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I am working on an article pertaining to old organs found in most Masonic Lodges. Much of the music has fallen by the wayside, and I've even seen old pump organs sitting in the corner, unused. The hymns would be recognized by 'old timers' as they are tunes that were transportable, similar to the US national anthem which appears in many old books as a Masonic tune back as far as the 1760's. There is a dearth of people able to play organs, and even I prefer my keyboards to the 'organ in the corner'. However the debate we have at times pertains to the tone, and what the organ can do. Someone too, a B4 (a b3 with a 'skirt') and threw it out, putting in a 2 manual Yamaha circa 1975 saying it was a much better machine, the old one had a starter and it was finicky, best to show up very early to try 20 times to start the beast. Back to the question, as I'm trying to find pro sounding banks as examples of how a hollywood bound musical arrangement would sound if they paid big bucks for the sound bank. I assume, like piano sounds, there are expensive versions of this which studios now use instead of having an organ in the corner of the studio. Thoughts, examples, and opinions are welcome. I wish they had asked me about that B4, but it was a committee of non musical types thinking they did a good thing scrapping it. Life marches on, but my marching days are over. Can't blow the horn in a marching band and carry a cane, and can't walk without the cane. Got to run, I took off my sweatshirt, had a 'jerk' and sliced my forehead with my thumbnail and red stuff is running in my eye. I'm going to get me a manicure, I'm dangerous with the scissors. 
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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John, don't know exactly what kind of organ sounds you're looking for, but Garritan recently released "Classic Pipe Organs". I'm no expert, but those sound pretty thunderous to me. If, on the other hand, you are looking for Farfisa, Vox or B3...never mind.
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2025, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Quote:
Back to the question, as I'm trying to find pro sounding banks as examples of how a hollywood bound musical arrangement would sound if they paid big bucks for the sound bank. I assume, like piano sounds, there are expensive versions of this which studios now use instead of having an organ in the corner of the studio.
This is exactly what the new Kurzweil PC3K is designed to do in addition to being a great all around gigging keyboard for a regular schlep like me. I remember reading articles years ago in Keyboard magazine about studios using the K2500 or 2600 for exactly that kind of thing and I've read interviews with musical directors of repertory companies who have a K2600 set up to handle all the music in a live show using custom sounds setups involving sequences and live playing. Some of the new vids for the PC3K talk about how Kurz was being begged by these same guys to come up with a new board as a replacement for those old K's because they've been used constantly for over 15 years now and are wearing out. The just released K series is called the K because 'almost' all of the old samples/patches etc from the K2600 will load right in so these guys can carry on with a brand new much improved keyboard. There's tons of other keyboards that have great sounds but there's something about Kurz's VAST programming system that these very high level sound designers love and they must have another Kurz.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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OP
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Thanks guys. It's an article I'm writing so I'm looking at the angles. Which is a transposition of angels.
A church in 'town' bought a huge pipe organ, a Roland / Rogers type of thing. Very few pipes, plus speakers, and it looks like a theatre organ. A real beast. Most of the sounds are like my Roland/Rogers W50 that was 2400 bucks many years ago. I got it at a discount, some church brought it back scratched and without the manual. On line manuals are a great thing.
I'm just mucking about before the writing happens. Which is my process.
I am presently of the opinion that a laptop and good 88 synth is usually better than any of the 10 year old organs you run across in most churches. (If you add the right speakers) (and the left ones too.)
Purists argue about the sound of the pipes. For some the pipes are calling, for others...??
I'll look at that stuff, thanks again.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I can't help much with non Hammond stuff except to say the old K2600 with the sampling option had a huge legacy third party sound library so that sort of thing is probably available. I know on my PC3 there is the full orchestral soundbank and it includes a whole bunch of individual pipe patches in varying configurations like flute pipes, diapson (or whatever it is) plus other terms I didn't understand when I scrolled through it all. I have no experience with those types of organ sounds but I would bet the ability is there to do pretty much all of that. If you really want to research this pm me, I can put you in touch with one of the Kurz developers who would know. All I can say is from what I've read over the years when it comes to this sort of orchestral stuff in the studios, in Vegas and other big live show venues Kurzweil is right there at the top of the heap. I think at this level, pros prefer a good solid keyboard that has all of this on board rather than computers and software.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Part of the mix is that original music that has survived was done by Mozart, Haydn, and others. I suspect much of it was lost. The largest compendium published first in Dublin and then in the US includes social music of the day, stuff to sing for 'fun', as opposed to ritual music. Ritual music to some extent survived. Then it morphed in the US to parallel the social norms of the day. Bear in mind that the masonic experience, a fact which was 'secret', but now due to research and the net is to be inclusive and tolerant of all religions, creeds, skin colour etc. Thus the secret, that you would sup and fellowship with people who were not of your particular church etc. The original music was not for organ, but scored as Mozart's was, for horns and strings, and voice. So it is common to find pump organs, (reed organs) and other instruments sitting in corners of lodges, part of the furniture, but now unused. Organists are hard to come by. And we have become more tolerant, and the present need for this type of thought is less important. Some religions, (catholic of note) outright ban members from joining, because they cannot tolerate openness. My present work is to figure out how to include music, at a reasonable cost, without muss and fuss. But the history is interesting, certainly as it pertains to Sibelius, who quit mainstream composition to focus on ritual music, much of which is in the archives of the Grand Lodge of New York, who assisted the revival of the 'craft', in Finland. I will do but a cursory examination of this, but hope to recreate some of the original music with some degree of authenticity. Thanks for your insights. PS, Perhaps a good example of a hymn which appears in books from most denominations is the Russian Hymn, and it is recognizable so I might use that as an example, done on numerous organs via sound fonts etc.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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