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Anyone have any good resources for mixing? I think I capture a good signal but I don't really know where to go from there. Very new at this. I grew up in the 80's with hair bands and I think everything needs more reverb. I don't fully understand compression and what it can do for me.
I have seen some videos on mixing but often way over my head with plugins. To begin with, I just need to know where/how to "park" (don't know the correct terms either) something in the mix. I see/hear a lot on putting things in different frequencies to separate them or make them stand out, but I don't know how to listen and determine the proper settings. I guess the EQ thing is what I need most. There has to be a roadmap somewhere to get started. Like begin with drums, then add bass, etc.
Often the mix that BIAB creates sounds much better than it does after I "make improvements" to it. I listen to each individual track, make adjustments to make it what I like to hear, but when it all comes together it sounds like a junior high school garage band.
Anywhere to go for a seminar on the basics?
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Hi Marty, youtube is a great place to start when you are looking for any kind of instructions... including mixing audio! Here's one of the many links you can find by searching on youtube for "how to mix audio" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eUOfinvxH4 likewise, you can search for sub-topics like "how to use EQ in an audio mix" (or compression etc etc) Also, PGMusic has a youtube presence with a treasure trove of tutorials: https://www.youtube.com/user/pgmusicinc
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The mixing process is something that you have to work on and learn about.
My philosophy is to add nothing to the music or the mix that doesn't improve the mix. Beginners tend to think that if they have a tool, they are supposed to use it or they're not a good mix engineer. Nothing is farther from the truth.
The following is MY OPINION and take on mixing. Listen to my tunes to determine if you think it works or not.
First of all, BiaB & RB will give you some really nice sounding tracks. So, there's not a huge need to add compression and EQ because that's already in there. Some folks with good ears on other sites have noticed that the drums especially are compressed, perhaps a bit too much (by PG) so be careful if you think you need MORE compression.... very likely you don't. I tend to use very light reverb and very subtle EQ to the tracks.
I mix starting with the bass a drums together. Using the BiaB tracks and the Real Tracks and some of my own live tracks.... I tend to simply add a small amount of EQ generally to brighten the track a bit...
Drums get an eq boost since the BB tracks tend to be dark. I add NO REVERB to the bass and drums and use compression sparingly. I have a nice multiband compressor which I can use ONLY on certain frequencies and I will use that on the drums and bass. I tend to pull the mids down slightly to get a cleaner sound and more bottom and sufficient kick and punch.
Guitars, piano, keys, and other things go in to taste and only the guitars get reverb and a very slight amount at that. No compression and very little EQ.
Any compression is in the master of the DAW I use to mix. (Sonar) And I set up busses for guitars and vocals where I have the verb and eq.
In other words, the mixes I do are pretty straight forward and boring in many respects. Keep this in mind..... with EQ, subtract more than add. I've heard it said that the difference between an amateur and a pro is not in what you play (or do) but what you don't play (or do).
A good way to learn the ropes is to check out some videos but don't take them as the gospel truth. Mixing is a destination with many roads leading there. The best way is to take the tracks created in BB and pop them into a DAW (Real Band or other) and practice mixing. To get better you have to actually do the process. Then, post the results in the User Show Case and ask for crits on the MIX. Keep the sound scape balanced. What you do on one side, there should be something on the other.....and keep the core things... drums, bass, lead vocal straight down the center. Let the guitars and keys and other things play in left and right field in a balanced relationship.
There are a number of folks here with critical listening skills who can pin point the major mistakes and offer guidance to a better mix. So throw a tune together and put it up for some crits. The more you mix, the more you learn, the better you get with time.
EDIT to add: Starting out, keep an MP3 of the basic BB mix as it comes out of BB. Refer back to it as you work on your mix. Let it be your "control group" so to speak. If your new mix starts to sound worse than the BB mix....STOP....and start over from scratch by removing ALL of the plugs and FX. Pull all faders back to 0db and remove the envelopes...... then, start again. I can tell you that I have done the stop/restart from scratch on more projects than I can remember. BUT... it's all part of the learning process. Don't try to repair or fix a mix that is going south until you have more experience and develop your own critical listening skills. It will come with time.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 07/13/14 06:38 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Thanks a ton. All great advice. I will start with the videos tonight. Sounds like I mainly need a ton experience.
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Hey Marty! I am very new to this but I have gotten much better with help from folks on this forum as well as several others! My main suggestion is mix, Mix, MIX! And then mix some more! Practice does indeed make perfect!
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Also, use reference CDs. Buy several of the CDs on this page ( http://www.digido.com/honor-roll.html?option=com_content&Itemid=54&id=46&lang=en&view=article) and rip them to high quality WAV files and listen to bits of them and compare to your mixes during the mixing process. Listen to yours...listen to theirs...repeat! I bought about a dozen of these CDs (already had several in my collection) and got most at Amazon used so they only cost a few bucks!
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And last, but not least, get a copy of Mike Senior's book Mixing Secrets For The Small Studio. The book is great and he has a website dedicated to the book that contains a wealth of resources including "More than 150 free multitrack projects in a variety of different musical styles, for use as mixing practice or as a basis for educational assignments." and "More than 350 audio demonstrations to illustrate important points in each chapter of the text." http://www.cambridge-mt.com/ms-intro.htm
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OK, so one more... Pay attention to your listening space. Your monitors/speakers are important. Your room is important. If you use headphones to mix (as I do mostly) be very aware of how much different they may sound than speakers. Just, in general, understand that your setup will be different than my listening environment so what you hear will sound different on someone's iPod or on their big stereo system or in their car. It is a good idea, especially in the beginning, to listen to your mixes on a variety of systems to see how they sound. Also, use those reference CDs!! And, if you do find yourself mixing in headphones you might wanna try Focusrite's VRM box ( http://us.focusrite.com/usb-audio-interfaces/vrm-box). It is software and hardware that plugs between your computer and your headphones and it attempts to simulate/model a variety of locations and speaker types. Plus it tries to simulate the stereo field like you would hear it from speakers instead of how it sounds in headphones. I think this device has helped my mixes.
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.. I listen to each individual track, make adjustments to make it what I like to hear, but when it all comes together
.. You're doing it wrong. That's like cooking the ingredients before you mix them together to make a cake. You can't refine each instrument to sound it's best like it is a solo instrument then throw them all together. Many beginners make this mistake. You need to do these things with the other tracks playing, otherwise you have no idea how you are affecting the overall sound of the mixed tracks. Sure there are occasions when a single track needs attention, but that is not the way to approach mixing. Example - you may be able to cut the lows on a guitar and never miss them in the mix, yet the bass suddenly has more definition .. but if you solo the guitar you may not like it (as a solo instrument); it's the sum of the parts that counts. What you need to do does come with practice/experience, but doing it by soloing tracks will take you forever. There are general rules of thumb that can help. As mentioned; cutting lows on guitars can clean up a mix quickly. Adding 2kHz to a bass can give it some presence Cutting around 300 Hz on vocals often helps with clarity. Have fun while learning!
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Marty, Like you I'm just beginning. There is a lot of information available so it's easy to get information overload and frustrated. Nothing kills having fun like frustration. Here are links to different items that have helped me get started. Introduction to Music Production Starts TOMORROW (July 14) and lasts for six weeks. FREE! Most likely the best introduction and overview to music production that you will find anywhere at any price. All the course materials can be downloaded for offline study and use as reference material in the future. Download all of it, you'll be glad you did as there is a lot of material presented during the six weeks. I can not say enough good things about this FREE course (that starts TOMORROW!). Play With Your Music In progress but don't worry about having to catch up, it's self paced. Music Production presents a lot of information in a short timeframe, this course presents a few core ideas at a leisurely pace. The two courses complement each other and would work well if they were combined into one course. Music and Computers An online textbook that details how computers handle music as data. Really good and practical descriptions of how audio works inside the computer. Helps clear up the fog concerning things like sample rate, bit width, digital to analog or analog to digital conversion, bandpass filters, equalization, comb filtering and other stuff that you kind of know what's being talked about. The Art of Mixing A 2 1/2 video companion to the David Gibson book, "The Art Of Mixing". The video visually demonstrates mixing concepts like frequency spread, panning, use of effects and sound levels. This video doesn't tell you what, or what not, to do but does help you to better understand what's good and bad and why bad sounds bad. It will help prevent you from going in circles. IF you plan to track (record) vocals and instruments but don't do this very often it's nice to have a reference book to turn to for good how-to advice. The Musician's Guide To Home Recording was published in 1993 so much of the information does not apply to the digital age but the tracking on a budget information is just as useful now as it was then. There are also great photographs showing the recording set up for many instruments. A few years later, another book came out with "recipes" to sweeten mixes. Using Your Portable Studio discusses mixing on analog equipment but the recipes work just as good in the digital age. In an earlier posting rharv mentions there are general rules of thumb that you can follow. "Using Your Portable Studio" is filled with these general rules of thumb. A resource that covers the use of effects and what each knob does is Guerilla Home Recording.
Last edited by JimFogle; 07/13/14 04:18 PM. Reason: fix typos & clarification
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In my opinion, one of the best things you can do is pick one song you like. ONE song.
Then listen through the whole song and make notes. First time through, listen for what individual parts you hear. "I hear drums, a bass, a piano, two electric guitars, and some kind of a pad, and the vocals have harmonies in the chorus section, etc."
Then make yourself a spreadsheet or a grid.
Write out in the rows the song sections; intro, verse 1 verse 2 chorus, verse 3, bridge, final chorus, outro. etc.
In the columns write out all of the parts that you heard on your first listen through.
Then in the intersections of the rows and columns, write out notes as to what you hear in the mix. You will listen through the song as many times as individual parts that you hear. A whole bunch of mixing is simply muting parts for different sections.
Then record the song yourself, and mix your version like what is in your pile of notes. Effects, EQ and all of that is going to be part of this process - you'll see/hear tons of advice about that. But I rarely see anyone talk about what I talked about above. I think it's just as critical; it dances in between composition/arranging and mixing. But since we decide on our arrangements, it's actually a step before mixing that needs serious consideration.
This may seem like alot of work. It is, but it's also fun to see how close you can get to the original song. And you will learn about the relationship between arranging/composition/mixing, which is highly tied together for us home recordists.
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My favorite mixing thread: Why do your recordings sound like [*****]?. It's a long thread, but it does a really good job helping you understand how to think about the process, and can help you think like an mixer.
-- David Cuny My virtual singer development blogVocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?BiaB 2025 | Windows 11 | Reaper | Way too many VSTis.
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Thanks so much guys. I never expected so much help. I wish I would have put this post out much earlier. Well, I like all your ideas so much, I have copied and pasted them into one folder for future reference.
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.. I listen to each individual track, make adjustments to make it what I like to hear, but when it all comes together
.. You're doing it wrong. That's like cooking the ingredients before you mix them together to make a cake. You can't refine each instrument to sound it's best like it is a solo instrument then throw them all together. Many beginners make this mistake. You need to do these things with the other tracks playing, otherwise you have no idea how you are affecting the overall sound of the mixed tracks. Sure there are occasions when a single track needs attention, but that is not the way to approach mixing. Example - you may be able to cut the lows on a guitar and never miss them in the mix, yet the bass suddenly has more definition .. but if you solo the guitar you may not like it (as a solo instrument); it's the sum of the parts that counts. What you need to do does come with practice/experience, but doing it by soloing tracks will take you forever. There are general rules of thumb that can help. As mentioned; cutting lows on guitars can clean up a mix quickly. Adding 2kHz to a bass can give it some presence Cutting around 300 Hz on vocals often helps with clarity. Have fun while learning! This is very valuable advice, Marty. Probably the main reason you're not happy with your mixes - you have to mix everything in context, not individually.
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And last, but not least, get a copy of Mike Senior's book Mixing Secrets For The Small Studio. The book is great and he has a website dedicated to the book that contains a wealth of resources including "More than 150 free multitrack projects in a variety of different musical styles, for use as mixing practice or as a basis for educational assignments." and "More than 350 audio demonstrations to illustrate important points in each chapter of the text." http://www.cambridge-mt.com/ms-intro.htm +1...I agree, I have this book and a number of others listed in this string. But this best advice is to mix in context of all the instruments and vocals. You can listen to them by them selves, but always, always bring in all the tracks to see how your changes have affected to whole song. Good advice from all in this post!
Del
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About the entire tweezing the individual tracks..... yeah.... I agree.
It's OK to do that with the bass and drums to start with but ......
As you bring in other instruments to the mix you will need to adjust the bass & drums so yeah..... don't waste time soloing the tracks and tweezing them. Add them to the mix and adjust accordingly.
Often you will need to go back and adjust the existing tracks in a mix when you bring in s new one....especially if it's similar and in the same range of freqs.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Mix around the vocal. Everything else is in a supporting role.
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I was just gonna say...do the solo special treatment on the vocal! I always give it extra attention to remove breaths and other noise, maybe a tiny bit of tuning, etc. But even for voice ya need to hear it in context of the rest of the mix.
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We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!
Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.
Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 10 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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