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OP
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For the longest time, I have been a dyed in the wool hardware solution based guitar player, preferring some sort of hardware for my amplification and sound/tone. Anything from a POD2, which I love, to a real amp with glowing tubes, like my Mesa Boogie Studio 22. Love that thing!!!
Run the POD direct or throw a mic in front of the mesa and I'm good to go. I didn't like or use amp sims.
A thread in another forum got me to thinking.... you see, for many years, I have not used amp sims because of the difficulty I have had getting a reasonable sounding tone that I could work with and like. Most sims can be brutally harsh or thin.
So last night I decided to spend a few hours with the sims. The family was out of town for a few hours shopping and the house was empty. So I fired up Sonar, loaded a blank project and started loading one by one, the 3 sims I have. I loaded Guitar Rig Pro4 from NI. There was a noticeable latency in it.... so I went to the Sonar settings and adjusted the latency in the audio drivers to 5ms and waaa laaa... perfect!
On to experimenting. I will save you the tedium of everything I did, but essentially, I loaded a number of models and did in fact find a number that, after tweeking, did sound good. In some ways, I could even say close to amazing. I saved a number of them as personal presets.
Playing with them in solo mode and also with BB playing a backing track yielded good results. I was going to record and post the song samples but..... not enough time.
SO, I have begun changing my official Anti-amp-sim position to one that is now open to the use of select sim models in future projects.
I will be informing you in the first few projects, the names of the sims and the amp models being used. After that, if you like the tone and ask, I'll give that info. BTW.... I have 2 more amp sims I didn't really experiment with due to time constraints. I think I need to register and unlock one of them.
Anyway, it was a fun time playing with the models and setting up a number of sweet presets. Marshall, Fender, Tweeds, Plexi.....
Perhaps you can teach an old dog new tricks.
edit: Parting question to guitarists here: Do you use sims? If so, which ones and why? Favorite models?
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 01/01/16 03:50 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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I have gotten good results from Guitar Rig and Amplitube over the years, primarily with Fender amps in those pieces of software. Heres the reality, your PC has much more computing power and speed than the computer you had she you acquired the pod 2. I personally use a Zoom G5 and I really like the Two-Rock Emerald 50 SIM in it with My Epiphone Nighthawk Custom Reissue. I have never played a real Emerald, but that really doesn't matter to me. I haven't recorded electric in awhile, and have no recent SIM VSTi, so no patches which I can share. I love amp simulation in both hardware and software flavors just because of the tonal variety available.
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Yes I use them, though I, too, like to record with hardware .. not sure why. Sims are fun. There is a lot of variety; I'm not enough of an amp aficionado to say how accurate any given amp sim is, but they sure are fun. I have quite a few, probably more than I need. A couple freebies that have stuck around here are Freeamp and Helian bass. Why? They are free and easy to move from one system to another. I have kept moving them from drive to drive because they have been getting rare lately, but I see rekkerd has them now http://rekkerd.org/fretted-synth/ When they say all Freeamp versions are different, they mean it. I've used them all, mainly because one version would not play nice with a given system but another version was fine. They are not top of the list, but do have certain sounds/features I like. To me the fun is having so many options. We could make a long list of amp sims and just about every one would have something cool about it. We live in a good time for recording musicians.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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I've recently been looking at sim route options for guitar and bass. I just spent some time with one of the new Peavey Vyper amps, and was quite impressed. I plan on adding one to my studio soon as a viable direct recording option via usb and the Peavey software. Better models than the Line 6/Pod (in my opinion), and a decent sounding amp for the same price or less than most of the good software sims. The tube sims sounded passable, and the thing is dead quiet aside from the guitar/bass tone!
If the sim route sounds good in the mix, I plan to use it my band's upcoming recordings. We've been old school with recordings in the past (tube amps, 1" tape bounces for mixing, British console) so the results will have to exceed that quality to pass.
My new mantra is the quickest point from point a to b. If new technology gets us there quicker so that we can focus on making music, why not take advantage of it?
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If the sim route sounds good in the mix,... That's all that matters really.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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I have been using Amplitube for a number of years now. At first I wasn't very impressed but that changed when I purchased the Fender amp. This really sounds good IMO and all of my clean guitar sounds that you have heard are from that Amplitube/Fender sim.
I also added the Ampeg SVX for my bass. This is now my go to sim for my bases.
I have found with the sims that I have tried you just need to tweak the presets to get the sound that you like. The Amplitube presets are good as is but you can make them better IMHO.
It takes courage for a man to admit his wife was wrong.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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I'll stick with my little Classic 30 with a custom set of JJ's (and a Sovtek). 
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I use amp sims for recording, but I like things which are simple and easy to adjust. In line with this philosophy, I use Aradazamp Green and California Sun, both of which are free and have limited controls, but which also have a great sound.
I do have Amplitube, but if I try to use it I end up spending too much time auditioning the hundreds of sounds and finish up with no time left for recording. As a friend of mine once said about digital modelling - every sound possible except the one you want!
On the other side of things, I've never been able to get digital effects to work in a live situation. If I'm on a gig, I'll have my old Telecaster plugged straight into a thirty year old Peavey Backstage 50. Very old-school, but it works for me.
ROG.
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Hi Herb ...
Interesting post! I have never used any type of sim. Heck, I didn't even start using a distortion pedal until 8 or 10 years ago! Like you I have always been hardware driven ... if ya can't do it with a guitar, amp and a pedal or two, you didn't need it. But your post makes me want to look around a little bit ... maybe experiment with a couple of them.
Thanks for the info. And have a terrific 2016!
Alan
BIAB 2024 Ultra Plus-all StylePaks*Win11*32GB DDR5*Rhyzen 9745x*AT 2035 Mic*Peavey Nashville 112 Amp*Ibanez ART120* Acoustic/Electric/Washburn D200S Acoustic*Stromberg Monterey Jazz Guitar Loops: https://aldavidmusic.wixsite.com/bestmusicloops
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I own and use most of the popular amp sims but for anyone doubting how good they can sound just listen to any of twangys guitar lessons and judge for yourself. You can purchase his twangy tones using guitar rig 5 on his website if you are interested. I have found most presets that come with amp sims need to be tweaked to sound good. Twangy Guitar Lessons Brian
BIAB 2026 Ultrapack- Studio One Pro 7 Windows 11, Mac Mini M4 with Logic Pro 11, Melodyne Studio, Luna Pro
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When I played live, it was my Gibson SG, plugged in with a 20' straight cord, no pedals or fx other than the volume, reverb, and tone knobs on the Mesa Boogie and the Carvin DCA-800 running the pair of 4x12 cabs on the stage with the tone the 9 cones imparted. Life was good as was the tone.
But you have to admit.... while I like the simplicity and the superb sound of the Boogie, which worked exceedingly well in live gigs for country and rock, in the studio, having an arsenal of "other amps" which lend to a variety of tone, is a good thing.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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This may be the best 129 bucks you'll spend this year. It is far and away my choice . Way ahead of whatever I put in second place. My way of recording guitars changed forever the day I downloaded Scuffham Amps S-Gear. It has the real feel and attack of playing through a real amp. It also has two amps that are used simultaneously. Here is a quote from Sound on Sound "The most important question you can ask of almost any effect or processor is 'How does it sound?', and the best description I can think of is to say that S-Gear sounds expensive — in a good way. If your idea of the perfect guitar sound is a broken valve in a toy amplifier, feeding a torn six-inch speaker in a cardboard enclosure (and who's to say that wouldn't sound fantastic?), you won't find it in S-Gear. But if you like warm, clean sounds that subtly shade into overdrive as you dig in harder with your right hand, or if you want snappy note attacks combined with singing, blooming sustain, or heavily distorted power chords that never lose definition or get flabby at the bottom end, it's likely to perk up your ears.
Perhaps the most impressive thing about it is the attention paid to dynamic response and the 'feel factor'. Although the influence of the Amp Drive and Sag controls on the tone of the amplifiers is often relatively subtle, they make a real difference to the way in which your hands feel 'connected' to the notes that emerge from your speakers. It's an effect that's nothing like placing a conventional dynamics plug-in in the signal chain, or using a stomp-box compressor, and few other amp simulators I've tried get it as right as this.
Similar attention has been paid to elements such as the tone controls, which allow you to shape the sound in a very musical and natural way. As is typical of real amps, there's a lot of interaction between the various different controls, which all feel as though they're part of one organic whole rather than acting in isolation. And although there's a considerable range of tonal control on offer, bright sounds rarely become fizzy and dark ones seldom descend into mud." Trust me guys, I've tried a bunch of them. This sounds and feels better than any of them by a wide margin. Tom
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Yes S gear is very good indeed.
If any of you own Sonar Platinum and have a acoustic with a piezo pickup you should definitely try out Craig Anderton's Piezo CA-X Amp Sim, it records very well. I am not sure if this is included with the other versions of Sonar or not.
I also just bought the iRig Acoustic mic and am using the IK iRig acoustic app on a Ipad and sending it out to Sonar to record my Martin. It's not bad at all and really quick and easy to setup for recording a acoustic.
Brian
BIAB 2026 Ultrapack- Studio One Pro 7 Windows 11, Mac Mini M4 with Logic Pro 11, Melodyne Studio, Luna Pro
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When recording I use amplitube almost exclusively. The key to getting reasonable tones from the plugin is instead of auditioning hundreds of samples pick a half dozen or so by using the filter to get near what your looking for. Then take the time to audition the different cabs and the mic placement emulator. The mic position emulator module alone can dramatically change tone and dynamics. It's really no different than positioning mics on a real cab or amp and may actually be a bit more efficient.
This in my opinion is where simulators can shine because hardware can only give you a definitive amount of options. If you want more sound options you have to add more hardware. Most simulators have a fair mix of options built in thus giving you more flexibility. On the flip side of that though it's easy to get lost in a project chasing "that" sound with a simulator. The limiting choices of hardware force you to make a decision and move on thus allowing for the completion of a project. Then again by using a simulator you can go back at any time in the project and tweak the guitar without re-tracking which is hard to do with hardware.
In the end it's all about preference and each will find their own. I don't think one way is better than the other. It's what ever allows you to be creative and enjoy the process of creating music. I will say though that in the process of choosing an emulator it has on occasion sparked creative ideas that I have used in other projects.
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I am using a POD XT to record all my guitar parts, obsolete device, but I love the sounds I can get with it. Over the years I've developed a handful of presets that I can dial up quickly to get the sound I want for a particular song.
What I could use is some sort of processor to handle piezo pickups, the POD has a setting for that but it is not very good, anyone have any thoughts on that?
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What I could use is some sort of processor to handle piezo pickups, the POD has a setting for that but it is not very good, anyone have any thoughts on that?
Funny that you should ask! I recently researched this myself and discovered that there aren't too many such devices, possibly because it's not an easy task to make an acoustic's piezo sound good as a direct signal. However, I just purchased a used Yamaha AG Stomp (discontinued), which does a pretty nice job. It has a bunch of mic simulations that really do reduce the piezo mid-range nastiness. On the pricier side (and if you're willing to purchase a Universal Audio Apollo interface  would be the Sound Machine Wood Works plugin. Based on the samples on their website, it sounds amazing! WAY out of my price range though!
Last edited by railway mark; 01/05/16 01:03 PM.
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IMO this needs to be handled before the signal gets to the PC. The right signal path initially would likely be a better solution than trying to fix it 'after the fact' with a plugin.
Just my 2 cents..
Once this sound is written, it becomes much more difficult to deal with. I bet the default POD settings can be improved for that particular guitar, for example, with a little work.
Once found; Save the settings.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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What I could use is some sort of processor to handle piezo pickups, the POD has a setting for that but it is not very good, anyone have any thoughts on that?
It's called a condenser mic. All kidding aside.... get a nice mic and preamp if you need one.... a tube pre can warm up the sound.... and use that in place of the piezo.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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I am using a POD XT to record all my guitar parts, obsolete device, but I love the sounds I can get with it. Over the years I've developed a handful of presets that I can dial up quickly to get the sound I want for a particular song.
What I could use is some sort of processor to handle piezo pickups, the POD has a setting for that but it is not very good, anyone have any thoughts on that?
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Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production
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What I could use is some sort of processor to handle piezo pickups, the POD has a setting for that but it is not very good, anyone have any thoughts on that?
It's called a condenser mic. All kidding aside.... get a nice mic and preamp if you need one.... a tube pre can warm up the sound.... and use that in place of the piezo. BINGO! It doesn't have to be an expensive mic either. I picked this up for $19 USD: http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/321836278320It was a gamble that really paid off. Our acoustic guitars never sounded better. If you want to hear a sample I can send up a snippet of a live song with only two acoustic guitars and singers using only this mic and a little reverb.
It takes courage for a man to admit his wife was wrong.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Introducing XPro Styles PAK 10 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!
Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.
Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 10 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Introducing Xtra Styles PAK 21 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!
Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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