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Hi All Here is a new song I have just finished. I read a book (and saw the movie) by Jon Krakauer called “Into the Wild” about a young boy who walks into the wilderness in Alaska. A wonderful book and movie. One of the quotes I have kept from this book is as follows: “So many people live with unhappy circumstances and yet will not take initiative to change their situation because they are conditioned to a life of security, conformity and conservatism, all of which may appear to give one piece of mind, but in reality nothing is more damaging to the adventuress spirit within man than a secure future. The very basic core of a man’s living spirit is his passion for adventure. The joy of life comes from encounters with new experiences, and hence there is no greater joy than to have an endlessly changing horizon, for each day to have a new and different sun”. I have tried with this song to capture the essence of this quotation. As always, please let me know what you think Too Scared
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Hi Jo
This is basically a good song, I would love to engineer your vocal to bring it out of the mix and separate it from the backing a little so that there is separation. Perhaps you can experiment with that.
Also a key change might be good for a song like this before the last build and chorus.
Good effort though well done.
Regards
Darren
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You have a beautiful voice! Very well written lyrics! Thanks for sharing!
My TunesPsalm 57:7 My heart, O God, is steadfast, my heart is steadfast; I will sing and make music.
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Very nice song.
It's good as it is.
I liked the last line of the lyrics. Good idea.
Guenter
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Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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Darren - Thanks for this. It would be great if I can send you some screen shots of the effects I used on the vocals and you can give me some advice? Let me know if I can.
PF Fantastic – Thanks for listening and commenting
Guenter – Thanks, glad you enjoyed it
Peter – Thanks for stopping by to give it a listen.
One observation I have had from the guy I did a song writing course through is that he feels that the chorus is not different enough from the verse. It does not stand out and say “I am the chorus”. I would be interested to know what are the views here. I look forward to hearing from anybody willing to express their views.
Regards
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Hi Josie, There's a lot to like about this song. The premise is a good one and would certainly have universal appeal. I like the waltz feel, it suits the song's mood. Lastly, I also really like the way you've arranged, performed and mixed the work. (That all deserves a round of applause in my book!) Seeing that you asked for input about the chorus ... ... to an extent, I agree with what was mentioned. It doesn't standout as significantly different from the verse. Keep in mind, though, that there are a number of songs that this is also true of and it hasn't stopped them from being successful ("Where Do You Go To My Lovely" by Peter Sarstedt, for example). One reason that the above similarity exists is because the melody is driven by the lyric movement and in both verse and chorus, the lyric movement is very similar. To change the chorus: (a) try starting it a third higher than you do now; (b) change the syllabic motion; (c) start the chorus on a different chord than what the verse starts on. In relation to (b), if you're interested, try making a 4-line chorus instead of a 6 line one. Because the verse has 6 lines, a 4 line chorus sounds different. Also, holding the notes longer in the chorus than in the verse would also help.  In the above 16 bars ... - I've changed the motion of the lyrics by holding on to "too" and "scared".
- The chorus is reduced to 4 lines
- The rhyme scheme is XXAA instead of the XXAXXA scheme found in the verse
These changes should help it stand out a little more. You could also try starting the chorus a third higher as already mentioned (if you want to keep the same chord progression). It would also be an interesting exercise to try placing each "too" on beat 2 of the bar rather than beat 1. This could add a whole new feel that might work and it would help the chorus stand out a little more. Please keep in mind that what I've presented are only suggestions to try and to assist with explaining my thinking. Please feel free to throw them all on the rubbish pile  I stand by what I said at the beginning of this post. There's a lot to like about this song and all that I've said should be balanced against that. All the best, Noel
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Hi Jo Quote:
One observation I have had from the guy I did a song writing course through is that he feels that the chorus is not different enough from the verse. It does not stand out and say “I am the chorus”. I would be interested to know what are the views here. I look forward to hearing from anybody willing to express their views.
As Noel says knocking the chorus up a bit is probably the best advice. I don't think the chords are the issue a lot of my songs including "Dance With Me Again" posted on this forum start the chorus with the same chord the verse starts with, the differentiation is in the notation. I think what Noel is saying was my first observation and that was why I suggested doing a key change to break things up.
I'd be happy to look at your vocals sound, are you able to send me some stems one of the backing track the other of your main vocal. When recording never add any compression if your mic technique isn't great a limiter may help with a -1 dbu cut off at the input stage of your sound card, but record as hot as your system will allow before it distorts, I never normalize any gain on low audio recordings I record it again.
With screen shots I use my ears rather than my eyes when mixing so its hard to tell from that.
Hope to hear how you get creative with the advice
Darren x
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PS If you do send me stems take all your plugins FX off just want the raw audio files.
D x
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Joanne, I like this song as it is written. It's a good folk song. And I especially liked the ironing the clothes line at the end - very creative. I also enjoyed your vocal. The harmonies are a little heavy and mechanical sounding. Sometimes less is more. Your musical production chops are improving so kudos there too. The music production could be varied a little bit more in the different sections - verse, chorus, bridge. Personally I think that's all that's really needed here for the style of song that this is unless you were to do a rewrite of the melody. Also it is great to have people offer to do your mixing, however you will learn more and faster by doing it yourself and asking for feedback on your mix just like in your writing.  To answer your writing question, there are basic principles but there are no blanket rules in songwriting. One size does NOT fit all. Yes, there should be contrast between verse and chorus. However, the genre of the song is important. Certain styles of Folk music do not necessarily have as much contrast as a country or pop song might. The most important thing to do is to critically listen and actually study the specific style where your song fits. Notice how the great songs in your genre handle contrast. You can achieve contrast in song sections - by changing the melody and rhythm, or by doing something different and unexpexted with the arrangement like subtracting, adding, or changing instruments. You can also change your chord sequence and start each section on a different chord BUT you don't have to do that. Here is a short video lesson on how to contrast a chorus over the same chord progression as a verse. This is not a folk song but the principle is the same and should be helpful to you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RgCWt17Jb0
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Josie and Noel
Thanks so much for taking the time to comment and to give me some guidance. I am really learning so much from the people on this forum. I know this is NOT a song writing forum and that there are other places where I can go to get input on songs but I really find it difficult to find the time to contribute to two different forums and get to know the people on two different forums, so I hope nobody minds too much. I am going to try and put a few of the suggestions into reality.
Darren
I think Josie is right in that I really do need to learn to do this myself. I will mix a new version shortly (with the song writing tips given) and will let you know, if you don’t mind giving it another listen.
Best regards
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Hi Jo
Will give the song another listen anytime
D
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You're doing great. Keep on that path. You know what you need to do. Just keep doing it.
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Hi Floyd
Thanks so much for giving it a listen. I really appreciate all you have taught me in a very short time.
Joanne
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This is really good song that only needs a little touch up to put it over the top IMHO.
I like your vocal and backing tracks, good job on those. I agree with what Noel and Josie have said especially Josie. I would try only one harmony part that is up a third from you lead vocal, that is if you keep the vocal as it is now. If you change the lead line you would have to change the harmony as well but I would only use one harmony voice.
Just my thoughts
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Hi Mario
Thanks for this. I am going to try and sing the harmonies myself rather than use the generated ones. I will try using only one and see what it sounds like.
Regards
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