based on the chords you enter has a hard time not applying 7th's when you ask it to. If I enter A - D - E, I expect A - D - E, not A - D7 - E9. Even when forced to ignore 7th's (that were never entered in the first place) it still adds it.
The issue isn't the SWABBIE style. It's doing it with every style I have tried with the exception of straight midi. But I didn't pay $500 dollars to generate terrible sounding generic midi ...
...If I enter A - D - E, I expect A - D - E, not A - D7 - E9. Even when forced to ignore 7th's (that were never entered in the first place) it still adds it.
The issue isn't the SWABBIE style. It's doing it with every style I have tried with the exception of straight midi. But I didn't pay $500 dollars to generate terrible sounding generic midi ...
I hear your frustration, and I'm not sure if you tried this setting (I'm also not sure how well this works with RealTracks). Page 473 of the manual states: ’Jazz Down’ The chords This will “Jazz Down” the chords by changing chords with 7ths (e.g. C7) to triads (e.g. C) and 9ths and 13ths to 7th chords. Song embellishment is turned off. Press [OK – Jazz Down] to proceed
Last edited by VideoTrack; 01/18/2109:51 AM.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
I hear your frustration, and I'm not sure if you tried this setting (I'm also not sure how well this works with RealTracks). Page 473 of the manual states: ’Jazz Down’ The chords This will “Jazz Down” the chords by changing chords with 7ths (e.g. C7) to triads (e.g. C) and 9ths and 13ths to 7th chords. Song embellishment is turned off. Press [OK – Jazz Down] to proceed
I just tried it and it really confused BiaB. It made it worse. fwiw, I posted the files I'm working with in an earlier post in this thread. Anyone can download them and try the suggestions here and verify it's not just on my system.
Just an update. Still no word from support. Looks like I'm SOL.
I see I can deactivate my license. If I do that can I sell it to someone else who does a different style that wouldn't run in to this so I can cut my losses?
I wonder if Notes Norton or anyone who works with Styles can help here? I haven't done it, but don't the styles get written with C7 as the 'mask', and can that mask omit the seventh?
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
The reason that this is happening is a combination of these two things (A) Band-in-a-Box generates the file based on the original key of your song. (B) RealTracks artists play what is natural for them to play for a chord in that style of music, so seeing a B chord in the key of A, many RealTracks will play the b7.
It would definitely be a desirable feature for it to be able to follow key changes within the song for RT generation. Another useful feature would be an F5 bar setting to treat major/minor as I chord and/or the ability to force the chord to a triad. These features currently aren't present.
One solution that you might find acceptable is to change your B chord to "B2" or Badd2, and that would force it to not play the 7.
If you don't like the B2 chord, then a slightly more complicated solution is to: 1. Set your song to Key 1 and generate. Freeze track and mute it during Key 2. 2. Set your song to Key 2, add the RT to a second track, and generate. Mute it during Key 1.
This would work best if there is only one or two RT's that are playing the b7, since you'll need an extra track for each of them.
The reason that this is happening is a combination of these two things (A) Band-in-a-Box generates the file based on the original key of your song. (B) RealTracks artists play what is natural for them to play for a chord in that style of music, so seeing a B chord in the key of A, many RealTracks will play the b7.
It would definitely be a desirable feature for it to be able to follow key changes within the song for RT generation. Another useful feature would be an F5 bar setting to treat major/minor as I chord and/or the ability to force the chord to a triad. These features currently aren't present.
One solution that you might find acceptable is to change your B chord to "B2" or Badd2, and that would force it to not play the 7.
If you don't like the B2 chord, then a slightly more complicated solution is to: 1. Set your song to Key 1 and generate. Freeze track and mute it during Key 2. 2. Set your song to Key 2, add the RT to a second track, and generate. Mute it during Key 1.
This would work best if there is only one or two RT's that are playing the b7, since you'll need an extra track for each of them.
I think for Andrew's slightly more complicated solution to work correctly you will also need to generate Key 2 (the B Chord) without the modulation applied since you're looking for the B and not the C# the modulation in Key 1 produces when transposed up to B.
<< This would work best if there is only one or two RT's that are playing the b7, since you'll need an extra track for each of them. >>
For this issue, I suggest using the unused Melodist Track and use the RealTrack Medley Feature to create a track to be used with Andrew's procedure as the Key 2 unmuted track. This allows all four instruments to play simultaneously and only occupies a single additional track while applying the Unmute at once. You can match the panning of the each instrument and also adjust each instruments level if necessary. In the BIAB Mixer, I reduced the Reverb level to balance between the Bass with no reverb and the two guitars that did have reverb.
I've attached a screen shot showing a mockup. If you open the image in another tab, you can zoom in for clarity.
I appreciate the input and I will try the things Ian and Charlie suggested.
That said, I simply can't believe that a program designed to generate music based on the chords you enter has a hard time not applying 7th's when you ask it to. If I enter A - D - E, I expect A - D - E, not A - D7 - E9. Even when forced to ignore 7th's (that were never entered in the first place) it still adds it.
The issue isn't the SWABBIE style. It's doing it with every style I have tried with the exception of straight midi. But I didn't pay $500 dollars to generate terrible sounding generic midi ...
MIDI can sound fantastic. It is what generates the audio not midi's fault. MIDI is used everyday in productions heard around the world. RealTracks are just that, real music played by real people, what is available is what was played by these real people, if they didn't play straight major chords in the track that is being used, it will never be able to play a straight major chord with no 7ths, 9ths etc.
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
Make sure when you are doing some of this troubleshooting and copying and pasting etc. that you freeze the tracks that are right. There was an earlier post that had success generating it in A, then changing it to B and generating it again and getting the right sounding chords. If you do this, freeze them and save them naming them so you can keep track of what you are doing, then put it all together in one song with the frozen key of B parts where you want them. Realband can simplify this process if you export all the tracks to realband and then just do some editing to get it the way you want it. Just takes some time is all. You can save as many copies of the song as you need to get what you want, just by renaming them.
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
How finished is your track if you forget the key change and stay in A for the bit you want to go into the key of B? is the structure complete?
I think one workaround that would work is to stay in A for the final chorus in BIAB and then open the file in RB. That way you will have all the chords and part markers.
Then select all tracks for the last bit where you want the key change except drums and pitch transpose 2 semitones up. I'm not sure but if you re-interpret the chords you might well get the chords in the new key. As the tracks won't regenerate you won't get 7ths.
I know you'll lose any frozen tracks as they would regenerate in RB (but not with 7ths!) but you can always export them from BIAB as wav files and pitch transpose the ends.
Regardless of the method you use it won't be ideal.
You can't say 'never' because although that's true now in BIAB, Melodyne can remove the sevenths from audio. It's just tedious work.
Never might have been too strong. But it appears for the tracks that he is using whoever played it used 7ths when they didn't "need" too so there may not be a plain old major chord to be found.
Thanks!
My wife asked if I had seen the dog bowl. I told her I didn't even know he could.
The reason that this is happening is a combination of these two things (A) Band-in-a-Box generates the file based on the original key of your song. (B) RealTracks artists play what is natural for them to play for a chord in that style of music, so seeing a B chord in the key of A, many RealTracks will play the b7.
So that must mean that changing the Key at a certain measure is broken too because it is a function of BiaB and I went in and adjusted it where the key changes and it had no effect.
I also tried the B2 chord like you said and unless I change every single one to a 2 they still play the 7th. Also, it happens with all styles that you try, not some, so it doesn't have anything to do with the samples used, it's how BiaB is manipulating them. There is something broken in regard to doing a key change with a rest using Real Tracks.
I still haven't heard back from tech support. Once I provided all the info they asked for it's been total silence. I appreciate the help here, but I paid a lot of money to use the Real Tracks and they don't work right no matter how I try to trick the program and I can't get any reply from support. I feel like I've been taken.
At this point I just want a refund because it's never going to work right. So please feel free to look up all my personal info in your system, tech support has it now, and contact me privately about a refund. And again, don't take my word for it. The songs are here for download, it takes 20 seconds for anyone to verify what I'm saying and to prove all the fixes people are suggesting don't work.
Just a quick post to say I am also not fond of Dominant 7th chords I still use midi styles quite a lot so it's a pain so many demo songs use these kinds of chords, often several different ones in a given song this is simply wrong for songs not in the Blues/Jazz vein I would like a fully active "Jazz Down" the chords edit function It's too much work to edit the 7th and derived chords when one tries to use a pop style
Last edited by Bernard Rasson; 01/31/2102:04 AM.
Bernard Rasson
BIAB Audiophile 2021, BIAB Megapak 2015 (for midi-only projects), Cakewalk, Roland XV-5080, Roland Fantom XR, Aria AC60 Nylon Strings Guitar, Almansa Spanish Guitar, Fender Stratocaster Japan, two laptops Je parle français
perhaps cosider placing your request in the Wishlist Section. The program developers may have a better opportunity to see and review it there.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
I fully agree with you on this issue, Shane "embellisment" is a PITA when not desired
I don't know what kind of music you are into as for myself I am into pop/rock of many, many artists
I have read hundreds of songs in songbooks when I played the guitar
David Bowie is one of the only artists I can think of that "gets it right" everytime when is is using special chords it never sounds "jazzy", it justs sounds like him
best regards, Bernard
Bernard Rasson
BIAB Audiophile 2021, BIAB Megapak 2015 (for midi-only projects), Cakewalk, Roland XV-5080, Roland Fantom XR, Aria AC60 Nylon Strings Guitar, Almansa Spanish Guitar, Fender Stratocaster Japan, two laptops Je parle français
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) something BIAB can't accomplish within a single project. I hope this helps you get the results you're looking for even though you may have to experiment a bit. Good luck.
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