|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,217
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,217 |
.
>>>....Most musicians who play fretted stringed instruments prefer TAB to standard notation...>>>
This is not true at all. I have been playing all my life and I do not use tab at all. Dozens of musicians of my acquantiance would say the same thing.
Tab is way to limited to be useful to me. It not allow for changing keys or even positions on the neck. It does not allow for playing the same tunes on guitar, banjo fiddle and mandolin, which I frequently do. At bottom, I am just not interested in learning to play the way another might do it. Tab just in not flexible enough.
I too am surprised to read that jazz guitarists use tab. Just does not fit with what I beleive jazz to be.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
Bob, has done a good job layng this topic out. Kudos to you guy.  To a jazz guiatrist it is all about voicings - so many way to play the same notes that if you want to communicate the "fingering" you have to show the Tablature (Tab). Of course the Tab does not show the note duration and many other musical itesm, so the standard notation is needed also. Then having an application which shows the animated fretboard display synched with the Tab is the cherry on the cake - if you are making a video. Don't understand the problem stated with Guitar Pro, this program does all this very nicely. I suspect there was a bit of a learning curve which had to be achieved.
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251 |
Whoa flatfoot,
I didn’t say ALL fretted stringed musicians. You are personifying what I said about “frequently maligned and often misunderstood “.
Since almost all TAB includes standard notation, everyone gets what they need to learn to play.
I also play several instruments, but I think harping against TAB is an elitist thing. Telling a budding musician that they have to learn an inferior method of notation, (std. notation), is the same as telling them they aren’t welcome to the “club” unless they learn to read it. (If you need clarification on “inferior”, just look at my post using a G scale as an example!)
I use both, but I think you’d be hard pressed to find a majority of any fretted stringed instrument musicians to say they prefer std. notation outside of classical or jazz. Why make learning an instrument any harder than it already is?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
Quote:
.
>>>....Most musicians who play fretted stringed instruments prefer TAB to standard notation...>>>
This is not true at all. I have been playing all my life and I do not use tab at all. Dozens of musicians of my acquantiance would say the same thing.
I too am surprised to read that jazz guitarists use tab. Just does not fit with what I beleive jazz to be.
Good points. There is actually a very funny video (can't find it now) of several recent (70's) Guitar Gods playing their licks. then the "...little numbers on the lines " are taken away and they can't play at all.
Then the famous joke; "How do you stop a horn player from playing?, - take away his sheet music". followed by "how to you stop a guitar player from playing?, - put the sheet music in front of him".
And finally, several years back I completed a certificate course in Jazz Guitar from Berklee School of Music - ~50 % of the course material was in Tab. 
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251 |
Dan, Quote:
Of course the Tab does not show the note duration
All the way through GP4, the TAB had note stems and values. When GP5 came out, they adopted what you see now. I had numerous email exchanges with the guys at Guitar Pro, and they promised me they would "fix" it in the next release. They didn't. Even tho I have GP5, I still use GP4. It's better in a whole host of ways.
Quote:
Bob, has done a good job layng this topic out. Kudos to you guy.
Thanks Dan. I appreciate that. I tried to be very thorough in that last explanation.
Last edited by bobcflatpicker; 07/22/11 03:09 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
Quote:
All the way through GP4, the TAB had note stems and values. When GP5 came out, they adopted what you see now. I had numerous email exchanges with the guys at Guitar Pro, and they promised me they would "fix" it in the next release. They didn't. Even tho I have GP5, I still use GP4. It's better in a whole host of ways.
.
I am working on GP v6 right now and have never seen note stems on TAB? Perhaps there is a button to push which I have never used? Otherwise, as you know, it is very common to lay out both Tab and Standard Notation together.
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251 |
Dan, Just look back at my post on the G scale, #325100. That's GP4 and you'll see the note stems. GP5 and GP6 don't have it. GP4 is also customizable on spacing between ....... , well, everything....  and font size of whatever you wish to change. GP5 and 6 aren't. I increase the spacing between the TAB lines and increase the font size of the numbers and make them bold. You can also turn off std. notation or TAB. Whichever you prefer. (In GP4).
Last edited by bobcflatpicker; 07/22/11 03:38 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251 |
flatfoot, Which one these better conveys to the student what they should play? The TAB or the std. notation?  (Note: I didn't "doctor" the std, notation. That's just the way it came out.) Dan, Take note, (pun intended), of the note stems on the TAB. That's GP4.
Last edited by bobcflatpicker; 07/22/11 04:27 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,151
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,151 |
No doubt about it, for the student, tab is the easiest and fastest way to convey to him what you want him to play. Many of the transcriptions I have are in tab. Easiest way to learn them. I like the the stems on the tabs, too. Never seen them before. Very cool.
That being said, I've never had a gig, and there have many over the years, where the MD gave me my part in tab, and if I had asked for it in tab, I suspect they would have gotten someone else. Now that's a completely different situation from practicing. It's work, and you're paid to play what the arranger's written.
But for the student, or someone who plays for his or her own enjoyment, or plays in a group where nobody reads, tab is the way to go, for sure. But at some point, if the student is serious about learning his instrument, he'll need to learn how to read.
And Dan, I know a few guitar players here who attended Berklee (I assume that's where you meant in your post) and they are excellent, I mean EXCELLENT readers. And the cats can blow. They never had tab when they attended back in the 70's. They had to learn how to read, or leave. It's different nowadays, and I mean that in a good way. The students learn faster. But believe me, before they graduate, they better know how to read.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 673
Journeyman
|
|
OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 673 |
Quote:
Bob, has done a good job layng this topic out. Kudos to you guy.
Yes he has!
Quote:
Don't understand the problem stated with Guitar Pro, this program does all this very nicely. I suspect there was a bit of a learning curve which had to be achieved.
I was hoping to be able to have a blank sheet of say 24 bars (no music in the bars) and then be able to take my chords that I created on the left side and drag them onto whatever beat in whatever bar I wanted.
I couldn't see a way to do that.
I also couldn't see a way to name the chords I created, using my own names.
BIABguy
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
Quote:
I was hoping to be able to have a blank sheet of say 24 bars (no music in the bars) and then be able to take my chords that I created on the left side and drag them onto whatever beat in whatever bar I wanted.
I couldn't see a way to do that.
I also couldn't see a way to name the chords I created, using my own names.
Here is GuitarPro V6 with my attempt to reproduce what i remember seeing in the original link. This is standard notation, TAB and animated Guitar Fretboard all working as GP does it. Makes for a nice video.
this is simply for practice and teaching purposes. We have come a long way from working out in the woodshed.
Chord Melody in GP
Composing and arrangeing for Guitar does require some considerations, not all things go, as we only have four fingers and unless you have monster hands some intervals just don't work. This is best summed up here:
http://musicianwages.com/the-working-musician/music-notation-for-guitar/
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,217
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,217 |
>>>...I didn’t say ALL fretted stringed musicians....>>>
Yes, Bob, I know. You said "most." This was the statement with with which I disagreed.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502 |
Those who have access to a good guitar MIDI pickup and controller can set pgmusic products guitar settings to Multichannel, which puts each string on a different MIDi channel and also automatically knows which "G" you play on which string. It will then notate accordingly.
If you don't have a MIDI guitar setup, you can still set the notation options to Multichannel and then be able to better designate these things, but it will take a lot longer to implement with the mouse and keyboard.
--Mac
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,217
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 2,217 |
>>>...Which one these better conveys to the student what they should play? The TAB or the std. notation?...>>>>
When I want a student to use a certain fingering, I add the fingering to the standard notation. I can do this using notation software or by hand. Same for bends, ties and slurs.
Last edited by flatfoot; 07/23/11 06:01 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
Quote:
Those who have access to a good guitar MIDI pickup and controller can set pgmusic products guitar settings to Multichannel, which puts each string on a different MIDi channel and also automatically knows which "G" you play on which string. It will then notate accordingly.
If you don't have a MIDI guitar setup, you can still set the notation options to Multichannel and then be able to better designate these things, but it will take a lot longer to implement with the mouse and keyboard.
--Mac
Of course, ala our man Carlos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VxCPlfV1lA&feature=related
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251 |
Dan,
Nice job on the video.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 673
Journeyman
|
|
OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 673 |
Quote:
Quote:
I was hoping to be able to have a blank sheet of say 24 bars (no music in the bars) and then be able to take my chords that I created on the left side and drag them onto whatever beat in whatever bar I wanted.
I couldn't see a way to do that.
I also couldn't see a way to name the chords I created, using my own names.
Sorry for the confusion here Dan.
My initial post was about reproducing the video I had mentioned.
But I also wanted to know if GuitarPro could allow a user to create their own sheet of guitar digrams, which comprised of custom chords, with custom names, and input over a staff on beats to their liking.
So first create say, 20 custom chords. Then drag the chords anywhere on the sheet at any bar/beat.
Quote:
Here is GuitarPro V6 with my attempt to reproduce what i remember seeing in the original link. This is standard notation, TAB and animated Guitar Fretboard all working as GP does it. Makes for a nice video.
Good job Dan!
It is different however from the video I posted.
In the video I posted the audio was from a 1960's recording.
In your video I believe you are taking the midi from the notation input, and using that to generate your sounds?
Quote:
Composing and arrangeing for Guitar does require some considerations, not all things go, as we only have four fingers and unless you have monster hands some intervals just don't work.
Yes it does.
I noticed in your video that there were some 'un-guitaristic' fingerings/chords.
Did you play them live, or did you construct them another way?
TIA
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
I think I know what you want to do overall here, I have been there myself and still attempt to do this. I agree we have been all over the block with lots of good stuff in this thread but at the root is still the objective to TRANSCRIBE a recording (note for note) with a NOTATION SOFTWARE. Bottom line, this is a chore - no canned-package will do this for you. Technology just ain't there yet. So we are left to attempt to simulate the old fashion way of using our ears with pen and paper - with what ever tools exist. The effort I showed you in Guitar Pro V6 was all GPv6, including the sounds. The arrangement was the authors and the composing was - well who ever wrote Somewhere over the rainbow. with the program you can enter note for note the entire arrangement, in any of the three formats - Tab, Standard or Freboard. If you enter one form, all the other two are automatically completed. Then you can edit any of the three and all others adjust - exactly what a Notation Program will do for you. Besides being able to then print the score, most Notation programs (all modern ones) will then allow you to play the score as a midi file. Many Notation Programs will allow you to store predefinded Chord structures and insert them. GP has a very good feature for this. Also Finale Notepad I believe has this feature so I think it is common. Personnaly, I would nOT begin this effort with BIAB. I think there a better designed tools for this job and BIAB's strengths lie in other areas. Good luck, keep looking, let us know what you find. But in the meantime don't let the lack of the tool stop you from using your ear and pen and paper. dan
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 330
Journeyman
|
|
Journeyman
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 330 |
Well I can't christen the software that did that, and I play around with a lot. However the original transcription was done by Gilles Rea. If any one can read French, you might get more information from this website. http://web.me.com/gilles.rea/music/transcriptions/transcriptions.html
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,741 |
Quote:
Well I can't christen the software that did that, and I play around with a lot. However the original transcription was done by Gilles Rea. If any one can read French, you might get more information from this website.
http://web.me.com/gilles.rea/music/transcriptions/transcriptions.html
It has already been confirmed it is Logic on the Mac OS. ...long thread ain't it?
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Band-in-a-Box 2026 for Windows Special Offers End Tomorrow (January 15th, 2026) at 11:59 PM PST!
Time really is running out! Save up to 50% on Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® upgrades and receive a FREE Bonus PAK—only when you order by 11:59 PM PST on Thursday, January 15, 2026!
We've added many major new features and new content in a redesigned Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
Version 2026 introduces a modernized GUI redesign across the program, with updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, and a new Dark Mode option. There’s also a new side toolbar for quicker access to commonly used windows, and the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, making it easier to customize your workspace.
Another exciting new addition is the new AI-Notes feature, which can transcribe polyphonic audio into MIDI. You can view the results in notation or play them back as MIDI, and choose whether to process an entire track or focus on specific parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
Upgrade your Band-in-a-Box for Windows to save up to 50% on most Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade packages!
Plus, when you order your Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade during our special, you'll receive a Free Bonus PAK of exciting new add-ons.
If you need any help deciding which package is the best option for you, just let us know. We are here to help!
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® Special Offers Extended Until January 15, 2026!
Good news! You still have time to upgrade to the latest version of Band-in-a-Box® for Windows® and save. Our Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® special now runs through January 15, 2025!
We've packed Band-in-a-Box® 2026 with major new features, enhancements, and an incredible lineup of new content! The program now sports a sleek, modern GUI redesign across the entire interface, including updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, a new dark mode option, and more. The brand-new side toolbar provides quicker access to key windows, while the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, creating a flexible, clutter-free workspace. We have an amazing new “AI-Notes” feature. This transcribes polyphonic audio into MIDI so you can view it in notation or play it back as MIDI. You can process an entire track (all pitched instruments and drums) or focus on individual parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
There are over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
When you order purchase Band-in-a-Box® 2026 before 11:59 PM PST on January 15th, you'll also receive a Free Bonus PAK packed with exciting new add-ons.
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® today! Check out the Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.
Happy New Year!
Thank you for being part of the Band-in-a-Box® community.
Wishing you and yours a very happy 2026—Happy New Year from all of us at PG Music!
Season's Greetings!
Wishing everyone a happy, healthy holiday season—thanks for being part of our community!
The office will be closed for Christmas Day, but we will be back on Boxing Day (Dec 26th) at 6:00am PST.
Team PG
Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: The Newly Designed Piano Roll Window
In this video, we explore the updated Piano Roll, complete with a modernized look and exciting new features. You’ll see new filtering options that make it easy to focus on specific note groups, smoother and more intuitive note entry and editing, and enhanced options for zooming, looping, and more.
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: AI Stems & Notes - split polyphonic audio into instruments and transcribe
This video demonstrates how to use the new AI-Notes feature together with the AI-Stems splitter, allowing you to select an audio file and have it separated into individual stems while transcribing each one to its own MIDI track. AI-Notes converts polyphonic audio—either full mixes or individual instruments—into MIDI that you can view in notation or play back instantly.
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Bonus PAK and 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®
With your version 2026 for Windows Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons for FREE! Or upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2026 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 27 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 25 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 12 new RealStyles.
- MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
- Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
- Playable RealTracks Set 5
- RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
- SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
- Android Band-in-a-Box® App (included)
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
- Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
- RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
- SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums57
Topics85,611
Posts793,982
Members39,924
| |
Most Online25,754
Jan 24th, 2025
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
There are no members with birthdays on this day. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean