PG Music Home Forums General Discussion User Showcase Dust on the Floor (V2)

This is my newest song... started writing it in the last few days of the old year... finished it up as of today. I was changing lyrics in it this morning.

It's an observation of life in this corner of the world. Recently, our small town (population 300) had the General Store close...owner retired. His grandfather opened the store in the early 1900's... and another of my customers is barely keeping the doors open. Down to one employee from about 10.

EDIT: Per some commentary, I have posted Version 2... minor changes to the song... EQ high end tamed a bit, and some words punched

Dust On The Floor

Lots of detail work in this project. Hope you enjoy it. Comments and crits are welcome.

Tracks in the song:

Bass 1423
Piano 2049 (2 tracks)
Acoustic Guitar 1 822
Acoustic Guitar 2 824
Electric Guitar 830
Mandolin 2043
Dobro 2116 (2 tracks)
Fiddle 2119 (2 tracks)
B3 689
Drums Nashville waltz
Vocals (5 tracks)

I was planning to add live acoustics to this but it would have been too full so I opted to leave them out and this is a 99.9% Real Track piece of work..... yeah, only the very last piano chord (F) was a Steinburg concert Grand. I needed it for a smooth artifact free natural fade.... I told you there was a lot of detail work in this.

The hardest thing was working with 3/4 tracks and then when I wanted to add the B3.... there were no 3/4 B3 tracks.... but I decided to simply render it anyway and it turned out OK....

Lots and lots of envelope nodes in this for editing and production....

Cool song!! I like the sentiment. David Wilcox has one about Ashville with a similar theme, and another writer I heard did a song called "I Miss Main Street". I think a lot of us old timers have these thoughts. Arrangement works great-really liked the mandolin/fiddle alternating solos. Nice vocal as well. Great work! Take care. Greg

Herb,

Vivid imagery in this and I especially like the chorus. Great arrangement and vocal.

Josie

I gave a listen GH.
You nailed the lyrical imagery for this subject....well done.

Carry on....

Herb,
I enjoyed this song. It probably kept you busy quite some time but the result is fine. Sad story well brought. And the grand piano finishes it of in style
G
Fred

Thanks.... I'm not familiar with those songs.... I know Alan Jackson did a song about the common man or something like that. Sad to see our little towns in decline..

every now and then I kinda get one right.... I like to paint pictures with words.... I thin this one got that job done.... thanks for seeing that as well.

and again.... yes... thank you.

Thank you....actually,this was a fairly quick write. I started the song in the last week of December and actually had it recorded and almost ready to go Monday of this week when I decided to make a key change and a major lyrical revision....

so I started from scratch...literally. That was one of those.... do I really wanna start over, moments......deleting completely the former version before starting over again just 2 days ago. I recorded the 4 backing vocal tracks and some changes to the main vox track today.

Herb,

This is excellent - my new favorite of your songs. Great lyric, vocal and overall production.

Bob

Hi Herb,

As the others before me have already said, there is a great deal of detail in these images. It's good to hear song in waltz time. I liked it.

I mention the following because you asked for comments. One thing that popped into my mind as I listened was that, on my system, the mix had a great deal of high-end EQ. Because of this, the piano (in particular) sounded a little thin at times.

It's a great ending you devised for this one.

Overall, I enjoyed the ride!

Regards,
Noel

Wow, just a great song! Excellent lyrics to go with a super arrangement! Lots of space for everything to shine.

much enjoyed

Herb
Sadly, a sign of the times. The song really tells the journey and destiny of a country store so well.
Thanks for sharing
Trev

Thanks Bob.... each song I write becomes my new favorite.... this one included.

Noel, thanks for listening.... I will have to look into the EQ on the high end.

In writing this, I normally opt for 4/4 but the groove didn't work in that so I switched to 3/4...I hate calling it waltz time because so much 3/4 isn't a waltz. 6/8 also has a similar groove. I added an extra measure to every verse and chorus in the song to keep the laid back feel.

As I mentioned previously, I like to paint mental pictures in the minds of the listeners..... where you can see the paint on the window frames, and the weeks in the cracks on the sidewalks.....

Again.... thanks for listening.

Not often we get treated to a song that follows the traditional map of a classic style country song but here it is. This one could have and likely would have fit right in the classic years if it had been released back in the day. It's not always how much time you spend on recording, mixing and producing a song, it's more how you spend the time. This is a good example. I like this tune a lot.

EDIT FOR VERSION TWO: The changes made an already excellent song flow a bit better. Also, the inference you took this 'classic' song would not be popular on today's country radio isn't due to this song lacking quality, relevance or emotion, it is because this song HAS all of those qualities & not the sameness of today's rappin' country where the music, lyrics and artist are all interchangeable. It's music like this that guides me to listen to CD's rather than radio and I'm not so sure that given the opportunity, music produced again in the 'classic' style could not enjoy a resurgence in mainstream radio popularity.


Charlie

Herb, all your many skills are on full display with this one. Maybe your best write. Certainly your best vocal. A polished mix and great editing of the real tracks. This all adds up to a winner. ( very small, tiny, barely even noticeable nit- I would have changed the word "growing" to "grows". Flows a little better with one less syllable. Without question my favorite of yours so far. Tom

I'm glad you like this... thanks for listening.

I always try to create space and if there isn't space, and I can't make it, that part is not forced into the space. Make sense? Less is more...

I'm glad you listened and enjoyed the song. Yes, certainly a sad story that is replicated tens of thousands of times all across this country. It speaks to the general decline in this country.... lose the roots and you lose everything connected to the roots.

Yes, as I wrote this, I knew it's not what is popular... when was the last time you heard a song on the radio or TV in 3/4 time? But it was one that screamed out to be written. And so I did.

Glad you and others are enjoying this song.

Tommy, yes... I agree.... I did in fact play around with that line... it was one of the ones that was changed from something totally different the morning I was recording it...I had to go back and punch 2 tracks to make the change.... and the "ing" was something I pondered....I even considered would "weeds" work better than "grass"... grow vs growing.... thanks for noticing the nits..... it's in the details of something that really either makes it shine or not.

This write was one of the more satisfying writes I have done in quite a while.

The vocals.... thank you...I rarely ever spend a lot of time on vocals. I basically sing a scratch, mainly as a guide for my production chops.....and once I have the phrasing and lyrics like I want them, I will delete the track totally and record the keeper. This vocal was, I think the second full take on the keeper.... then I punched in some changes the second and final day.... I record the BGV's and HVT's the same way...except they are generally one shot, first take and it's done recordings. I do not punch (generally) the BGV ...and there's no corrections. The lead vox does get minor treatment by melodyne.

For those who don't know how I normally record my vox..... the lead is up the center. The 2 lead duplicate tracks are -18db to -22db down and panned 100% Left and Right respectively. The 2 harmony tracks are done the same.... except they are only about -14db below the lead. Slight reverb in the vocal bus.

thank you for listening and commenting.

Herb,

A lot of good stuff in this. One of your best vocals.
A good classic country production.

As others have noted, there is a lot of high eq to the mix that gives it a "brittleness" that you don't usually do. It lacks the "warmth" that your productions typically have.

Best writing I've heard from you. Good imagery. It would be nice if you smoothed a couple of "bumps".
A bunch of places where there are more syllables than fit comfortably into your melody. Some are easily fixed by eliminating unnecessary words or changing the wording slightly. Tom's suggestion on "growing" is a good one...another example...

"There's tape on the windows and an old weathered sign"
would sing more smoothly as
"Tape on the windows, an old weathered sign"

"for eternity" (drop ""all")

"A padlock is rusting..." could be "A padlock, rusting...hangs on the door"

Substituting "Our small towns" for "The small towns" would make it more personal - involve your audience...

The chorus and third verse are strong (you could drop "those" in front of flat-screens)

Cool that you've hit #1 in Christian Country.

Good job on this.

floyd

Floyd, you gave me lots of things to consider...

So I fired up the DAW....and loaded this project. I edited the high end on the EQ a bit..... and I punched in a few places..... as well as muting a word here and there..... just the easy changes..... I also edited the ending envelopes a bit to change a few things there as well.

The new version is now in the place of the old one..... the highs are tamed a bit more....hopefully without losing the space and air....

Floyd.... thanks for the feedback and for listening and commenting in detail.

Just wow again! I listened to the new version and the flow and lyrics are Perfect! This is truly a great song. I don't care what might be in fashion a great song holds its own in any era.

Herb,

I have just had a listen to the second version. Wow! It's great! The sound is so much fuller and I found it much much more aurally engaging. This song is real credit to you. It beams with confidence and competence.

Regards,
Noel

Hi Herb,

Great song and good lyrics!
It's the same over here. I (Anne-Marie) live in the country too. More and more shops close, as well as primary schools.
We also use 3/4 tracks sometimes when it should be 4/4 and indeed, sometimes it works.

The piano at the end also works fine.

Rob and Anne-Marie

History repeats itself.

I remember in the late 70s when industry was leaving the rust belt and moving south to escape the unions. Billy Joel's ALLENTOWN told a very similar story of that area's decline.

For the next 30 years the south prospered with the influx of jobs... but history repeats itself, and the manufacturing started moving south of the border to get lower wages. Add the problem of corporate stores coming in like carpetbaggers and sucking potential income away from the local retail sector who might have found a niche if they had just stayed away. But they didn't.

Both times in both places it was the small towns that relied on one or two main industries and a lot of supporting small businesses that felt the effects first. In those places the loss of one company could potentially trickle down to the whole community. And it eventually did. Without new money coming in from outside, there's only so long you can recirculate the same money from business to business.

I like the honesty of this song, and the fact that you didn't pull any punches. Your lyrics were very well written, saying just what needed saying and nothing more or less. You're really good at this Herb. I'd say I enjoyed it, but the topic of economic decline has affected me for too long, and I'm tired of it. I wish it would go away, but it never will.

You sure did an excellent job of describing it though. I just wish the song wasn't necessary.

It's fabulous Herb. My idea of country. I could listen to it over and over.
Love the super sparse bass and the way the backing cradles the lyrics and voice.
Missed version 1 but don't expect to hear more enjoyable country than this for a good while. Cheers.

Very nice Herb. My Aunt Daisy ran a store like that in a
S GA town with a dirt main street. Old men chewing and
whittling all the time on the store benches.

Growing up in the 50's really allows me to relate to your
lyric as I remember so much before it deteriorated into
your vivid images.

I didn't hear the version before you made the changes
but this mix sounds strong on my monitors. Your vocal
deliver captures the feel and so do the supporting
instruments and mix.

We enjoyed it.

J&B

Lots of folks must be listening...... What a cool thing to wake up and see....!!!

» highest in charts: # 1 (66,147 songs currently listed in Country)
» highest in sub-genre: # 1 (8,446 songs currently listed in Country > Christian Country) » today's position: # 1 in Country
» today's position in sub-genre: # 1 in Christian Country

This is the first song I've written that's ever done this....and in 2 days.

THANK YOU EVERYONE.... for listening....

Too bad it's not the Billboard Charts...

I think it's likely a worldwide issue in the first world countries.... Yeah... using the 4/4 B3 was more of an experiment and a slightly desperate act... but it worked out fine. You never know until you try something.....

Thanks for listening

Thanks Pat for the interesting observations..... yes... so sad, but time goes on like they say and we somehow adapt and survive. It's sad to see a way of life being snuffed out for a dollar though.

The hardware store here that closed was a handy place to grab a plumbing pipe connector or some seed for the garden. Of course, it cost a few cents more than the big box in town.... but you'd spend 10x the extra cost in gas to get there to save that small amount.... but one stop shopping won out in the end.

Thank you for the kind words about my writing.... much appreciated.

My type of music too Rich.... and I do listen to it over and over.... I still am in awe of the amazing job the real tracks can do.... the piano especially simply blows me away..... with the fills in it from square one....

You mentioned the bass. In my OP, I said there was a ton of detail work in this.... you nailed one of the tracks that has a bunch of detail in it. This was not the original bass track that came with the style. I changed it several days into the project due to "nits" I had and couldn't seem to fix in the original. Even this one had issues. I ended up doing quite a bit of audio editing to get this track to do what I wanted. There were some "busy" runs that didn't sound good that I needed to edit out..... waaa laaa....

The first version..... for those who didn't hear it.... had a much more pronounced high end.... lots of cymbal range freqs that were just a few db too high... crisp is good, but this was a bit too much....I dropped the highs just a few db from 1200hz and up.... and a few words were changed... not much different from this version.

Thanks Rich

Thanks Janice & Bud.... glad you liked this song and took the time to listen. As I said in the last post, the changes were minor between the first and this one....

For us who grew up in the 50's and 60's..... yes the changes are quite vivid. I hate that my children and especially the grand kids when they come will not be able to experience this. Now days.... a certain restaurant chain on the interstates and the occasional mountain store that advertises like a tourist attraction are the closest many will ever come to knowing what we, the older folks, knew as an everyday experience growing up.

I do have a few other songs that reach back and try to grab that long lost time and put it into song.....

Again...thanks for listening and commenting.

Gruverider and Noel, thanks for coming back and having a go at the second version.....

The changes were a huge improvement. Good job on that.
More than minor, I'd say

Thanks for coming back and listening again.

Herb, why don't you offer it up to some radio stations for air play. Who knows?

There are very few radio stations left that actually would allow airtime to a "local" non-record company released song. 20 years ago, that might have been possible....air time is just too valuable a commodity.

I do have it submitted for review to NSAI.... I should hear something from them in a week or two.... I will doing what I can to get it into the hands of the powers that be.... One never knows what will happen when NSAI hears it..... they have recommended songs in the past that have become radio hits....we'll see.

congratulations, Herb! You deserve it!
and screw the billboard charts... all they say is which songs have been most heavily promoted by the studios. Your numbers come directly from the people.

Herb, old friend, i have watch your journey for quite a while now, and i just have to say that you write very exceptional music. i have enjoyed many of your songs over the years. "Footsteps in the hall" is a personal fav. "Missing person" another good 'un. This one sets right in there. Well done, very full sounding and rich. I guess the best compliment i can offer is that your songs inspire me to write. I just wish i had your writing skills you say things well. Another artist here that i really enjoy is Floyd Jane, and i put your offings right there with his. Not to say there are not others here that are good, but to me you two stand out. From the early days over at MC it's been a fun ride!

Keep it up. Rob

hi guitarhacker really enjoyed this nice write vocal great choice of instruments mixed very well thanks for sharing eric

Dang, I listened to this a couple days ago, but somehow didn't comment.

Really, really good.

I listened to V2, couldn't agree more!

We've got some great advisors on board, don't we?

G

F

The old days at MC... those were some heady days.....tons of fun and we sure learned some things over there about recording well with minimal software.

Man, I'm almost speechless on the comments.... It's really touching to know that my writing inspires you to write..... thank you.

I played "Footsteps" at a live mic night some time back with another writer (NSAI Raleigh chapter member and a few other writers) After we left the stage, my friend's pop was there and could not stop talking about "footsteps"... obviously, he liked it a lot too. It's also one of my favs.

Thanks... music ..... well most of it , is meant to be shared. thanks for listening and commenting

don't think twice about it... I do the same thing too.

Thanks

Yes...we have several really good writers here who are willing to jump in and point out issues that they see.

Often, many things are subjective and more than one path is possible..... other places, the advice is the answer that just wouldn't come during the writing stage.....

I certainly appreciate all comments. Whether I take the advice or not, the advice gets me to look at things in a different way, which is always a good thing.

Thanks

Great tune thanks! Good story telling ... that's the great thing about country music. Love the way you used the fiddle solo to make the key transition.

Herb,

As always I'm late to the party so I'm not sure if I'm listening to version 1 or 2 but I can tell you the version I'm listening to was uploaded Jan.9, 2015.

There's a lot to like about this song. I like the subject of the lyrics and your vocal delivery. The production sounds clear and punchy. I like the short mandolin solo then the longer fiddle solo with modulation.

You've mentioned in the past how you'll take multiple RealTrack instrument tracks and edit them together to make your fills and solos. If you did so in this case, I hope you'll expound on that topic some more because the fiddle solo especially sounds like a performance recorded just for this song.

I'm fairly sure you were looking for a punchy sound, and you achieved that goal, yet I wonder if the song would have been better served if you used a more "classic country" flatter equalization with a fairly steep 12K or 12.5K roll-off at the top.

I agree with you that the song has more of a 6/8 than 3/4 feel to it.

Well, you know what they say, better late than never.

This is V2.

Jim.... on the production... here's how I approach it. I render out the tracks for the instruments I want to use from Real Band and load them into SONAR. One of the first things I then do is insert volume envelopes in ALL tracks and pull everything down to zero except the drums, bass, and acoustic guitars.

I "try on" different tracks... to see what works best for the intro.... will one instrument do the job or should I split it between 2.... same thing applies to the fills... do I want fills here and if so what instrument.... and would something else sound better there? On the solo, it's pretty much the same decision process. Mostly based on feel or intuition. Nothing in this process is necessarily wrong or right... it's simply my vision for the song. What sounds best to me.

As I listen to the solo... or the fill, or the intro, if I hear it played with notes that don't seem to be doing the job I expect it to do...and trust me when I say that making that call is extremely subjective..... I will simply reopen Real Band.... find the same real track and render it again.

I then import it to Sonar and place it side by side with the first track....insert a volume envelope and see if the second track works better in that section than the original track did. If not... I can render again.

In this song, 2 renderings of the fiddle, dobro, and piano were needed to give me what I needed for this song. In the past I have gone up to 5 tracks.... in THE BEST CHRISTMAS...the guitar center solo is 5 tracks edited into one in Sonar. All 5 tracks were similar but had enough difference that made picking and choosing the parts like being a kid in a candy store.....

In this photo, you can see the duplicate tracks and the envelopes I used for volume control to bring instruments in and out of the mix as needed. If you look closely at the 2 fiddle tracks and compare the waves, you will be able to see the difference between them.



If you have more questions.... PM me.

Hi Herb,

I really liked version 1 but the improvements in version 2 are well worth it.
To my ears this is pretty much a commercial quality song and production.
I'm not surprised by all the listens you are getting.

Thanks also for sharing your method for export from RB into Sonar.

In summary, the song, vocals, lyrics, instrumentation, production - it's a winner!

Rec

Thank you.... version one was brighter... probably too much so since several folks mentioned it. When one person says something, it's an opinion.... when a bunch of folks mention the same thing, there's something there that needs to be looked at a bit closer.

Again, thanks for listening.

This is just fantastic. Everyone from a small town can relate to this, I know that I can. Walmart has made the most all of the small businesses in three small towns around here go under.

Anyway everything about this song is super, the mix, lyrics and vocal. I can hear Willie Nelson singing this one.

heads up: This was just posted to PGMusic's facebook page!

https://www.facebook.com/pgmusicinc?fref=nf

Very cool tune. Excellent lyrics. All so very well done

Jesus H. McChrist, "guitarhacker", your lyrics, man, your lyrics! This is what people mean when they talk about "poetry set to music". I don't think I've ever been anywhere near a town of only 300 people in my entire life, but after listening to the lyrics in your song, "Dust on the Floor", I feel like I spent at least a day in one.

I am really, truly impressed by this, "guitarhacker", and I haven't even mentioned the music. It's so nostalgic-sounding that it could bring tears to the eyes.

Do you ever take your songs "out into the world" beyond BIAB users to see what kind of response you'd get? If I had written "Dust on the Floor", man, I am tellin' you right now, I'd be knockin' on doors, hard and long, until SOMEBODY opened up, for sure. You deserve the reward that could come about as a result of the inspiration and obvious hard work you put into this song.

I agree absolutely with "MarioD" concerning hearing Willie Nelson taking a shot at this, but he dang well better turn the mike over back to you after he's crooned a verse or two, 'cuz your own vocal is inseparable from my experience of listening to this recording.

-bluage-

thanks scott

I'm humbled by your response.... wow... thanks..

Yeah, I do submit the music I write to outside sources, and this one is currently in review at NSAI in Nashville.... kinda anxious to hear what they think, although I never get my hopes up when it comes to publishers and industry folks....

Here in the forums, we have had several KILLER tunes this past year that have really good commercial potential.

Herb

I really agree with bluage. Like I said before, this should get air-play.

Keep knocking on those doors. I wish you every success.

I don't profess to know the States, but I would've thought this would be a nostalgia trip quite a few parts.

Good Luck

Trev

Quick tech question if I may: A slow-down ending like you've done there is something you just don't get out of BBox as it comes (and many times I've requested it!), so I'm very curious how you pulled that one off?

A very well arranged tune, and a very genuine and heartfelt vocal. Thanks for sharing it!

-MWG

All production related to the slow down was accomplished in BB.

HOW: at the end....I added about 10 measures to the song....so I could do a proper fade of the held final chord.
Then starting with the chord immediately after the pause on the tag.... I split the 4 beat measures into 2 beat measures. Actually.... split is the wrong word. You take the 4 beat measure and make it a 2 beat measure.... but now you have to add a measure for the next 2 beats of the original measure. That was also the reason I added 10 measures. I was going to need about 4 more measures and I needed time for the final chord to ring as it was held. (Does that make sense?)

You can go into the bar settings measure by measure and change them from 4 beats to 2 beats. In the same window, you can adjust the base tempo of that measure. So.... I essentially double the number of measures and then start slowing the tempo in each successive one. Example.... lets say the song is at 100bpm normally.... (because I forget the actual tempo) So the first 2 beat measure after the pause.... I set to 90, the next 85, the next 80, the next 75 and the final one 70 but with the held note it almost doesn't matter.

The reason I split the measures down to 2 beats is so that the tempo drop is not heard as a series of steps but a much more smooth deceleration. Resolution.

I have discovered that the better sounding deceleration is the one that is more dramatic.... as in 100 to 70 vs 100 to 90. It took several adjustments to the individual tempos to get a good slow down. And truth be told, I probably should have dropped the numbers a bit more.

Hope that helps you.

Thank you.

That was of tremendous help!!

I still have the view that something like this should be an optional feature right from the get go, but this was a very interesting reading indeed. Thank you so much for the detailed instructions, I'll be sure to give this a try in the future.

Herb,

Somehow or another I missed your excellent follow up comments regarding your workflow and production techniques. For someone such as myself such information is invaluable!

I still like the thought behind this song. I live in abedroom suburb with plenty of empty and decaying buildings. Everytime I pass one I think about how "that" was somebodies pride or livelyhood in the past and question why no one can find a use for them now.

I keep returning now and then to listen again. Today, I also ran through all the comments from the beginning to end.
Just want to say this song is deserving of all the accolades both here on the forum and where else it is played.

The only reason this isn't a commercial hit is because the brightest commercial ears have not heard it. I don't think a smart person could turn away from this song. It has all of the potential any song could ever need.

This is a very well done song by any measure.

Slowing something down and keeping everyone in time in a studio with live musicians requires a lot of work.

For any song to sound really good everything has to fit from the first note played until the last note played. The lyrical context has to fit the chord structure and melody line.

Everything is in the right place with what you have done!

I also think this song would be well received on the radio.

Cheers,


Billy

Very nice!

I thought I knew that title. I remember this from last year. Nice to hear it again!! Take care. Greg

Nice song Herb! I like the emotion and the message!

Hi, "guitarhacker"...

I listen to "Dust on the Floor" every single time I check into the "User Showcase" forum. Did you have any luck "shopping it around"?

-bluage-

Howdy Herb!

Well, it seems we missed the original. Must have been when we were away for a couple of months. But we sure did enjoy the heck out this version! We grew up in the late 40's thru early 60's (yeah, we're that freaking old!) and this really takes us back.

Loved everything about this. Sounds like it should be n the airways ... definitely pro caliber and just plain old great music!

Best to you, Hope 2016 is your best year ever ...

Alan & Di