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Dan,
One other thing that is really just a preference in production. I'd like to hear the piano comping in the beginning were you're playing melody.
Here I will have to compromise with you John. Initally over the AA melody part I have a kind of triplet 6/8 feel going with the picking pattern, Then for the fianl B-A sections I play it single note. The piano and I were colliding over the AA portion so I asked him to sit on his hands for that part. I have now brought him back in over the B - A melody sections. I agree with you there, it sounds nice.
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Just to clarify, All tracks are first mixed and rendered to a single stereo track, then I use the Mastering on that. Although not to imply that I really know what I'm doing. So I do appreciatee all comments.
Sorry, I have misunderstood you: yes, I thought you were using Ozone as an insert on the master channel.
PS: and yes, neither do I understood what I was doing with that damn plugin 
Latest BIAB version, latest build.
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Production=subjective
Engineering=objective
So as far as the piano goes it's your call. It's a matter of taste.
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Or if you want to get personal; what is wrong with this mix? http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/showflat.p...e=0&fpart=2.
What a great amount of feedback. Thank you to everyone. I should study this for a week and then try again. But the day job puts me back on a plane tomorrow to Columbus. So I have to do it all today...
Here is my best shot following all the great advice on mixing:  SWOTR - Remixed and remastered
While I am in the hotel I will listen some more and then next weekend come up with a plan for my next actions.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6
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There's a reason to pan low frequency sources to center - Wavelengths are often long enough that they are longer than how far apart your speakers are. This is one reason most subwoofers are mono.
If you are hard panned, you are not using the capability of the playback system to it's full extent.
Everything that really isn't supposed to have significant low frequency content (pretty much everything besides bass instruments, kick/floor toms, etc. should be high-pass filtered (cutoff frequency anywhere from 80-250 Hz or so, listen for when the sound becomes thinned out beyond what you want) - filter tracks individually.
When I listen to your track here is what I hear:
I don't think there's as much of an EQ issue issue as others are commenting on. For a jazz track, the delay on the guitar is quite a bit responsible for timing muddiness. The chorus, or short delay on the vocals or perhaps the pitch correction is also distracting.
The bass is actually panned fine I would say. Kind of appropriate for a jazz combo thing. One thing that is particularly distracting is that it sounds like all of the instruments and vox are in different rooms because the reverbs don't match on them. The bass sounds close by, the drums far away, the piano in a different room, etc.
If you have raw .wav files, unprocessed, send them to me and I'll mix it for you and tell you what/how I did it.
-Scott
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Quote:
If you have raw .wav files, unprocessed, send them to me and I'll mix it for you and tell you what/how I did it.
-Scott
I do Scott. Thank you.
Can you take a zipped Folder with a Reaper Project in it?
SWOTR Audio Files in Reaper Project for Scott
Otherwise I can see what I can do about rendering each track to a seperate wav (mp3?) file.
I uploadrf a link for the download. ... but you will not have all my Effect Plugs??
Last edited by jazzmandan; 01/15/12 01:54 PM.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6
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Quote:
Quote:
If you have raw .wav files, unprocessed, send them to me and I'll mix it for you and tell you what/how I did it.
-Scott
I do Scott. Thank you.
Can you take a zipped Folder with a Reaper Project in it?
SWOTR Audio Files in Reaper Project for Scott
Otherwise I can see what I can do about rendering each track to a seperate wav (mp3?) file.
I uploadrf a link for the download. ... but you will not have all my Effect Plugs??
Dan,
I don't use Reaper, so I can't take a Reaper project file.
I would like raw .wav files.
No problem about not getting the effects - the individual track effects are the main problem in the mix, in my opinion.
I will attempt to use freeware VST effects, if any, in the mix and provide a description of how it was accomplished (there will be no wizardry - this is a simple mix situation) that you can then duplicate in whatever DAW software you choose to use.
If I count correctly, there is only 5 or 6 stereo tracks that would need to be rendered and sent. Bass, drums, piano, guitar, vox.
I'm going to do a ground-up re-mix, not a 'master' of the song.
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Quote:
I'm going to do a ground-up re-mix, not a 'master' of the song.
That sounds great. Give me a day to get back in town and I will give you a link to the tracks.
Thanks again.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6
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But the day job puts me back on a plane tomorrow to Columbus.
2 hours away!! Drop on over!!
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Hi Pat, I found that very interesting! I recently started in Sonar 8.5, to roll off the very bottom end. Should I create a customised plug-in, and apply it to every track? I have Cakewalk & Sonitus....which is better......and then.... do you create another plug-in for the final balance EQ......or "tweak" the one you already have.***Sorry for my "near-enough-a-newbie" questions!!  Regards, Joe G.
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I am a Reaper user, tho still at 3.76 due to problems with V4 so far, so I am going to grab the SWOTR Audio Files in Reaper Project for Scott and give it a shot if ya don't mind.... 
i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
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I am a Reaper user, tho still at 3.76 due to problems with V4 so far, so I am going to grab the SWOTR Audio Files in Reaper Project for Scott and give it a shot if ya don't mind....
Hold off, Smurf, I have better "raw" files to upload. I may have inadvertantly rendered effects into some of the tracks currently up on the server. I want to do the track bounce over and be sure that I am only including the raw recordings. I will upload in a few hours (although back in Chicago - still on the day job) You are more than welcome to use the files. I am sure they will be backward compatible into Reaper 3.
I don't really know what to expect, but I will keep my expectaions low because i know you can only work here with what you are given. 
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The initial Reaper Project has been deleted and now replaced with: SWOTR Raw Tracks I uploaded a single Zipped file containing: Sax.wav Bass.wav vocals.wav Guitar.wav Drums.wav Piano.wav Each one has the drum leadin at the first two bars so you can line them up. thanks again. Let me know if you need anything else. I do appreciate you taking the time and effort on this project to try "...to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear"
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6
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Quote:
I am a Reaper user, tho still at 3.76 due to problems with V4 so far, so I am going to grab the SWOTR Audio Files in Reaper Project for Scott and give it a shot if ya don't mind....
Smurf, you may find these files a little better to work. Enjoy 
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6
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The initial Reaper Project has been deleted and now replaced with:
SWOTR Raw Tracks
I uploaded a single Zipped file containing:
Sax.wav Bass.wav vocals.wav Guitar.wav Drums.wav Piano.wav
Each one has the drum leadin at the first two bars so you can line them up. thanks again. Let me know if you need anything else. I do appreciate you taking the time and effort on this project to try "...to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear"
I'll take a crack at this later this week.
-Scott
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Dan, I'm in the process of re-mixing right now. Just got to the vocals and listened for the first time. The 'RAW' track for the vocal is heavily processed. I can't do anything with it.
Also, on the guitar tracks there are some places where the intonation on the guitar is causing some problems - won't be able to do anything with that. Most the time it's not an issue, but there are a few places where it's clashing with the bass when the bass goes high on the fingerboard.
I would work on some arrangement items with the autogenerated piano and drums - but for now, I'll just work the mix. Some of the muddiness is timing related between the guitar and piano. Would you like me to point out the spots or not?
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OK, thanks for the info & the raw .wav uploads jazzmandan, I am grabbing them now!
i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
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Dan, I'm in the process of re-mixing right now. Just got to the vocals and listened for the first time. The 'RAW' track for the vocal is heavily processed. I can't do anything with it.
This was done with the VLT which while a ton of fun is nore suited for Live since once recorded there is no going back. I will re-think and re-sing this part with a much less processed effect.
Quote:
Also, on the guitar tracks there are some places where the intonation on the guitar is causing some problems - won't be able to do anything with that. Most the time it's not an issue, but there are a few places where it's clashing with the bass when the bass goes high on the fingerboard..
The Bass player is doing some runs which get in way with the melody - ya I heard that. I guess the only fix is to spend more time in BIAB or RB to adjust all those parts individually. This was a "simple" bass RT, may need a "very simple" bass RT. I do hear in your mixing you have tamed the bass very much - how?? It is far less obstrusive and a big improvement.
Quote:
I would work on some arrangement items with the autogenerated piano and drums - but for now, I'll just work the mix. Some of the muddiness is timing related between the guitar and piano. Would you like me to point out the spots or not?
Ya, the guitar and piano are stepping on each other, I can hear the places - I had at one point muted the piano over this part with automation that was removed in the tracks I sent you. Then again I may need to go back to BIAB/RB to arranged thw piano better.
Scott, I do appreciate your efforts and would love to have a little more detail on how you tamed the bass and any and all other mixing magic you empolyed. Thanks much.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6
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Dan, here is perhaps a slightly different version. http://rockstarnot.rekkerd.org/misc/Producer/SWOTR-SAL%20Remix%20without%20vox%20v2.mp3Not much done other than some light compression on drums, bass, and guitar. I did high pass the guitar at about 300 Hz before compression. Compression only activated on the very loudest portions of the guitar and bass. Put it on drums almost just to raise the level with the makeup gain. I aux bussed every channel to the Kjaerhus classic compressor, set it to small club, put effect/dry mix at 100% effect, increased the room size a little. Sent to that aux to taste. Probably most noticeable on the sax - but note that it's all the same room. Panned guitar a little right, piano pretty far left, sax a little left. Used Final Mix on the output bus set to a jazz mix. It's a multi-band compressor. It did very little on some taming some mids. Normalized the output. I did automate the volume of piano part to tame some of the more energetic playing right before and during the sax solo. I'll try to take some screenshots and post.
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