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Hello Everyone,
Here is something I posted on another thread about headphone use. Its just my 2 cents worth but I thought it might be relevant.
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A good STUDIO Headphone is an ABSOLUTE MUST !! Buy one that was DESIGNED for STUDIO use and spend at least $100 on one or as much as you can afford. AVOID consumer and DJ models. Average consumer models are usually NOT designed with a flat frequency response. DJ models have a heavy hump in frequencies that help you hear the headphone in a loud ambient environment . . . like a night club. My personal choice is a Sony 7509. I know this headphone intimately because I've used this model for many years.
Everyone can hear. There are far fewer number of us who has LEARNED TO LISTEN. Yes, CRITICAL listening ability IS AN ACQUIRED TALENT . . . and it takes as much time, effort and PRACTICE to develop this talent as it takes to become a good guitarist.
Everything we have ever heard in our life time is a result of the sound source and ITS REACTION to the environment. This is the difference WHY you sound different in the bathroom compared to the living room.
If you do not have a properly "treated" Listening room (where you mix your music), the headphone eliminates the "environment" to a minimum. The only "environment" left is the air space between the headphone diver and your eardrum.
Each HEADPHONE sounds different . . . even within the same "model number". The more you pay . . . the less are the minor difference within a "model number". Flatter response you get from a good pair of headphone is usually not as pleasing as listening to a nice stereo system. This is because the "pleasing environment" we are used to has been eliminated. "Consumer" headphones have built-in EQ curve to replicate the "missing environment". So, if you mix to a "consumer" headphone and you play the result in your stereo system, some areas of the EQ curve can become over or under emphasized.
Once you buy your "reference" headphone, its time to start the learning process. This is a LEARNING process and it requires many hours of listening. You need "REFERENCE TRACKS". You need to select CD tracks from your CD collection that you think they SOUND great to you. These tracks don't necessarily be one that you are fond of . . . just the ones with production quality you want to emulate. These reference tracks should contain a wide range of genre. Include few examples from Orchestral music like Movie soundtracks to solo acoustic instruments and everything in between. If you decide to burn a reference CD, make sure you do in a WAV. file format so there are no digital compression is involved.
Now its time to spend MANY HOURS of LISTENING. Concentrate on trying to isolate and listen to each instrument or an area of frequency range. Learn to listen in parts of the sound as well as the whole. eventually you will learn YOUR headphone's sound and begin to trust it.
It is often helpful to listen to a reference track while mixing to check your progress. If the production quality of you mix comes close the the production quality on your reference track . . . then the audio CD you burn should translate well in your stereo system.
If you compare your work against a reference track from a "Big Label CD" . . . through YOUR headphone, then your work should come very close to or equal a commercially produced CD !!
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I try not to change headphone brands, specially when I've spent many critical listening hours to "learn" my reference headphone.
Several times in the past, when I did some work in large studios, I always had my reference headphone and my reference CDs with me. My headphone was my point of reference during the progress of the project.
Ed Layola
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rharv: To answer your question about doing a mix -- no, I really haven't started a mix from scratch with the 40fs' yet. I'll be spending most of January "re-mixing" with some re-recording (plus I have two songs with no vocals/my guitars yet -- just BIAB tracks). I think the 40's will be OK, just got to get used to them. Now, the sennheiser hd280's are on sale at Amazon for $75 and a local store has them for $79. I might pick up a pair today and decide over the next couple of weeks which one to keep. Of course trading the 40's for the 50's is tempting -- but it would feel like stealing since the 50's are $150 everywhere. flatfoot and sundance (and everyone else): Thanks for chiming in. It might be I just need to get used to them. Of course, maybe the sound "quality" on these 40's are different than other 40's. Hard to know. Everyone's ears are different. If you ever read through review after review comparing headphones, you will soon find out that all the main headphones have their fans and their detractors. Thanks, Kevin
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I bought the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro headphones today -- I think they are going back. They are pretty tight around the head and I can't really tell enough difference between them and the 40's to justify keeping them. I did a lot of reading too -- and while the 280's have fans, it has many more detractors. The ATH-M50's seem to be the clear winners (although a lot of folks don't agree).
rharv -- how old are your 50's and what kind of shape are they in? ha, ha!
I am going to do as much listening over the next few days with the 40's to see if I'll keep them. I can always send them back and just wait for the 50's to go on sale.
This is tougher than I expected. I bet if I had just gone ahead and got the Sony MDR7506's, I would have been happy since I have used Sony headphones all along.
Kevin
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Quote:
I bought the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro headphones today -- I think they are going back. They are pretty tight around the head and I can't really tell enough difference between them and the 40's to justify keeping them. I did a lot of reading too -- and while the 280's have fans, it has many more detractors. The ATH-M50's seem to be the clear winners (although a lot of folks don't agree).
rharv -- how old are your 50's and what kind of shape are they in? ha, ha!
I am going to do as much listening over the next few days with the 40's to see if I'll keep them. I can always send them back and just wait for the 50's to go on sale.
This is tougher than I expected. I bet if I had just gone ahead and got the Sony MDR7506's, I would have been happy since I have used Sony headphones all along.
Kevin
Let me see if I can get through to you one more time. The ATH M40fs are accurate headphones that are great for engineers for mixing tracks. You are approaching this like a guy looking for a set of headphones to put on and listen to his favorite music while relaxing. Two different approaches. Nearfield monitors suck to listen to music on.
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Sony MDR7509 are my phones of choice. Keep trying others but always come back to the Sony
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Quote:
Let me see if I can get through to you one more time. The ATH M40fs are accurate headphones that are great for engineers for mixing tracks. You are approaching this like a guy looking for a set of headphones to put on and listen to his favorite music while relaxing. Two different approaches. Nearfield monitors suck to listen to music on.
Yes, I see how my description of my needs can be confusing. I need the best "mixing" headphones I can get in my price range (~$100). The main issue I have with the 40's is that they are a little "tinny" to my ears with not enough bass. Since my mixes sometimes have too much "boom" in them, I am afraid that I will bump the bass too much. Now maybe the sound in the 40's is exactly what I need and I just need to train my ears. However, after reading lots of reviews and threads, the "consensus of opinion" is that the 50's just translate better because the bass mix is more "real". This could be wrong and the 40's could be great for me -- but I am blundering ahead! I am either going to get the 50's or the sony 7506's (or keep the 40's) and be done with it (I can't swing the 7509's right now).
Now everyone says you shouldn't mix with headphones (especially closed-end), but that's what I got right now. I plan to get monitors also (maybe later this year). It looks like that discussion is even more confusing with opinions left and right!
... now I do need a great pair of "listening" headphones too!!!!!!
Kevin
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Hey Kevin, I hope you'll keep us posted. If you get the 50's and a/b them for yourself with the 40's - I'd be interested in your impressions.  John, Thanks!!! I'm going to order those replacements. Josie
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PM your address to me, I was serious, I'd trade the M50's even up. They have very few hours on them, as they are not preferred here by me. About a year old as of now. I'm not going to want to trade back though and pay shipping twice to end up with my original headphones! I hate the coiled cord on them too ..
Last edited by rharv; 12/27/11 05:04 PM.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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I also am forced to mix with headphones 70-80% of the time and found that having one of these when using headphones is a HUGE help.They help create a virtual stereo reproduction system and listening room for a more "real feel"... Isone Pro - After a year of trying out the various headphone room simulators I settled on this VST...IMHO the best out of the bunch. Now this refers to their older one, I have not tried out this new one... Redline Monitor - I would recommend this 2nd, it colors the sound more than Isone but is still very helpful. The free hdphx is no longer available at the site I have a link for, but you might be able to locate it with a search. It works & is worth the download.... Use what you got to the best of your ability, and as soon as all the naysayers buy us all some room treatment & REAL monitors then I say use what ya have! ;P  
i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
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You really hit the nail on the head. You need to learn how it should sound on your headphones so as to translate properly on various systems. I can't teach you how to mix on a Forum.There's a lot of trial and error.It would be like teaching you to play on this Forum. Can give pointers but you have to do the work.
I've said this before but it's a matter of the content of the mix that makes for proper translation. Think of it as a big soup. Don't tweak each track with EQ etc. individually until you think it sounds good. You need to learn the frequency relationship between instruments.Frequencies add & subtract from each other. If you were making a soup would you but spices on each ingredient until it tastes good,say salt? Of course because after you put all the ingredients into the pot you'd have way to much salt.If your mix has way to much "salt" now what do you do?
So here's an example as it applies to music. The human voice is very much a midrange instrument SO cut some of the midrange on other instruments. It'll clear up that excess midrange sound. Kick Drum & bass. Same thing.Decide which one to cut some of that low end content. Belive me the track may sound off but the MIX will sound right.
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Ditto to everything "silvertones" said.
Mixing is an ART. The only way to do it well is through experience. LOTS of experience. This is something no one can do for you . . . you just have to put in the hours. A "mix" is a personal expression of the mixing engineer. You can give all the individual tracks to a song to 20 mixers and you'd end up with 20 different mixes of the song.
There are a millions of tips and tricks, do's and don'ts. But remember, none of them are "rules". You have to continually keep evolving as you gain experience. That means a lot of trial and error and lots of experimenting. You don't want to get stagnant with your mixing method. Stagnation leads to songs that sounds the same.
LISTEN to the SONG. Do what the song is asking for. 75% of the time required for mixing is listening time. Listen for whats needed. What ever you think about doing, you should always let your ears make the final decision . . . weather to keep the change or not? . . . did the change add or detract from the mix? . . . etc.
I try to mix dry first. If the mix sounds good dry, I usually need less "effects" . . . but thats just me.
Its almost impossible to "talk" about sound without hearing it in the same room.
Trust your ears.
Ed
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I replaced my AKG Headphone in 2009. I used to have the model with 4 transducers and very flat response. They were over $200. I couldn't afford them and the flat response was no longer an asset for me. At my age, after years of Marshall Stacks and many gigs that were way to loud my hearing is impaired. I was EQing my stuff with too much Highs and way too much Lows. I switched to a Sennheiser HeadPhone that was about 50-60 dollars. They colored the sound but made up for my hearing loss. My mixes didn't have to be redone everytime I popped a CD into my portable or anything else. I lost these in the recent flood now and they don't make this model anymore anyway. So I'm at a loss for what to get. I really loved the Sennheiser's for mixing, recording and listening. And I'm pretty sure I can get by on a set that's under $100. My days of 1-2 hundred dollar items are gone. I did finally replace my Guitar Amp, with a Fender Mustang I, and it's one of the best amps I've ever owned. It makes my Strat sound like My good old Tele and more. Wayne, Still here,
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I've decided against mixing. I'm mobility challenged, and deaf. Probably a no brainer eh? But the people who do it are 'black art' types. You can't learn it. You can't teach it. You need 4 cars in the drive with bad wheels but good sound systems. They don't have to work. Just the stereos. Heck I can't get out if the house, too much ice. I forgot to get a pick for my cane, it attaches on the bottom for the winter so you can do snow and ice. The other thing is you need one of those sound systems with speakers the size of small pianos to try it on. And a Bose for fun. Not to mention trips to the local mall to try it there, and perhaps, if you can book a slot, a 15 minute trial at Carnegie Hall.
Now bear in mind before that, you MUST have the audiophile version. Who'd go to the master step with less? Nuts. Add to that the Garritan stuff, ALL of it. 3 outboard synths. And you can't Master in Band in a Box, and RealBand, (You need it, it's a tool).
Now I figure you need a screamer computer, about 5k.
That's only for the PC, you must have a MAC. Every tune, every idea, and every bit of cinema, art, etc. All Mac stuff, just ask them.
2 copies of some expensive thing like Sibelius.
2 copies of some mixing software, latest version.
1 k for PG software.
2 k for those speakers in front of you that are NOT for listening to music. They are flat field monitors, chosen because they sound crappy. Can't do music but a must for mixing.
And the most expensive headphones you can find for mixing. Again, not for music, just mixing. You havn't done much yet but at least 15k or more so far.
Now you need years of experience, and you need to have a big soundboard for side chaining, and once you have your 12 today, 24 tommorrow, and 'cmon, you have to have 48 tracks right? And the room needs to be dead, forget the local funeral home, you have to put stuff on the walls to stop the sound, because you only want to hear it on speakers not good for listening to music, and headphones just in case.
Now once you get part way, run out to the driveway. Here it's against the law to idle your car longer than 10 minutes except if the outdoor temperature equals the temperature of the breath of one of the left wing women on city council. Cold.
Then you run around sticking your potential cd in everyones thing, and after that, you go back and tweak.
Once you are 'done', you invite all and sundry over to your house, stick that CD into your old boom box with sand from the last beach trip 12 years ago and crank your loops for the whole family to praise, while you send out copies to every Nashville producer and artist. You don't get a thank-you, but your CD's are being used at a Nashville soup kitchen to keep the formica from getting stained by coffee cups.
As to me, I'm letting the box play old Sinatra tunes, oblivious to the fact that my Bose stick is messing up the stereo field, and NOT one Master who baits us on the forum, dares come and tell me I'm missing the overtones at 3k. See I don't even hear, with any amplification, anything above 2900 hz so I'm just gonna smile and enjoy.
Where's my Perry Como collection, Paul Anka's too hip for me!
NOTE: There is humour in the above post. In Canada humour includes you twice, because you have to have a lot when you live here. I'm off to check the temperature to see if I can warm up the car or if I have to drive it with 2 inches of ice. Occupy Key West. Now.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Keep up the humo(u)r, John!
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 12TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 12TB SATA BB2026/UMC204HD&404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/Notion/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com (under rehosting/construction)
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I almost bought Bose noise cancelling headphones for almost 400 bucks at Best Buy.
Wow, I put them on and it was quiet. Quel concept!
Then I took them off. The ceiling fans are running at a screaming level, but they go away with the headphones on. WOW. I listened close and heard some voices. With the headphones on NOT A THING! Miracle. I think I saw the Madonna cry! I just walked up the steps to some shrine, in the sunshine with Nuns cheering me on, my knees bleeding and praise whichever saint built the joint, I can't hear anything. Well except the ringing in my ears which never leaves.
The shopping carts bang, put on those headphones, and wow, gone. And the music sounded dang good. I'm thinking of buying them and realize my buddy Stew, who works as a construction supervisor and gives me those foam earplugs is talking to me. We chat for a while and he reaches in his pocket and gives me 5 or 6 pairs in little boxes. We discuss the Mexican National Anthem, and decide to leave it in C.
A few minutes later, while waiting for the salesperson with a key to get me some cool Bose headphones, they start smashing carts, and it's driving me nuts. I pull out the hearing aids, stick in the foam things and no cart noise. No fans. No indistinct talking. Just tinnitus. Ringing like a bad friend who won't go home. I disappear and realize I just saved 400 bucks by sticking the free pieces of foam in my ears.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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somebody needs to invent ear plugs that only cancel out the negative stuff. Music, compliments, encouragement, the voice of friends, the noises of pets... all that should get through.
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That's just called being positive.
It bugs some people but when they ask How are you?
I often reply,
"Not good" (insert pregnant pause here) "I'm fantastic!"
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Quote:
That's just called being positive.
It bugs some people but when they ask How are you?
I often reply,
"Not good" (insert pregnant pause here) "I'm fantastic!"
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With Band-in-a-Box® 2026, we've released 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 468-488) in a variety of genres—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Funk & World (Sets 468-475):
Our new jazz, funk & blues RealTracks include a groovin’ collection of RealTracks and RealDrums! These include more requested “soul jazz” RealTracks featuring artists Neil Swainson (bass), Charles Treadway (organ), Brent Mason (guitar), and Wes Little (drums). There are new “smooth jazz” styles (4), which include a RealTracks first: muted trumpet, as well as slick new smooth jazz brushes options for drums. Blues lovers will be thrilled—there are more “classic acoustic blues” styles, including guitar (5), bass (4), and drums (10) with blues master Colin Linden, featuring understated and tasty background acoustic soloing, plus brushes drums and acoustic bass. There are also new electric blues RealTracks, including electric blues with PG favorite Johnny Hiland (3) and soulful electric slide guitar from Colin Linden (4). If you love funk & gospel, there are great new options this year, including gospel organ (3) from Charles Treadway, as well as new funk, tango, and rock ’n’ roll drums (3) and bass (1). And for big, bold arrangements, we have uptempo soul horns (4) featuring a three-part hip horn section with options for a full mix or stems of each individual horn — plus an accompanying rhythm section (4) of drums, bass, guitar, and electric piano!
Rock & Pop (Sets 476–482):
Our new rock & pop RealTracks bring a powerful mix of requested favorites, fresh genres, and modern chart-inspired styles! We have more of our popular “Producer Layered Acoustic Guitars (15)” featuring Band-in-a-Box favorite Brent Mason. We’ve continued our much-requested disco styles (10), and added new Celtic guitar (5) with a more basic, accessible approach than our previous Drop-D or DADGAD offerings. There are also highly requested yacht rock styles (17), inspired by the smooth, polished soft-rock sound of the late ’70s and early ’80s — laid-back grooves, silky electric pianos, warm textures, elegant harmonic movement, and pristine production aesthetics. Fans of heavier styles will love our new glam metal (13), capturing the flashy, high-energy sound of ’80s arena-ready guitar rock. We also have a set of rootsy modern-folk rock (18), with a warm, organic sound combining contemporary folk textures and driving acoustic strumming. And we’ve added lots of new modern pop styles (16) — the kinds of sounds you’re hearing on the radio today, featuring exciting new drums, synths, and cutting-edge RealTracks arrangements.
Country, & Americana (Sets 483–488):
Our new country & Americana RealTracks deliver a rich collection of acoustic, electric, and roots-inspired styles! We have new country pop (9) with legendary guitarist Brent Mason. There is also a potpourri (14) of bouzouki, guitars, banjo, and more, perfect for adding texture and character to contemporary acoustic arrangements. We’ve added funky country guitar (5) with PG favorite Brent Mason, along with classic pedal steel styles (5) featuring steel great Doug Jernigan. There are more country songwriter styles (8) that provide intimate, rootsy foundations for storytelling and modern Americana writing. Finally, we have “background soloing” acoustic guitar (12) with Brent Mason — simpler, but still very tasty acoustic lines designed to sit beautifully behind vocals or act as a subtle standalone solo part.
Check out all the 202 new RealTracks (in sets 468-488)!
And, if you are looking for more, the 2026 49-PAK (for $49) includes an impressive collection of 20 bonus RealTracks, featuring exciting and inspiring additions to add to your RealTracks library. You'll get new country-rhythm guitar styles from PG Music favorites Johnny Hiland and Brent Mason, along with modern-pop grooves that capture today’s radio-ready sound! There are also new indie-folk styles with guitar, bass, 6-string bass used as a high-chording instrument, acoustic guitar, and banjo. Plus, dedicated "cymbal fills" RealDrums provide an added layer that work very well with low-key folky styles with other percussion.
The 2026 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2026 49-PAK!
2026 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®!
With your version 2026 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons for FREE! Or upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2026 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 27 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 25 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 12 new RealStyles.
- MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
- Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
- Playable RealTracks Set 5
- RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
- SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
- iOS Android Band-in-a-Box® App
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
- Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
- RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
- SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
Learn more about the Bonus PAK and 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®!
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