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Living in The Music City
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don't hold back, Mike... tell us what you REALLY think! 
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Recording is great and the use of BIAB is good too, but really, it's too soon for this song. (And besides, he might have been totally mentally ill. Will he burn in Hell for being sick? Don't take it personally, just saying.)
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yeah...my wife cautioned me about posting the song. Again, not intended to offend, and I know wounds are still very wide open on this, so I should've just not put it out there.
Points well taken...
Living in The Music City
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Mike, first, thanks for listen and comments on my latest song.
I wasn't advocating for you to remove your song. It was well done. And, besides, freedom of speech dictates that you have the right to voice your opinion. But I understand your removing it too. I sounded great.
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Also remember that not everybody believes there is a heaven and hell....
And from the political side, nobody mentally ill can plan a military operation like he planned. Remmber, he had his apartment booby trapped, as in "I plan to get killed during this and won't return so I need to destroy the evidence."
But this is a music forum. I'll save that for CNN....
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I don't appreciate this post. There are plenty of other places you can express your opinions and feelings on this subject. Song or no song, this is out of line.
Bob
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Quote:
I don't appreciate this post. There are plenty of other places you can express your opinions and feelings on this subject. Song or no song, this is out of line.
Bob
it's a slippery slope when we start telling people they aren't allowed to say things we don't like.
Be careful what you wish for. You might get it.
It is the nature of songs to express the opinion of the song writer. It is the nature of opinions not to have universal acceptance.
The forum is for the posting of original songs, and this is an original song.
None of us has the perfect point of view by which all other points of view are to be judged. The standard reply when people want to censor TV programming is "If you don't like it, don't watch it"
In a free society opinions may be expressed openly, even unpopular ones. When that ceases to be true, it is no longer a free society.
my 2 cents. YOMV
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Quote:
Quote:
I don't appreciate this post. There are plenty of other places you can express your opinions and feelings on this subject. Song or no song, this is out of line.
Bob
it's a slippery slope when we start telling people they aren't allowed to say things we don't like.
Be careful what you wish for. You might get it.
It is the nature of songs to express the opinion of the song writer. It is the nature of opinions not to have universal acceptance.
The forum is for the posting of original songs, and this is an original song.
None of us has the perfect point of view by which all other points of view are to be judged. The standard reply when people want to censor TV programming is "If you don't like it, don't watch it"
In a free society opinions may be expressed openly, even unpopular ones. When that ceases to be true, it is no longer a free society.
my 2 cents. YOMV
I don't dispute his right to express his opinions, or his right to freedom of speech. I just don't think this is the place to do it. Besides that, it's insensitive and provocative at this point in time and at the very least, in poor taste.
Bob
Bob
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Guys, I see both sides of the argument. While I might lean towards freedom of speech, I realize that I'm not hosting this site, and if the song has offended anyone, then I will respect their wishes. As such. I have removed the song link. Doesn't much matter to me weather someone believes in Heaven or Hell, believes in the death penalty or not, or whether they believe the perp was or was not insane....this was an expression of how some "might" feel in the wake of such a horrible event. Expression of the "feeling" is what I aspire to achieve, not political/social commentary or attempts to force others to believe as I believe. To be honest, personally, I'm not even certain I'm in favor of the death penalty... Anyways, again my sincerest apologies to anyone who feels the material was inappropriate. I do understand why you would feel that way. I certainly never intended to create any controversy here, and hope the spirit of musical expression will continue without negative distraction ... 
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Interesting that the offended party has a quote from an adult film star as his signature file....
Had this gone down in another state and not been close to home, would you still be offended?
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Quote:
Interesting that the offended party has a quote from an adult film star as his signature file....
Had this gone down in another state and not been close to home, would you still be offended?
Jamie Gillis was initially a mainstream actor and this quote applies to practically any human endeavor. As such it is used as literary irony. Interesting that you're only aware of his later work. A fan perhaps?
Insensitiveness is in poor taste no matter the zip code. And thanks for making my point about the provocative nature of the post.
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Quote:
Interesting that the offended party has a quote from an adult film star as his signature file....
Eddie,
That comes off as a personal attack like you are baiting Bob to pick a fight. His choice of a quote in his signature file has nothing to do with this song discussion.
I like both you guys and I'd hate to see this spiral into something it shouldn't between you two. Why not just let it go.
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Quote:
I don't appreciate this post. There are plenty of other places you can express your opinions and feelings on this subject. Song or no song, this is out of line.
Bob
Josie, this is the original post, containing the words "I don't appreciate this post."
I don't appreciate any post containing a quote from someone in "that" industry.
Is his "I don't appreciate" worth more than mine?
I am out of this one and will block that user so I don't see his posts.
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Quote:
I don't dispute his right to express his opinions, or his right to freedom of speech. I just don't think this is the place to do it. Besides that, it's insensitive and provocative at this point in time and at the very least, in poor taste.
Bob
1) censorship always begins with a rational explanation of why certain things cannot be said (but that still doesn't justify censorship)
2) Comparing true liberty to a semblance of liberty that restricts words and behavior to certain "allowable" places is like comparing an untethered dog to one that is tied to a tree. The ability to move about in a restricted space is not my idea of liberty
And once that definition of liberty becomes law, the leash tends to get shorter and shorter until it becomes a noose.
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BTW, I respect your right to protest as much as I respect Mike's right to say the things that you protest. Whether or not we agree with what another man says, we should defend to the death his right to say it. Healthy protest leads to dialog. Dialog leads people to rethink. Mike willingly rethought his position and removed the song as a result of your protest. We didn't need a rule or law to get consensus. In my mind, there is a big difference between open disagreement and censorship. In open dialog, both opinions are allowed. In censorship, only the opinion of the party with the biggest gun is allowed. I recently read a book on oppression in North Korea, based on interviews with people who had fled to the South. It's a very eye-opening book... I can't imagine anyone reading it then advocating opinion control The name of the book is NOTHING TO ENVY http://www.amazon.com/Nothing-Envy-Ordinary-Lives-North/dp/0385523904It's reminiscent of Orwell's 1984, only real life and current. Just because it happens to other people doesn't make it fiction.
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Here’s a different take on it. I didn’t listen to the song. It was already deleted. I wouldn’t have listened to the song if it was still up.
Trying to silence people for their views is NEVER a good idea. If my neighbor was a member of the KKK, I really don’t want to have to sneak over and peek in his basement window to find out. I’d rather he/she display it proudly on their front porch.
Then I’d know who I was dealing with. It wouldn’t mean their ideas had merit. It would simply mean everyone else would know this persons views.
Maybe if the piece of human debris who shot the people in CO had felt free to talk about his screwed up ideas, then maybe someone could have stopped him before he acted.
Forget heaven or hell. Use a little common sense and don’t try to police thought and the expression of it.
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very well said, Bob!
I agree!
which prompts me to add:
You have a way of putting a complex thought into very succinct sound bytes. That is highly desirable in lyric-writing. I hope you are using this talent musically.
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I am not sure how you support "free speech" and anti-censorship by trying to silence Hawgly from expressing his opinion (ha, ha).
By the way, first amendment rights don't really apply here on this privately owned message board.
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Quote:
I am not sure how you support "free speech" and anti-censorship by trying to silence Hawgly from expressing his opinion (ha, ha).
but I DIDN'T forbidhis opinion. In the spirit of free dialogue, I merely offered an opposing point of view
Quote:
By the way, first amendment rights don't really apply here on this privately owned message board.
1st amendment rights aren't the point of this discussion. Did I say anything about 1st amendment rights? No, I didnm't. Your objection is a classic example of turning the discussion into a different question altogether in order to mmuddy the logic.
My point is repeatedly over and over in all of these discussions that when you start repressing what people can say and where they can say it, it doesn't change extreme attitudes, it only sends them underground looking for another way to vent. In my opinion, those who push for the silence of another point of view believe that point of view has more credibility than their own, and so they want to limit what others can hear to include only what the stifler likes to hear. It is a form of thought control and that is not a good thing.
Please read the book I mentioned then come back with your thoughts.
By the way, I understand that you are not a lone in your thinking, and that all points of view should have a means of expression. I'm glad you speak up. Dialog is good. Repression, not so much.
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