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an indian broad? yes, definitely.
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my wife told an old cherokee woman that she had just gotten a nice bottle of wine for me.
the old woman said: "Good trade!"
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Lots of talk about song length. Here's the deal.
People ask me a lot "Where do your song ideas come from?"
My answer is always the same. "Songs are stories set to music. And a great place to get stories is from your life experiences. Remember though, that life isn't always happy. Sometimes it is sad. So when you tell a story in song about a sad event, the 'story' will be sad."
Okay, so THIS song is is a story, like any other I have written. It's a story about a relationship that went bad. I knew the girl for 2 years as a friend before we got together as a couple. She came from a HORRIBLE marriage to a Neanderthal who hurt her in every way possible, and I spent that whole 2 years explaining that I did not hurt he, HE did, and I wouldn't do that, and dwelling in past mistakes only keeps those bad times alive in your mind.
NOW go listen to the lyrics. Knowing the STORY, they make more sense. Now this story can not be told in one short verse and one chorus. It HAS to be the whole 5 minutes or it's like tearing the last page out of a book right at "....and the killer is...."
Here is the first verse, bridge and chorus.
I know that there were men before me
Who didn’t really treat you well
But it doesn’t really matter what happened before
And it does you no good to dwell
And I’ve proven it to you time and again
That you could trust me with your love
And I promised you I’d never hurt you that way
But that was something you weren't quite sure of
And you never understood
That the past is the past
And I’ll give you a love
You can count on to last
Tell me what do I have to do?
I’ve been tellin’ you now for over 2 years
That everything you need is standing right here in front of you
If you’d only let me through
I know you built a wall to guard your heart
And I'll tell you again what I said at the start
But you need to believe it’s true
I’m the one for you
Verse 2 if after the dumping, how I felt duped and used.
For a time you really had me believin’
That this was more than just a fling
That maybe you really cared about me
And I’d finally found the real thing
But as time passed by it was clearer each day
That you really didn’t care at all
Still I took a real chance and I gave you my heart
Even knowing I was risking a fall
And you never believed
That my love was for real
That there wasn’t anything
I was tryin’ to conceal
Tell me what do I have to do?
I’ve been tellin’ you now for over 2 years
That everything you need is standing right here in front of you
If you’d only let me through
I know you built a wall to guard your heart
And I'll tell you again what I said at the start
But you need to believe it’s true
I’m the one for you
After the solos, I am talking to her explaining how badly she hurt me.
And it hurt me so bad
When you sent me away
I never really thought
You’d treat me that way
Tell me what do I have to do?
Now, could I really take ANY of that out and still tell the whole story? Music world stuffed shirt penguins demanding 3:43 songs or not, I can not tell the story without all the verses.
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Hey Eddie,
Pretty much everything has been said already on this so I won't plow over the very good advice already given.
I do have one small but important suggestion.
Your lyrics will be stronger if you'll get rid of unnecessary words. Specifically "and" "that" "but" should be used sparingly. Try eliminating some of them and see how much better your song reads and sings.
Josie
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Here's the story as I see it from the lyrics only (the "Down by the big lake with a broad in a tent" approach) -- Girl comes from one or more abusive relationships -- you become a couple and spend two years trying to convince her that you are different and this love will work -- she can't accept that or decides that she is not in love and "sends you away" Is that it? The first thing that jumps out at me is that I know nothing about this girl. I don't know the color of her hair, the way her eyes sparkle when she laughs, the way she tilts her head when she smirks at you, how she looks romping through a field of clover (OK, OK, you get the picture). I also know nothing of you and maybe the things you did together. All you have done is string a bunch of words together that are all feeling/emotion with no concrete facts to back them up. A song has to be around a 3:30 "mini-movie" where you paint visual pictures that let us get into the scene(s). How you watched any of those MAB videos (or visited his forum) where he discusses "visual furniture"? MAB also says there are two kinds of audience listeners to these depressing tales of woe that are just line after line of misery: 1) those who don't care and 2) those who are glad that they are your problems and not theirs (ha, ha). You have to make us care about the characters in the song. Look, if you are doing these songs as a cathartic exercise, make them five+ minutes all you want. If your goal is to pitch these songs to an artist, then you have to make it easy for the singer to relate to the song -- and make it interesting for the audience. OK, enough of all that -- just have fun. Now a few comments on the other stuff. Quote:
Quote:
How many tracks are in there -- and what is your panning? Everything seems sort of centered to me.
8, and everything is indeed dead center.
Any reason why you have to do it that way? Your recordings will always sound muddy and unprofessional if everything is panned to the center.
Quote:
Quote:
Remove all the effects from your lead vocal -- it sounds like you are in a tin can and it pushes the vocal too far to the back.
This track in this take suffers from "equalizus over effectsus" disease. I tried to EQ the vocals using a plug in effect. This was before I have my MOTU working and can now mix outside the software like I want to. Unfortunately there is no "remove all the bad attempts to EQ" button on Real Band that I am aware of. I plan to someday sing it again dry and direct into the interface.
RealBand allows "non-destructive" EQ and effect plugins, so you your original vocal take is never changed. Isn't this true?
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I hope this is helpful. If it isn't let me know -- it takes a lot of time to think about all this stuff in a constructive manner. Just remember that I am no big expert here. If you go through my songs you can point out the same problems (and others!).
Kevin
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Quote:
I don't know how she looks romping through a field of clover
Naked or clothed?
Kevin, you hit on something with precision. This album was a cathartic effort for me. My drummer friend calls them "You stepped on my [junk] and I hate you" songs. Once she realized I was okay and wouldn't hurt her soul like the other guy did, things went well until she got too attached to me for her comfort zone and backed out in fear that if we married it would turn out like the last one (I promised you I'd never hurt you that way but that was something you weren't quite sure of). I wrote these songs to get rid of it, and it worked.
The 5 minute part comes partly from my age. I grew up listening to Pink Floyd and Genesis, both of whom wrote opus length songs, Todd Rundgren (my HERO) and his theme albums (ever heard the Broadway play he scored?), and jam bands like the Allman Brothers, who often played long enough for me to run out to the car to get my wallet, give the car a quick wash and wax, use the bathroom, hit the beer stand, and come back to Duane and Dickey playing the same song. I NEVER, and I mean that literally, listen to the radio so I don't know anything about radio. (If I want 4 commercials between songs I will ask for them....) I do pay a little bit of attention to the song lengths on the CDs I listen to for driving music, but again, I listen to Tower of Power LIVE, Average White Band LIVE, Earth Wind and Fire LIVE, Genesis LIVE, Pink Floyd LIVE, Allman Brothers LIVE (at the Fillmore).... I don't hear much studio music. Commercial radio sucks.
The NEXT batch is back a little more to my rock roots and they are coming in at 3:50-4:20, but that is not conscious. Just how they are turning out.
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I just listened to a Tower of Power Live CD (~1998 or '99) on the ride back from Tennessee over the holidays. I sure wish BIAB could figure out how to do a RealHorns (and RealStrings) product! Commercial radio (in any genre) is always hit and miss with a few great, some good, most OK and some bad -- and with lots of commercials. I tend to listen to a local alt rock station, with a country station in the mix. But most of my listening is really peer stuff on web sites like this. Here's a great current rock/country tune by Eric Church: Put a Drink in My Hand. I wish I could have written that one, but I am not in the club scene anymore, so I would never think of it unless I was with a younger co-writer. (Warning: It does glorify drinking a little!) Keep writing.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Good news! You still have time to upgrade to the latest version of Band-in-a-Box® for Windows® and save. Our Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® special now runs through January 15, 2025!
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Season's Greetings!
Wishing everyone a happy, healthy holiday season—thanks for being part of our community!
The office will be closed for Christmas Day, but we will be back on Boxing Day (Dec 26th) at 6:00am PST.
Team PG
Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: The Newly Designed Piano Roll Window
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You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: AI Stems & Notes - split polyphonic audio into instruments and transcribe
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Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
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