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Journeyman
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This is where you can read about Pro Tools http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_Tools
Music is an expression that is a universal language, Never criticize anybody to harshly. They need time to grow but when they do, they do. Always be kind in what you say and do because the man upstairs is watching.
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I haven't heard anyone say that RB can't do polished work. As Rob noted, plenty of folk have demonstrated that great music can be created with RB.
There's no magic to any DAW - they all "sound" the same.
There are good reasons that people clamor for features. But it doesn't have to do with making better music. It's got to do with making it easier to make music. There are many ways to skin a cat, and the listener doesn't care how you got there.
Once you've used a tool that makes a critical workflow function easy, it's twice as painful to go back to the "old way" of doing things.
But as Rob said, if the hunt for tools is taking you away from making music, it's a refreshing change to go to a minimal tool and focus on the music instead of the plugins.
-- David Cuny My virtual singer development blogVocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?BiaB 2025 | Windows 11 | Reaper | Way too many VSTis.
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Thanks Trapper, As for Pro Tools, obviously great if you can afford it - btw, congrats on your purchase of it, but not even near the city of my ball park I'm willing to spend. <grin> Robh, To me, Reaper is surprisingly similar to T3 in many ways. The learning curve is not as big as I was initially concerned it might be. The helpful tips that Noel so graciously provided gave me a great leg up on getting going. It has all the features I'm used to using in my workflow. I've started my first project.  David, Well said. For anyone using T3 - good luck. I enjoyed using it and learned from it, I'm moving on going with RB and Reaper - onward and upward. Thank you to everybody for all the good advice and links. I appreciate each and all of you very much. Happy New Year! Josie
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Journeyman
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Josie:
How are you coming along with Reaper?
John
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I don't imagine that Greg Mackie has anything to do with T3 these days but I once imported electric components for him. I would be very happy to rattle his cage for Sundance.
Yes, Pat Marr, yet another famous name out of my past.
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Update:
Scott wrote a nice letter to the Tracktion folks who responded with a very nice reply on how to try using the original disks to get the plugins into the new version after upgrading. I have to admit I've been sorely tempted to pay the money and try their advice during moments of frustration mainly because I never realized how much I relied on my "go to" plugins all right there no having to hunt around. But I read on their forum that T5 will be out soon so I'll wait and see what they come up with before I would actually give in to that temptation.
Meanwhile, I have forged ahead learning Reaper and overall I really do like it, although I'm still finding my way around the program, especially trying to find new "go to" plugins - there are so many to try. I guess with anything new you like some things better and still miss some really nice things you had.
Anyway, nerves jangly only using it for 16 days but I dove in and did one - I posted my first mix using Reaper in the Users Showcase.
No turning back now. <grin>
Thanks again to all of you for helping me.
Josie
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Expert
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Expert
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Hey Sundance, just jumping in here with a few tips.. 1. Stick with the Cockos plugins to start with. Their EQ's, Comps, etc are all fine IMHO, and my go-to's most of the time. The only thing I don't like is their Reverb, for that I use Breverb 2 & SIR. 2. Right Click is your friend in Reaper...Right Click Everything! LOL 3. The SWS Extensions are free & a must for Reaper. 4. You can watch some good free video tutorials for V3 HERE. Tho old, a lot still applies to V4. To end with, you can go to HERE & grab a lot of pre-sets for the Cockos Effects. There are some good starting points in there. Plus the free Manual is well written. Hope this helps!!
i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
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Josie, no harm in admitting love for the Acuma plugins that were part of Tracktion 2 and 3 when it was owned by Mackie.
People paid upwards of $500 for the exact same Final Mix plugin to be used in Mackie's digital console. Exact same processing.
That's when Tracktion 3 Ultimate Edition got fire-saled for $19 at Musician's Friend and other retailers, it did signal the true end of the product, so it seemed. It also represented a ridiculous steal if you were just looking to have access to Acuma Final Mix.
You will have some trouble finding a single plugin in Reaper or any other DAW package that did the whole Final Mix processing chain, with prescribed presets. Most of the time, you have to pay for something like Isotope's Ozone or some other 'mastering' tool.
Final Mix consists of at least the following:
1. Parametric 6 band EQ feeding
2. 3 band dynamics processor feeding
3. Parametric 6 band EQ feeding
4. Limiter with soft-knee option.
The presets like 'Male Vocal', 'Rock Drums' etc. all tweaked each of those 4 stages, specific to those particular applications.
The presets were and still are a great learning tool as well as very useful for a quick spit-shine on something that one is in a hurry to post online.
Now, certainly you can create a signal chain that does all of the above, but you will be spending an inordinate amount of time tweaking each of those stages.
Make certain you understand Tracktion's method for how to gain access to the old plugins. You have to have your original install discs, and I'm not sure that they run native inside of the 64 bit version of Tracktion - you might have to get a bridge.
One thing that I'm told that Reaper has built-in is a bridge so 32 bit plugins work inside of the 64 bit code, without having to force it through a bridge, but I don't think you can use the Tracktion plugins inside of Reaper, unless you can 'host' Tracktion inside of Reaper - that's another potential option.
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I have not been able to get the Tracktion plugins to run in Reaper V3 or V4, just like some of the Cakewalk ones...
i5 3.20GHz, 32gb RAM, 1tb SSD OS, 12tb HDD, 4gb gForce vid card, 32" monitor, Audient id44, Win10 x64, BiaB/RB 2023, Reaper 6,IK Multimedia Total Studio 3.5 MAX, Waves 10
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SO..... rather than trying to hack into the program or paying the extortion fee..... Why not jump ship on it and move to Sonar/Cakewalk and get Music Creator 7 for $20? That's right... grab MC7 right now for $20. And when you register it, the key is safely stored in YOUR Cakewalk account where you can access it anytime you need....OR, simply write it down and use it any time you need to move MC7 to a new machine. I even lost the files of one of my MC versions and a simple email to Cake's tech support was followed by a return email with a download code for the software and the key. That's one reason I'm a Sonar user. Lots of my older songs were all recorded in MC4. It's a very capable DAW. Get it here: https://shop.cakewalk.com/I have run into the exact same issue. I had a D-Man PCI sound card on my first DAW. It was a W-95 machine. I needed to upgrade the OS for business and the D-Man drivers would not function with the new OS. I contacted the D-Man company for a new driver and was told essentially the same thing. I needed to upgrade the hardware because they were not planning to write driver code for the old card. $250 PCI card instantly became a paperweight,,,, and a poor one at that. That was the time I got out of music recording for a few years because my $500 investment in software and hardware was totally useless.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 10/13/15 08:26 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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FYI, I'm now running Tracktion 6, and believe it or not, the T3 plugins work just fine with it in 32 bit mode. The Tracktion folks took a tip of mine to improve their website and they paid me with a Tracktion 6 upgrade. So, I've been using all the really quite excellent T3 plugins in the 32 bit version of T6. So far I've used the mono and stereo channel strip plugins as well as Final Mix. They have recently released a very similar plugin to Final Mix as a standalone product. I haven't tried it because I have Final Mix running in Tracktion 6 without issue. https://marketplace.tracktion.com/app/tracktion-master-mix-2.html#.Vh7sdCuNCDkFinal mix was some of the crack that many of us got hooked on with Tracktion, so it is not surprising that the Tracktion guys have made a standalone VST of a similar stripe - the visuals and controls seem identical based on screenshots. I'm not sure I like the Tracktion 6 workflow as much as T3 and previous editions - but there are loads more features which I haven't yet learned. I will say that the elastique pitch and time stretching algorithm has been nice for band rehearsal purposes. I think that's the same algo that is included in PG products. One would also wonder if 'extortion fee' is appropos given the very reasonable price of Tracktion that is in the same range as new release upgrade prices of PG and other DAW products, even on the low side given feature set comparisons to other software. -Scott
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Josie,
If you think talking to Greg Mackie would help, I'd be happy to email him. We still chat regularly. I imported electronic component parts for Greg for many years. My company was Marketech International. I imported for all the 'biggies' of that era.
Don
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Josie,
If you think talking to Greg Mackie would help, I'd be happy to email him. We still chat regularly. I imported electronic component parts for Greg for many years. My company was Marketech International. I imported for all the 'biggies' of that era.
Don Hey Don - I still have my Tapco 6001R, which I believe was Mackie's first mixer design under the Tapco name. Still works too!  Maybe you put the components into that one. Regards, Bob
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As Robh said (and thanks for the complement Rob) I work all the time in RealBand and PowerTracks, despite having Protools, Reaper, Logic, Cubase and Harrison mixbus at my disposal.
In my experience, the people who think RB has limited functionality haven't spent enough time with it. It will do most of what the major DAWs will do, plus quite a lot of things on top. The mixer, in particular, is amazing. For a start, you don't have to configure it, add tracks, or use a template - it's all there and ready straight out of the box. You've got 48 automated stereo tracks, eight automated effects sends, VST settings recall, eight effects busses which can be routed anywhere and sixteen sub-groups. The whole thing comes with real-time or node based automation.
Add to this the ability to generate or regenerate all or part of a realtrack without leaving the program and it's a winner.
Having said all that, I'm a great believer in people using whatever suits them, but as long as it's not just because they didn't know there was something better.
ROG.
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Josie,
If you think talking to Greg Mackie would help, I'd be happy to email him. We still chat regularly. I imported electronic component parts for Greg for many years. My company was Marketech International. I imported for all the 'biggies' of that era.
Don Hey Don - I still have my Tapco 6001R, which I believe was Mackie's first mixer design under the Tapco name. Still works too! Maybe you put the components into that one. Regards, Bob Bob, I remember that mixer very well. I did import some of the parts, as I recall. They were built like tanks and could easily double as chocking blocks for a 747. TAPCO (Technical Audio Products Corporation) at that time consisted of Greg Mackie and Martin Schneider, period. They worked out of and old, rickety, 2-storey house overlooking the Ferry Terminal in Mukilteo, Washington. In about '73, they sold out to competitor, EV Game, who let it die out. It's rumored that Greg and Martin walked away with 7 digit$ to split. Martin started a silkscreening operation, Precision Screen Graphics in the same industrial complex as Greg's Audio Control.Greg was smart enough not to sign a non-comp agreement so many of Greg's genius designs were found in Audio Control Corporation products. I think Greg was a genius and Martin was equally brilliant. I supplied every transformer, pot, knob, condenser mic element, RCA jack, etc. for Greg.
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Hey Guys, I don't know how this old post got resurrected. Thanks to all for the new info. At first it was really hard to switch and I missed the Tracktion plugins and work flow that I was used to very badly. I got over it. Now, after almost two years, I'm very happy with Reaper and have zero desire to learn another DAW.
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Hey Guys, I don't know how this old post got resurrected. Thanks to all for the new info. At first it was really hard to switch and I missed the Tracktion plugins and work flow that I was used to very badly. I got over it. Now, after almost two years, I'm very happy with Reaper and have zero desire to learn another DAW. Josie, You make a strong point - reluctance to change. It gets stronger with age. I have yet to explore and learn RB. I and Mac (our own Mac) helped develop N-Track Studio and I'm still using that and Audacity which do everything I need. I keep telling myself that I need to start using RB but reluctance, at my age, is a very powerful force (aka inertia). Sad when we reach the point in life where struggling with dated technology is easier than "learning a new trick".
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FYI, Tracktion 4 is free on the www.tracktion.com website.
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Scott, it looks like trialware.
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Out of curiosity I downloaded Traction 4 and it is actually free, though there is a few hoops to jump through such as creating an account etc but its registered ok all free.
Not sure though If I would put much effort into learning it.
Musiclover
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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