PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Off-Topic JV 1010 - STILL

Mine is recognized as class compliant in XP -- and check the Manual, the .pdf is online at M-Audio, it says that after explaining how to install their drivers, matter of fact they use up almost a full page explaining that. I thought it kinda funny 'cuz I was likely the only guy who read the entire manual first.

There may be confusion because there is an older M-Audio single MIDI channel called the MIDISport IIRC that is NOT class compliant. They may have even made some UNOs at one time that weren't, dunno.


--Mac

I just have the Edirol. One midi out one midi in Usb. Works without drivers.

Hi all...

I'm so sorry for putting up such a long post. I should have been more specific in my answers to all of the suggestions you were giving me since I first started asking for help. But even though it is long, I believe that it is very in depth and I have tried to make it as clear as possible so that it may help you to understand where I am with this problem.

Real Band "MIDI Drv

Input Drivers

SB Audigy MIDI Port {E880} (This is on the top of the list)
SB Audigy MIDI Port ll {E880}
E-MU Xboard 25 (This is my MIDI keyboard controller (USB connection) - it only shows on the list when it is plugged into the BACK of the computer and turned on (and yes... I have tried putting it at the top of the list and choosing it - can't move this one to the top, however, but I choose it anyway)

Output Driver(s)

SB Audigy Synth B {E880} (This is on the top of the list)
Microsoft MIDI Mapper
SB Audigy Sw Synth {E880}
SB Audigy Synth A {E880}
SB MIDI Port {E880}
SB Audigy MIDI Port ll {E880}
Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth
E-MU Xboard 25 (This is my MIDI controller - it only shows on the list when it is plugged into the BACK of the computer and is turned on... it's a USB connection. (and yes... I have tried putting it at the top of the list and choosing it) ...this is what shows when I have my MIDI interface ("Supra MD 100") plugged into the BACK of the computer. I also plug it in BEFORE opening Real Band. When Windows XP Pro SP 3 installs it, it says "New Hardware found" and then "USB Audio Device" and then it recognizes it by name - "MD 100." It then says that the device is ready to use. However, like I said... when I open Real Band, it isn't in either drivers list.

Control Panel/Sounds and Audio Devices Properties

Default Device
SB Audigy Audio {E880} (this is the only choice I have here)

Sound recording
SB Audigy Audio {E880}
SB Audigy Audio {E880}

MIDI Music Playback
SB Audigy Audio B {E880} (this is the default device. My other choices here are:
SB Audigy Sw synth {E880}
SB Audigy Sw synth A {E880}
SB Audigy MIDI Port {E880}
SB Audigy MIDI Port ll {E880}
Microsoft Wavetable SW Synth

Control Panel/Hardware/Device Manager/Sound,Video, Game Controllers

My MIDI interface ("Supra MD 100") is listed here as "USB Audio Device.” My MIDI keyboard controller, E-Mu Xboard 25 (USB connection), shows here when it is plugged into the BACK of the computer and turned on.
As stated... all of this is what I see with the MIDI interface, ("Supra MD 100") and my MIDI keyboard (USB connection) plugged into the BACK of the computer.

rharv: "Are you looking in the 'Options-midi devices' section and seeing an audio device??
In PGMusic products it should be recognized in the midi devices area... sounds like you are
looking in the audio area."
Yes... I'm positive that I'm looking in the "Options-midi devices" section and not the "Audio device."

Silvertones: “If you are running us around in circles here for fun, it has happened before, don't.”

I can assure you that this isn’t the case. I was actually embarrassed to start this new thread for fear that you guys would just get fed up hearing me whine about my problem and not bother trying to help me anymore. I can see your point – it’s starting to look like a “boy who cried wolf” situation. I should point out that I’m 53 years old (young???) and surely would much rather be making music than trying to waste anybody’s time. All I want to do is to make music with my stuff and you can believe me when I say that I have, and do, appreciate any and all the suggestions and advice that I have been getting in trying to get me up and running.

1.I asked you this:

OK do you have this:

1. Midi Out from the keyboard to the MIDI in of the cable
Yes

2.MIDI out of the cable to the MIDI in of the JV

Yes – And as per a suggestion from Mac, I even tried switching the cables – nothing.

3. In BIAB-- OPT > MIDI/Audio Driver setup > MIDI in driver = USB( whatever that cable is called) > MIDI out Driver = USB( whatever that cable is called)

The cable ("Supra MD 100") doesn’t show up in the MIDI/Audio Driver Setup in BIAB OR Real Band.

4. Is your JV setup in performance mode so that it can play all midi channels (OMNI)

Yes… in fact, I’ve tried ALL of the modes – nothing.

5. Are any lights blinking on the JV

No.

“Your responses was this:
Well... I have gone over and done everything that everyone has suggested I do.”

I was generalizing my answer instead of going into specific detail… but I DID do everything that was suggested by everyone – including you… sorry...my mistake.

I also forgot to mention.
I told you to hook it up just like you did in the old days with Cakewalk. This was ignored.
In the old days YOU didn't have USB so it would have been hooked up with a MIDI adapter cable to the joystick port of your sound card. That's how MIDI was implemented on cheap cards.
You now have an Audidgy2 card in your computer. It has a joy stick port. Why aren't you using the old joystick>MIDI adapter cable just like the old days.

In the old days, the only way I could get the JV 1010 to work was to use it with Windows 98. I had one of those drawers that you put your hard drive into and it allowed you to swap them. I couldn’t use the old version of Cakewalk and the JV 1010 in Win XP because of a terrible latency problem that existed when I DID try. When I got BIAB I figured that my problems would be over – I figured that I could start using Windows XP for doing my music. Believe me… your suggestion wasn’t ignored. I guess I should have explained why I didn’t want to go back to the old days with Cakewalk, and even worse, Windows 98.

Mac: “Please list everything you see on the LH Input and RH output side of your pgmusic software's MIDI driver window.”
I should have done this a long time ago – as Sivertones suggested. See above.

Gary: “# Make sure that the MIDI Out from the controller goes to the MIDI IN of the MIDI Interface.” “(Some interfaces, like the M-Audio Uno seem to be reversed, so if after making sure that everything I tell you that follows is correct, and it still doesn't work, switch the cables)”
Check and check again for switching the cables.
“#Make sure the MIDI Out from the Interface goes to the MIDI In of the JV1010.”
Check.
#”Open Real Band”
Done
“#Go the MIDI Driver icon on the Menu bar and open it. You'll see your MIDI interface, probably along with a few other things in the Input, and Output sides.”
Nope… as mentioned above – the interface doesn’t show up in either list. But my MIDI keyboard controller does when it is connected to the BACK of the computer and turned on. I’ve tried using it but no go. If it ISN’T connected and turned on, Real Band, when I open it, tells me that “E-MU Xboard 25” isn’t installed.
“#Select your MIDI inteface on both sides, so that only the interface is highlighted.”
My interface ("Supra MD 100" USB MIDI cable) doesn’t show up on either side in the MIDI setup. In fact, the name “Supra MD 100” doesn’t show up anywhere in Windows – it calls it “USB Audio Device.”
#”Press Move Selected Devices To Top”
Can’t do this as my MIDI interface isn’t listed here. Nor is the “USB Audio Device.”
#”Check and make sure that the Re-Route MIDI Playback to default DXi/VSTi Synth is NOT checked. Latency should auto adjust. Close the MIDI Driver setup Window.”
Done.
“#Click on the Preferences Button on the Menu. Select the 6-MIDI tab.”
OK… done.
“#Click on the MIDI Thru button. Check to make sure Enable Thru is checked, Track Specific is checked.”
Yes and yes… done… both checked.
“#From the Options Menu, select Show Piano, if you don't already have it showing.”
It is showing.
#”Play something on the controller. The Piano bar should show you the notes you are playing. At this point, if you do not see the notes playing, switch the cables on the interface.”
Yes… the notes are showing as I play them on the controller and there is sound. But the sound isn’t from the JV 1010 – in fact, it is off. I don’t know where the sound is coming from because I don’t even have any MIDI patch picked in Real Band. The sound is the grand piano. When I DO pick a patch in Real Band it DOES change the patch to the one I picked – but it’s a general MIDI patch. If I go back and de-select the patch (it shows “---“) the general MIDI grand piano still plays. When I switch the cables the notes I play on the controller stop showing in Real Band.
#” When you see the notes on the keyboard, you should hear the JV1010 playing.”
As I said above… the sound isn’t coming from the JV 1010 - it is a general MIDI sound even though I don’t have ANY patches selected.
“#If you do not hear the JV1010 playing, create a new song, with no data, click on Track 1.”
OK… that’s done. I do NOT hear the JV 1010 playing – but I do hear the general MIDI piano even though it hasn’t been selected from the patch list. The patch list shows “---“. Also, the LED light on the JV 1010 isn’t flashing when I play a note.
“#Right click in the Track Configure area, and make sure the Port is set to your midi interface, that the Channel is set to 1, and that the Track Type is MIDI.”
I can’t set the port to my MIDI interface because the interface isn’t there. I did set the Channel to 1 and I made sure that the track type is MIDI.
“If that doesn't help you, I'm not sure what else is going on.”
That makes two of us, Gary. Perhaps you might be starting to get a sense of my frustration, huh?
“If you can't get it to work, tell me exactly what type of Interface, and what shows up in the MIDI Device Driver dialog window.”
See above for the content of the MIDI Device Driver dialog window.
My interface is a USB MIDI cable… it looks EXACTLY the same as the one Mac was telling me about – the M-Audio Uno. Mine is a “Supra MD 100.” But there isn’t any name brand on the package that it came in – it just says “USB MIDI Converter.” No driver or installation disk came with it. There is no web site on the package. I have done a LOT of searching on the web for the “Supra MD 100” hoping to find some kind of driver for it but Google doesn’t find anything about a “Supra MD 100.” At Mac’s suggestion I downloaded and installed the drivers for the M-Audio Uno. Before installing this driver I made sure to remove the driver that Windows was using. Once installed I plugged in the USB MIDI converter. It didn’t see the new driver – Windows installed its own drivers again. I tried to “update driver” and when I pointed Windows to the new driver it couldn’t recognize it. I also tried to use the Roland driver – same result. Please know that before I installed ANY driver I made sure that any other driver that was there was removed. For added measures I even rebooted the computer after every removal and installation.
As you may have noticed I am no expert with this stuff. However, the last time I was working with my music – quite a few years ago - I was using an older version of Cakewalk – I think it was the first Sonar to come out. I was able to use the JV 1010 but with a price. I had to remove my HD that Windows XP was on and replace it with another one with Windows 98. That was the only way it would work. At that time I was able to download a patch map from a now defunct (I think) web site called “lil’ Chips.” It was a very small patch map but at least it allowed me to use SOME of the JV 1010 patches.
If I remember correctly, the reason I had to use Windows 98 was because of extreme latency in XP. I don’t think there was an option to use ASIO in that version of Cakewalk – but I could be wrong. I just know that I could only use the JV 1010 properly in Windows 98. Roland stopped supporting the JV 1010 before Win XP even came out.
But… with the USB MIDI interface it should be a breeze to start using it again without any problems. (underline the word “SHOULD.”)
When I started reading about BIAB with all of it’s RealTracks and RealBand and listened to the fantastic sounds they produced, I got the itch to start working with music again. I purchased the UltraPac and have no regrets about buying it. I couldn’t wait to get started – I patiently worked with BIAB using the manual that came with it and have made progress – I knew that there would be a learning curve before I bought it. However, I do pick up things fast.
I really hate being a pain in the butt to you guys but… this is the only place I’ve found where I may be able to find the solution to my problem. I can honestly say that if/when I do get the synth up and running I won’t be bothering you anymore… I’d have more time to just read the forums – especially the “hints and tricks” and keep learning.
Again… thanks to ALL of you for your help and patience.
Bobby

Try this:

With RealBand completely closed down, open up your RB folder and locate the following two files and move them out of the folder to your desktop:

RB.CFG

RealBand.INI

Don't copy them move them out of there. Keep them on the desktop just in case this doesn't work, you can return them and not lose "position" as it were.

These two files will be regenerated when you open RealBand, it should return a lot of settings to factory defaults and also run the soundcard and MIDI finding wizard again.

First connect all USB that you intend to use.

Then start up RealBand and follow any prompts that come up.

RB should "see" your USB MIDI connections.


--Mac

This thread is quite long and complex so please forgive me if this was mentioned and I just missed it. Two things:
1. I Don't see a mention of audio connections. What do you have your JV hooked up to for sound?
2. What is a "Supra MD 100" and why are you using it? I tried a google search and nothing came up. That sounds like one of those cheapo Chinese things that sells for something like $5 or so.
You say the X-board shows up as an input device. That means the usb cable handles the midi connection to your pc and all you do is run the midi cable from the X-board to your JV. This is from the X-board manual:

MIDI Connection

The Xboard sends MIDI performance
data to another MIDI
device, such as a MIDI sound
module. The Xboard always
transmits MIDI data except
when “Thru” mode is enabled.

Assuming this problem is not about you forgetting to run audio from your JV into your pc's soundcard and/or an external monitoring system, then dump that Supra whatever it is and run the midi as above.

Bob

Mac,
It's possible that there were a couple different versions of the Uno, I've had mine for a while.

Bobby,
Since your MD100 is not showing up in your Windows Sound and Audio Devices, let alone Real Band, it's not going to show up in Real Band at all.

Again, my suggestion is to purchase a reputable MIDI interface, M-Audio, Edirol, etc.

IF you have one of those joystick to MIDI cable cables that go into the back of the Creative Card, you do not need USB, that cable will still work with your JV1010. In fact, with that cable, you can connect the controller via the USB, AND use the cable to output to the JV1010.

Otherwise, buy a new interface.

Gary

In the old days, the only way I could get the JV 1010 to work was to use it with Windows 98. I had one of those drawers that you put your hard drive into and it allowed you to swap them. I couldn’t use the old version of Cakewalk and the JV 1010 in Win XP because of a terrible latency problem that existed when I DID try. When I got BIAB I figured that my problems would be over – I figured that I could start using Windows XP for doing my music. Believe me… your suggestion wasn’t ignored. I guess I should have explained why I didn’t want to go back to the old days with Cakewalk, and even worse, Windows 98.


Bottom line:
1. JV 1010 is a piece of HARDWARE it has no latency.
2. It only works with MIDI
3. It had to be hooked to your old computer with a MIDI cable through the joystick port of the sound card( or you had some other MIDI card installed)
4. Your new computer has an Audidgy 2 it has a game port thus it has a MIDI port--
5. Your Audidgy shows up as a MIDI driver
You have to have had a DB15 > MIDI cable back in the older days-- where is it?
YOU DON"T NEED TO FUSS WITH THE USB ROUTE

OK a light bulb just went on in my brain. Bobby per chance in the old days were you just recording the AUDIO from the JV 1010 into the computer into Cakewalk? That would explain a lot. If that's the case you wouldn't have the mentioned cable as you never hooked MIDI up to your computer. The cable is available and in my opinion still the best route.
http://www.cablestogo.com/product.asp?ca...CFQE0xgodPgMiSQ

Hi Mac...

I have searched and re-searched the RB folders for the files you mentioned... even did a Windows search for them. But they're not there. Here are all the "RB"/"RealBand files in the folder:

rb.chw
RealBand.exe
RealBand Users guide.pdf
RealBand.exe.manifest
RealBand.tip
RealBand.tpb
rbseq32.dll

I've also checked RB's sub folders... they're not there.

Whether this will fix my problem or not, I just ordered the M-Audio USB Uno cable. After hearing about so many other people who have one say that they don't have any problems with it I have decided to give it a try as it comes with drivers.

Bobby

Hi Gary...

I think you're right about the cable I have... like I said... there is no "brand name" on the package that it came in. The "MD 100" name is only on the unit itself. It came without any drivers. And yes... I really didn't pay a lot for it. I just ordered the "M-Audio USB Uno" as I've heard a lot of good things about it. And the other thing I like about it is you can download the latest drivers for it from their site.

Bobby

Hi Silvertones...

No... in the old days I wasn't recording just audio from the JV 1010... I was using MIDI cables that I plugged into the front panel of the Audigy - it has any connection you can think of... there were 2 MIDI cables used. Also plugged into the front of the Audigy were the 2 output cables from the JV 1010 that passed the actual sound into the Audigy. Once connected I had an octopus hanging out of the front of my computer and when I would remove them when I wasn't working on music it would be an unwanted chore to hook it all up again when I wanted to resume music work. I know that if I were to get the cable you suggested, I should be able to get things going. However, the idea of plugging in one cable (3 when you count the output jacks) really appeals to me - I would love to give it a real try before saying that it's impossible to do so.

I should also add that I have tried every which plugin configuration that I could think of with the MIDI cables I was using in the old days. I was becoming obsessed with it. I would try something, it wouldn't work, and so I'd leave it in frustration and go sit down. However, my mind wouldn't quit thinking about it... I would think up something else to try, try it, fail, and leave it, only to think of ANOTHER way to hook it up... this was going on for a couple of days... I mean, I was spending HOURS on it. Thus the reason to come back into the forum again at the risk of becoming a pain in the you-know-what.

I have to look into the fact that the USB MIDI connector is the culprit... it is a cheap one that didn't come with any drivers. Windows installs one for it, but that's as far as it gets... I don't see it anywhere anymore after the driver "installation" is finished.

My new cable is a last resort for hooking it up with a USB connection - this is my preference. It will be here sometime this week. I'll keep you guys informed once I get it.

Thanks
Bobby

Bobby, I know how frustrating this can be so I'm trying to be gentle here. Did you not read my last post above? You don't need another USB connector. You're X-board is the midi interface, get it? You already said somewhere above that the X-board shows up as an input device. That's it then. The midi connection to your PC is done. To test this open RB, set it up as explained by Gary and hit the keys. Without the JV connected, you will still see the piano display light up and you can play or record a softsynth like the VSC or even your motherboards sound chip if you want. Now you only have to add your JV to the chain and I quoted you what the X-board manual says. Look on the back of your X-board and you'll see a midi plug. Connect that to your JV and then the only issues are set the correct midi channel and route the audio just like you did in the old days.
This can be tricky sometimes but man, not like what you're going through unless something is physically defective. That will play with your head.

Bob

OK I'll abandon the Audigy MIDI scene as you want USB.
Jazzmammal is absolutly correct. Your keyboard controller is a MIDI in and out interface. It shows up in the input and output side. The only thing I'm not sure of, as I don't have the X-board manual, is how to pass on to the midi port on the x-board what comes in on the USB connection of the x-board.

Play with your head??? Heh... you're not kidding. Even my wife is starting to get worried about me sitting here for hours, pulling wires out, putting wires in... and it just goes on and on.

However... today is a fresh new day... and I was able to read what you said - and UNDERSTAND what you are saying. Sometimes when you're almost brain dead it gets hard to do this.

OK... I set up the way you told me - regular MIDI cable coming out of the Xboard 25 going to the in plug on the JV. Connect the output jacks on the JV to the Audigy so I can hear it if something comes out. When I press a key on the controller, lo and behold, the little light flashes on the JV and sound comes out of my speakers. I should tell you that I have the Xboard selected on both the in and out sides in the midi setup in RB. Things sound really good. For now, I'm picking my patches and channels by hand on the JV... not a problem - I can get the midi map on the PG site later. I start to record in RB... when I stop recording and play back it first tells me that "audio" was recorded as well - do I want it put on track 2? And I say no because all I want is a midi track. Once I do this, my midi notes appear so I guess it recorded it. But... when I play back what I've recorded, the notes I played show up on the piano up top and the VU meters are moving but there's no sound. I just KNOW that I'm getting close... maybe just a little more help and I'll be on my way???

So sorry to have sounded like I wasn't listening to what you guys have been telling me in the past - but like I said - after a while my brain turned to mush. Aside from what you were suggesting and telling me, I was trying to figure it out on my own as well... and ended up completely confused and frustrated.

OH... when I didn't hear any sound when I played back what I was recording I tried putting another midi cable from the midi out on the JV to the midi in on the Audigy... it didn't work and was probably wrong anyway. Back to the MIDI driver setup in RB... I have the Xboard selected as midi in and the xboard selected as midi out. If I pick the Audigy as midi out all I get is the card's synth instead of the JV's when I play back what I've recorded.

We're getting there - I hope!!!
Bobby

Escellent! We're almost there. You're confusing audio and midi. Your X-board is sending midi commands to your JV, the JV is producing the sound. By saying no to keeping the audio recording you're left with just the midi. Midi makes no sound on it's own, it's only computer digital commands that tell a synth what to play. You can now take your midi opus and use it to play any sound in your arsenal of synths. It may have started out as a piano part but you can assign a synth to that track and have it play a zither or flute or anything else if you want to. Since this thread is all about you wanting to use your JV, set up that as your synth. Now it's totally up to you what to do with that midi data. You don't really need to record the audio until you're sure the midi track is what you want. You have extensive midi editing capabilities in RB so if you played a piano part or whatever part, you may have fluffed a note or two (or dozens in my case) and you can either rerecord the midi live, maybe just punch in one bar or go into the piano roll and edit it. Whatever method you use, when it's done, then record that audio track.
Glad you got it up and running.

Bob

Hi Bob... and everyone else...

Isn't life grand??? With a lot of help from you guys and a little bit more of myself experimenting some more, I am finally able to use my JV to record and play back in RB!!!

Perhaps someone may have told me this before, and if they did, please accept my apologies for not getting it when you told me. It has been a trying few days as far as getting the JV to work and there was so much going on in my head I got to the point where it was all a blur.

What I had to do is set the Xboard to "thru" in order to get something I record to play back in RB. I also had to go to prefs, go to "Thru" and check "Enable Thru" and then change the "Thru Method" from "Track Specific" to "Global" so that all the tracks I recorded played back at the same time. One last quick question - is there a way to save these settings so that I don't have to make them every time I open a new project in RB?

As I said... isn't life GRAND???

Thanks to all
Bobby

Did I say..."What I had to do is set the Xboard to "thru" in order to get something I record to play back in RB. I also had to go to prefs, go to "Thru" and check "Enable Thru" and then change the "Thru Method" from "Track Specific" to "Global" so that all the tracks I recorded played back at the same time."

Opps... really doesn't work that way... especially the "Prefs" settings... going to have to work on this tomorrow... I'm all wiped out from today's excitement... heh...

Bobby.

U dere ahre jus haf dat lite tete fer les canadiens se sonts aux playoffs.

Ca va passer hien?

But we loose the curling to Scotland...merde.

Too bad luckyeh les expos sonts ....vendues....

acetterheure ou asture ou a cette heure, catch dat patch map and stick dat in with the bb folder and voila, all dose patches seront disponibles...

Can you tell yet I was forman for la drave? La pitoune or 4 foot or 8 foot down the river, blow dem jams and sing the log driver's waltz at the bar after the road she's ok for go to town. Val D'or, nice place in June when them blackflies so tick you can' see the ground..

I make the challange.

We both do dat song,

WIlliam Drummond, The Wreck of the Julie Plante

On wan dark night on Lac St. Pierre,
De win' she blow, blow, blow,
An' de crew of de wood scow "Julie Plante"
Got scar't an' run below--
For de win' she blow lak hurricane,
Bimeby she blow some more,
An' de scow bus' up on Lac St. Pierre
Wan arpent from de shore...

Or maybe the
|Jam on Jerry's Rock.....