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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123 |
Learning composing and arranging. Also about chord progression. I know one chord can lead or sometimes has to lead to a specific chord, like I > IV > V > I. Got that. But now had a look at "Eleanor Rigby" from the Beatles. Excellent song from an excellent composer. But to my surprise it has only a IV chord and a vi chord. So no root chord, no dominant chord and a not recommended chord progression (IV > vi).
What am I missing? I know there are no strict rules, but this is so way of from what I thought it would be.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Expert
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I would probably look at it as if it were in Eminor, where Em = i and C = VI. Plus theory doesn't control the music, theory only tries to explain why certain sounds seem right in the context of western music. If it sounds good, then it is right.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Jul 2007
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I remember finding the Beatles stuff hard to analyse.
I IV V songs are the core of rock and pop, II V I progressions the heart of jazz.
Beyond this thre are various other techniques of harmonization.
Many of the Classic works are hard to read and very dry (Piston, Kennon) . The best modern text I have found is called @Harmony for Computer Musicians@ by Michael Hewitt. Don't worry about the term "computer" its a very lucid and non partronising text, there is little that is about computers, but lots about harmony.
Z
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123
Apprentice
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OP
Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123 |
You are right, if it sounds good, it is good. But cannot trust my ears to much yet, because a lot I create, sounds good to me. This is because I am new at this. So I first need rules to give me some structure.
Done some more research and Beatles are indeed complicated. Got it now. It is not because I can do whatever I want, as I thought looking at this song, but Paul and Ringo are on a higher level which I cannot understand yet. So I have to stick to the basic rules with chord progression.
I have this book of Michael Hewitt, but no time to read it yet. He has more good books. For future study, just ordered a book with analyzing the Beatles songs. Same for Abba. These groups have something that makes their songs catchy and sticky.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Jul 2002
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M4 pro Mac mini 1tb HD 24GB mem M3 MacBook Air 16GB mem casio wk7500 presonus audiobox i2 usb interface
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123
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OP
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Thanks for the video. Abba has also a lot of "tricks." The book I ordered is loaded with their way of working. Like the Beatles, this is a very important source for improving my skills. Things I could never figure out myself.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Dec 2003
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...deleted...
Done some more research and Beatles are indeed complicated. Got it now. It is not because I can do whatever I want, as I thought looking at this song, but Paul and Ringo are on a higher level which I cannot understand yet. So I have to stick to the basic rules with chord progression.
...deleted...
I think you have a typo here. I believe you meant to say Paul and John. Right?
Life is short so make sure you spend as much time as possible on the Internet arguing with strangers.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123
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OP
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Off course. Because of this, found an interesting site. Maybe it is useful for others too. It shows patterns in progression. seechord.co.uk/song-writing/secrets-of-the-beatles/
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Apr 2009
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Contemplate the song Run Through The Jungle by Creedence Clearwater Revival.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Linear movement is introduced in the chorus:
Em Em7 Em6 C/E Em
which goes through the notes E, D, C#, C, B.
-- David Cuny My virtual singer development blogVocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?BiaB 2025 | Windows 11 | Reaper | Way too many VSTis.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123
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OP
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123 |
Thanks for sharing this. I have read a book about arranging, but there was no mentioning of linear progression. So this is new to me. As soon as I can apply basic and more advanced chord progression, I will look into it. Looks interesting and opens a new world. Found some more info on this.
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Expert
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Expert
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Here is a good "chord progression road map" from http://chordmaps.com/ It is OK to do different stuff, but it seems like a nice basic starting place. 
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Woodshedding - Learning to Play!
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 123
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OP
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Thanks. The site has more useful info.
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