I simply enjoy the pleasure of digging down inside of me to find those words and chords that go together, and when it's happening, it's the biggest and best high in the world. Then to hear the finished product... how can it get any better than that?
Same here.
I like it as much as learning a new lick on guitar, or learning a new instrument. Songwriting takes practice, and while it may not make it perfect, it is very enjoyable.
There's a crazy bunch of folks about to embark on what they call 50/90, writing 50 songs in 90 days. Kemmrich might be one of them. http://fiftyninety.fawmers.org/
I do the February Album Writing Month challenge, which is 14 songs in 28 days. I had a couple of them this year that I like going back to and listening to. That's success to me.
There's a crazy bunch of folks about to embark on what they call 50/90, writing 50 songs in 90 days. Kemmrich might be one of them. http://fiftyninety.fawmers.org/
I do the February Album Writing Month challenge, which is 14 songs in 28 days. I had a couple of them this year that I like going back to and listening to. That's success to me.
I have seen this and thought about it.... a few years back I did a similar challenge on my own.... it was a 12 month challenge to write 26 songs in that 12 months.... one every 2 weeks. At years and I have over 30 songs and a bunch of cues written. It was fun.
For a different kind of challenge..... go to the TAXI website and have a look at the song listings. Some of them are specific song requests for movies. Some of those actually tell you what is happening in a specific scene in the movie and ask for a song that relates to that scene. There is also a DEADLINE date given. Usually, you have 3 to 5 days to write it and record it. Take that as a challenge and write something that you would submit to that particular listing. Hold yourself to all the particulars, the topic, the genre, the dead line.... and see what happens.
This will get you to start thinking out of the box.
The song RAINY DAY is an prime example. I was a TAXI member at that time, saw the listing, and wrote this song. The deadline was 3 days. I wrote, recorded and submitted it in 3 days. I have since recorded it better. The song was returned since it was not the "indi-rock" genre but ballad-rock according to them..... but the comments about the song included the screener commenting that it was obvious that this was written specifically for the listing and was a good write, but the genre was totally off base from what the film producer wanted.
The point is not what I wrote, but that I took the listing as a challenge and wrote a song for it in the time frame allotted.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
I love Nashville. One of my first summer jobs out of high school was at a little record company on Music Row. It's changed a lot - population growth. Never getting the big cut wasn't Nashville's fault - it was my fault for making wrong decisions and I still got close. Lots of opportunities, great people and enough great times there to fill a book. No other place like it. Wish I'd never left but some things we do for people we love and that's okay too.
I just do the odd song now for my own enjoyment and to put on youtube. Even on youtube if you are not known, your dog or cat is likely to get more hits. A lot of stuff anyways is driven by social media such as facebook in conjunction with youtube. For example the singing priest that got over 30 million hits on youtube recently was helped greatly by facebook shares.
As regards writing songs and sending them to singers to record or to consider I have totally given up on that. To be honest most of the time there is no response. Even if it is a good song the singer will get all the glory and the songwriter is still a nobody (maybe the exception in the case of a massive hit)
That is not to say if someone heard my song on youtube and wanted to record it, I would say go ahead no problem, wouldn't be too bothered if they made any money out of it either.
As regards the formula for writing a good song I think the old adage still goes, it has got to be simple enough, catchy enough, a nice maybe even simple melodic line, for the guy driving the pickup truck down the road to sing.
As regards doing songwriting courses such as the Pat Patisson course which I have done bits of (and I know is well respected on here) I just consider that pure drudgery and for me totally takes the fun out of writing the song, and I just stopped his course. God knows if he has all the answers then why is he not drowning in hits. That saying he is a lovely guy to listen to and some of his little stories are great. But his course just drove me crazy.On the other hand the music production course by Louden Stearns was a real eye opener for me, couldn't get enough of it, but everyone to their own as people are different.
I do think that eventually some one will make it big because of streetjelly that kind of website, (how's your site coming on Pat if you are reading this?)
Anyways I think the main thing we all try out hand at this is for fun, and other than buying biab and a few other small items I don't throw any money atall at it.
Windows 10 (64bit) M-Audio Fast Track Pro, Band in a Box 2025, Cubase 14, Cakewalk and far too many VST plugins that I probably don't need or will ever use
I do think that eventually some one will make it big because of streetjelly that kind of website, (how's your site coming on Pat if you are reading this?)
I am reading this!
It's my son's project... and he is still working on it... but he also works two programming jobs, has a family and plays in a jazz band, so his personal project isn't moving along as quickly as I hoped. Also one of the key programmers at his place of employment quit recently, and my son inherited all his projects, so you know how that affects discretionary time.
He's actually had it ready for Beta testing for months, but he's waiting for a certain server to offer discounted pricing (which they do about twice each year.. last time he missed it by days)
As soon as the server offers another introductory deal, he will put it online and apply the domain name we've already bought... then we can start beta testing. I'm not going to predict when that might be... (I already feel like the boy who cried wolf...)
Pat you hit the nail on the head when you talked about music for film. The record sales market is a thing of the past. The last real bastion for making money from writing music is in the media industry (film, tv etc). It all depends on what youaspire from your music but if you want to make a (real) living then you have to start composing for media. While I am saying this I would totally advise people to avoid sites like Taxi, any site who asks you to pay money to them to be interested in your music is a rip off!!!
Pat you hit the nail on the head when you talked about music for film. The record sales market is a thing of the past. The last real bastion for making money from writing music is in the media industry (film, tv etc). It all depends on what youaspire from your music but if you want to make a (real) living then you have to start composing for media. While I am saying this I would totally advise people to avoid sites like Taxi, any site who asks you to pay money to them to be interested in your music is a rip off!!!
Absolutely.
You fine folks here do get to hear the songs I write but you don't hear everything I write. The vast majority of things I write are instrumental cues and short songs.... 1 to 2 minutes. These almost entirely are getting signed and placed into some of the better and top line music library sites for film and TV use. I have 42 cues submitted to a major reality TV show that is, as I write, filming and in production for their next season. I won't hear from that until after the fact.... but that's cool.
This song..... New Grass Lullaby is one of those 42 that I did actually put up here. And it's on some producer's desk right now..... hoping it gets used in the show.
Yes, the chance of getting a cut in TV or film as source or underscore is vastly greater than getting a cut in N-town from anyone, even the artists that have no hope of making it.
Produce radio ready stuff, style it like the music you hear in the reality shows and get it to the screeners for the publishers and perhaps you will get the greenlight to submit. Send in the music and see if they sign it. I get about a 50% or slightly better signing rate on that kind of music. Still, it's not a slam dunk since there are thousands of writers out there with the same goals in mind writing every day, and submitting song after song, and cue after cue.
But I personally do see this as a more easily achieved goal for getting my music into wider distribution.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 05/12/1401:19 PM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
I think it's great you're having success with TV! I personally think that market will soon be overcrowded and difficult to break in and actually make money but there is much more demand so perhaps it will balance out.
@bupper
I am not currently a member but I can assure you TAXI is NOT a ripoff company.
A collaborator of mine (on the classic kids song: Cheez Pizza) at February Album Writing Month is a TAXI member, and has been picked up by some TV shows through TAXI. TAXI actually did a vlog with him back a few months ago. It's actually quite a good vlog as it showcases Steve's incredibly variety in the type of music he writes and records. Steve is very prolific. He's a middle school teacher for his day job and a very clever songwriter/home recordist for a hobbyist. He's gone beyond the amateur phase as a songwriter as he's now got real credits and payments for his writing/recording. Here's the YouTube of that video blog with the guy that runs TAXI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jtWGxE6qeM
Steve practices writing. He probably writes a couple of songs per week, when he's not doing FAWM or 50/90. He has made it become habit.
I am in agreement with Sundance regarding TAXI and as Herb pointed out, I also use their listings and deadlines to sharpen up my songwriting. I think Taxi is more relevant today than it was several years ago for several reasons. One, it has expanded into film/tv area and generates more placements for members. Second, it is an endless producer of details for song ideas, song construction and motivation to write outside of my normal genre of music.
I have also been playing with the BIAB melodist feature after learning about it from another thread here on the forum. It seems to be a good starting point to jump-start new song ideas. I began two new song ideas using it over this past weekend. It's akin to someone approaching me and asking "Can you write me a song in *** genre about ***".
.....that market will soon be overcrowded and difficult to break in and actually make money but there is much more demand so perhaps it will balance out....... I am not currently a member but I can assure you TAXI is NOT a ripoff company.
Josie
It's already crowded and the bar has been raised. The music has to be good, well written, and produced and recorded to high standards. There are a few folks who make a living from this niche and a ton of others who supplement their daytime income with music. The money on a cut varies from around $5 for a cut played in a TV show as underscore for 10 seconds, to tens of thousands in a national TV commercial for a major product in an "all in" license deal.
I met a few of the TAXI heavy hitter stars at the LA road rally and yeah, TAXI is for real. The listings are legit. Most folks who don't get forwards are falling short of the mark in one way or another. The songs are either not well written, well recorded, or the wrong genre.... in other words, off target.
I submitted a bunch of songs while a member there and got about the average of 10% forwards. Out of all those I ended up with several signed into a very top tier East coast library. As it turned out the pres of the library signed a number of my songs, including the one that the TAXI screener "returned".
Getting past the "guardians of the gates" is the hardest part of the job. Having said that, while I disagree all the time when I get a song rejected by anyone, the fact of the matter is, most of the time, those folks are professionals. As such, they have heard music and know instantly whether a song has potential or not. They instantly spot the issues that keep the song out of the running. I find myself doing a similar thing as I listen now. I hear issues that keep songs from being commercial. Yeah, the song is good, the person really tried hard, but the reality is that it's just not able to make it over the bar into the professional class. And please don't misunderstand me. This is not putting anyone down. We're all just having fun and writing what we feel.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 05/13/1408:32 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
And please don't misunderstand me. This is not putting anyone down. We're all just having fun and writing what we feel.
its also worth noting... given the fact that your comment is posted to the PGMusic web site, but the topic is TAXI... that the two sites are vastly different in terms of purpose. On this site it is the very absence of commercial constraint that allows people to experiment and try new things... so its expected that people aren't writing songs to pass a test
For that reason, the way a song would be evaluated on TAXI should be vastly different than the way it is evaluated here... two different sets of ears, so to speak.
On TAXI the critics look for polish and for how well it met the criteria the project was looking for...
On the User Showcase, the comments revolve more around clever use of the software, whether it make us feel good when we listen, whether the persons skills are improving, etc etc
In a nutshell, this is an INCLUSIVE environment, while TAXI is an EXCLUSIVE environment.
In a nutshell, this is an INCLUSIVE environment, while TAXI is an EXCLUSIVE environment.
I participate in about 4 different forums. Each one has it's special purpose and a different objective and reason for being.
That's probably a fair way to describe it.However, I've seen plenty of really well spoken and gentle comments over there. They are in fact, focused on the art and skill of song crafting and that is certainly the place to get a relatively unbiased opinion of your song's commercial potential. You don't have to be a registered member of TAXI to participate in the forums. That, I think, is a good thing.
Just like here, they tend to be kind to even the most obviously beginner songwriters. The goal is to help one another excel and learn the craft.
That has gotten me into hot water when for example I offer unsolicited songwriting advice or production advice and ideas on the user forum here.... oooops.... sorry... just trying to be helpful......
I now, try to remember where I am, and make my comments accordingly and based on what I believe to be that particular writer's level of progress with not only writing but production chops.... and sometimes that goes horribly wrong.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
"Writing songs is like capturing birds without killing them. Sometimes you end up with nothing but a mouthful of feathers."
Tom Waits
Thank you. I needed that.
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos
That has gotten me into hot water when for example I offer unsolicited songwriting advice or production advice and ideas on the user forum here.... oooops.... sorry... just trying to be helpful......
I now, try to remember where I am, and make my comments accordingly and based on what I believe to be that particular writer's level of progress with not only writing but production chops.... and sometimes that goes horribly wrong.
yeah, offering (and receiving) critiques can be tough. I have had songs accepted into libraries and I sometimes have a smug feeling like "well, of course they accepted that one". conversely, those same libraries have rejected a few of my songs and it is really hard not to think "that dang guy doesn't know what he's talking about!" but generally, I consider those learning experiences when dealing with pros who do this day in and day out.
a forum like this or some of the songwriting challenges I have done is a totally different thing. most folks are doing it for fun and I try really hard to comment on the nice things about their songs and leave the serious critiquing to someone else!
that the two sites are vastly different in terms of purpose. On this site it is the very absence of commercial constraint that allows people to experiment and try new things... so its expected that people aren't writing songs to pass a test.
For that reason, the way a song would be evaluated on TAXI should be vastly different than the way it is evaluated here... two different sets of ears, so to speak. On TAXI the critics look for polish and for how well it met the criteria the project was looking for. On the User Showcase, the comments revolve more around clever use of the software, whether it make us feel good when we listen, whether the persons skills are improving, etc etc. In a nutshell, this is an INCLUSIVE environment, while TAXI is an EXCLUSIVE environment.
IMO...(with no presumption of being a 'heavy hitter' here)
The above are very important distinctions to consider when one is looking for comments or quite honest critiques.
Responses to songs posted here (and similar sites) tend to be more about encouragement to all song writer submissions regardless of any perceived skill level. For the most part, critiques will be soft and cater more to the 'can't say something nice, don't say it' approach.
BUT, for the record....BOTH have their place for participation and will depend on one's musical goals and the thickness of their skin.
Personally, I've never joined TAXI or any related sites over decades of songwriting because I don't write to the masses nor do I think my material would have any possible mass appeal anyway. Just because I've written a song that took me weeks of angst to flesh out does not necessarily equate to a masterpiece...well...maybe in my dreams. I'd be elated just to elude the 'you totally suck' genre.
I'd guess many to most here (including me) likely write/record for their very personal creative therapy.
Best to all here with their music pursuits....one never knows what can happen should the right person hear something one has written.
Jim mentioned Bill Anderson awhile back. I wrote to Bill Anderson once about songwriting and got a very nice personal Email back saying there are sharks in the waters here., my phrasing not his. I have watched the Country Family Reunion shows and the ones featuring the "Songwriter" give an interesting look at the on air relationships and friendships that have developed over their lifetimes. There seems to be a genuine respect and admiration in this "Old School" bunch that grew up lean and relied on one another. There seems to be something that a newer generation seems to have missed with the big buses and mega stag shows. I think the heart of Country Music was in part the struggle to survive that created the genre. Wyndham
Country music used to be called "the white man's blues" due to where it came from and how it spoke to the trials of ordinary people.
The early pioneers of country music, as was stated above, did not rely on fancy light shows and pyrotechnics and all sorts of technology and certainly didn't have the huge sound systems that are common in today's country music and no, they didn't travel round in caravans of buses and semi trucks as some country stars I have seen.
Hank Sr packed everything in a station wagon, tied the instruments on the top, and the rest of the band and suitcases crammed inside. At the shows, a few theatrical lights, if they were in a theater, and maybe a speaker on each side of the stage designed for speaking rather than music.
It was certainly a totally different world they lived in from what we see now days. Musically speaking.
Back then many secondary roads were only dirt roads. Pickup trucks were used by farmers and ranchers for work and they had yet to become a status symbol for men who would know which end of a cow was which. Old ponds and lakes were the only swimming pools people had unless they were rich. If you went messing with the farmer's daughter you were likely to get a backside filled with rock salt from his shotgun. Today, all that and more is grist for country songwriters, and for most people...it's a fantasy, not reality.
What I mean by fantasy is...when was the last time you drove a shiny pickup down a dirt road to a bonfire at the pond with the farmer's daughter sitting beside you? Never?
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 05/16/1404:41 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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