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As for the bonuses; if my contract says I get a bonus if the bank makes X profit, then that profit is caused by a bailout (meaning I did not make the profit) the bonus should be void. Whether it's in the contract or not the reason for it was not the priginal intent. And yes, I DO think that even if Joe X had nothing to do with the screw-ups, but works for a company that did, he should be included in that exclusion. Had they NOT been beailed out there would have been no bonus; they would have been unemployed. Bailing them out does not constitue a job well done.



Still missing the big picture here, Bob. The LA Dodgers are a complete mess right now with the McCourt's divorce, the bankruptcy, the team being run by a league appointed adminstrator. They're hemmoraging money, no profits there. The players however are all under contract and still being paid. That principle is part of the bedrock of labor contract law. The only way to void those contracts is by the business entity going completely under in federal bankruptcy court, then the BK trustee can void everything including those contracts. Short of that, no way. Here's where certain political parties are being hoist on their own pitard. Who's one of the absolute biggest contributors to the party? Labor unions. Who's behind labor contracts including the sports stars and bank execs? Labor unions even though of course bank execs are part of management not labor, it's the same underlying contract law that applies to both. Can't change one without voiding the other.

I think you mentioned earlier you thought the bailouts themselves were wrong. That's where the problem lies. Don't bail them out and then they do go under like Enron did and then of course, no bonuses. Get the government involved and there you are. Can't have it both ways. For me at least I have to accept the word of two administrations one Republican and one Democrat that TARP was necessary. Economists and experts from both admin's said the same thing and who are we to dispute that? I left my PhD in economics in my other car, sorry. Beyond that though, enough is enough already.

A point about lobbyists. You mentioned Walmart has their lobby but what about the employees. You can’t look at Walmart in a vacuum. They’re not the only lobby. All sides are being represented by very deep pocket lobbyists and their organizations backing them up. Unions have been lobbying congress for years about getting Walmart unionized. Walmart contends that would be the end of their price advantage. Both sides are fairly represented by lobbyists. This notion of Representatives and Senators being bought and paid for by lobbyists is complete bs in my opinion. Lobbyists are just another extension of democracy at work. The defense contractors lobby vs the green energy lobby vs the big oil lobby vs the hog farmers lobby vs the auto makers lobby vs, vs, vs whatever lobby. George Soros and the Koch brothers are both mega billionaires, both actively support their respective causes on each side of the political spectrum. The right says Soros buys left wing politicians and the left says the Koch brothers buys right wing politicians. Everybody has their advocates and it all evens out in the long run. What it boils down to is the political character of each individual in congress and the White House. They’re going to do what they’re going to do according to their own moral political thinking. I’m certainly on one side of this but I do give the other side credit for their beliefs even though I disagree with them.

Nobody is bought and paid for. If a right wing lobbyist decides to give a million dollars to Barney Frank is that going to change his vote on a right wing issue? Of course not. I’ve very cynical but I still give these people more credit than that. Congressman Frank believes what he believes and he will vote that way and if his constituents don't like it they can vote him out.

This is no different than our adversarial legal system. The prosecution and defense have the legal obligation to tear the other side to shreads within the rules of evidence and an impartial observer like a jury or voters wade through it all and act accordingly. Of course it’s not perfect but it’s what we have.

Bob

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