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I don't listen and review as many songs as I would like due to two main reasons.
One reason is that the submitted songs are like rabbits in that I come back a day later and there are 20 more! That is not a bad thing. Also the musicianship, song writers' talents, mixing etc are much better today than a few years ago. I know that I have learned a lot from both the forums and the critiquing of my songs; please continue as I need all the help I can get!
Second is that I have been extremely busy lately (what else is new). This leaves little time for music so I work on my songs (it takes me quite awhile to get one down) instead of listening. I probably should change that and listen more.
No excuses just my explanation.
OK, a random thought;
Why does toilet paper need a commercial? Who's not buying it?
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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I don't listen and review as many songs as I would like due to two main reasons.
One reason is that the submitted songs are like rabbits in that I come back a day later and there are 20 more! That is not a bad thing. Also the musicianship, song writers' talents, mixing etc are much better today than a few years ago. I know that I have learned a lot from both the forums and the critiquing of my songs; please continue as I need all the help I can get!
Second is that I have been extremely busy lately (what else is new). This leaves little time for music so I work on my songs (it takes me quite awhile to get one down) instead of listening. I probably should change that and listen more.
No excuses just my explanation.
One would think that living in a nursing home would mean that I have time on my hands. Not true at all. The staff has rigid routines that take priority over my music. My new roommate hates music so that has virtually ended my joy.
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a couple of other thoughts...
1) Regarding critiques, to me it seems like a bad idea in a forum like this where you do not know the other people nor do you know what their level of proficiency is nor their preferences in music, etc. maybe they don't care for your genre or maybe they are not qualified to critique your music! I guess my advice would be for each poster to include a small statement, like a sig, where you state specifically what you'd like feedback on (if any).
2) Regarding those who post and do not comment on the songs of others, I would have said that is not cool but then I read where several of you pointed out that one primary role of the User Showcase is to promote what can be accomplished with PG products. With that in mind EVERYONE should be encouraged to post their creations regardless of whether or not they ever comment on anyone else's songs!
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Ditto re the original post and in particular the comments of Pat, floyd and Bob. It's an international music forum and the common thread is the use of BiaB products. There some great songwriters, instrumentalists and vocalists on the forum and often their sheer creativity in the use of RT's and RD's results in us listening to a genre that we would heretofore never paid much attention to. FWIW, we try to respond thoughtfully to new posters; however, if after that post they have not taken the time to respond to even one other member's efforts we shy away from them. Why? If you are an active member there are plenty of other active member's posts to respond to. BTW. we don't see the forum as a mutual admiration society as some allude to...at least not to the extent that it's problematical  It is a rich diverse community and within it we have made many friends -- and not necessarily of the typical facebook ilk Friends who have offered us tremendous support over the last four years. The support of them and PG Music renewed our interest in making music after a near decade long sabbatical. We can only reinforce David's thoughts in the OP and also mention that a quick route into the community for new folks is to listen around, find something you like, comment on it and remember in your posts to list the details of the PG Music products you used in the production. Oh, and try to be patient enough to wait until your song "runs its course" before posting another. All is good.... J&B
Last edited by Janice & Bud; 07/31/16 10:10 AM.
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos
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This has been a most interesting discussion to follow and may well achieve its aims.
Maybe the "Dumpers" will read this thread, maybe just maybe they will change their ways, maybe they will feel guilty and such will be the deep feeling of guilt that they won't post any more songs on the showcase at all.
Job done Congratulations to all.
But hold one a sec, I have noticed that certain users only really post in the showcase and don't really frequent any of the other forums at all much, such as the off-topic.
Oh My, If they do start a thread in future in the off-topic forum, and get some replies, but don't reply to others on the off-topic, I wonder how would they feel, if the regular users of the off-topic forum accused them of "Dumping"
Labelling some one is not something I like to do.
Goes on every day though in every aspect of life.
Martin57
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I can't speak for everybody, but here's my take on your situation, Josie: You've already shown yourself to be a participant and a team player. I doubt that anybody who has a life can find time to comment on everything. The objection is toward people who dump & run consistently.
Thanks for this Pat. I appreciate it. However, I am not specifically talking about me here. I am talking about other people who may be in the same boat as me but may not have participated much in the past. I think, your example of TexasHeartRush is a great one. I could bet that he has chosen to spend his time practicing that guitar to hone his craft rather than participating on the forum. His progress shows. I think I read a while back that it took him a year of solid focus and practice to get where he was. If I can remember rightly he practiced to a set schedule everyday (was it three hours?) with his cell phone timer going. He is attempting to get to that magical 10,000 hour mark. I, for one, am very pleased and interested to see new post from him to the user forum, regardless of whether he listens to mine or anybody else’s songs on the forum. I think J *3 is right when he says that everybody should be encouraged to post their work to the forum, even if they have never commented on other people’s work. It is their choice. Listening to other people’s work undoubtedly helps you grow as recording artist, songwriter and arranger, but maybe that is not on your agenda. I just see too much evidence in this thread of good people feeling bad over the user forum and surely that is not great. Personally I think they should change the way in which songs are displayed in the forum. In my opinion, it should be first in first out, similar to what they have on FAWM and 50 90. I do realize this may be a very contentious issue.
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As is so often the case... this thread is getting way off track from what David was stating in his original post (my opinion, of course).
It has transmutated into "should we be critiquing other people's work?" when all he was saying was "Why don't you guys who dump your songs in the Showcase PARTICIPATE????"
I agree with you Floyd It's difficult with limited time but I try to spread myself around between most of the forum subjects, including the showcase. I do definitely notice a few posters who post a new song of theirs just about once a week, but rarely comment on the efforts and contributions of others... It is noticeable.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
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a couple of other thoughts...
1) Regarding critiques, to me it seems like a bad idea in a forum like this where you do not know the other people nor do you know what their level of proficiency is nor their preferences in music, etc. maybe they don't care for your genre or maybe they are not qualified to critique your music! this point can be argued, but in the end human nature will prevail. The irrefutable rule of human nature is that people have opinions and they tend to express them (with varying degrees of finesse). In the same sense that people who don't want to be criticized shouldn't become politicians, people who post opinions, songs or other forms of art in public places should realize that they open themselves up to scrutiny and judgement. No rule or law will ever change that. Only by individual choice does kindness prevail. I guess my advice would be for each poster to include a small statement, like a sig, where you state specifically what you'd like feedback on (if any). This has been suggested in the past, and it is always an option for those who don't want comments or critique to say so. The vast majority of posters specifically invite comments and critique. 2) Regarding those who post and do not comment on the songs of others, I would have said that is not cool but then I read where several of you pointed out that one primary role of the User Showcase is to promote what can be accomplished with PG products. With that in mind EVERYONE should be encouraged to post their creations regardless of whether or not they ever comment on anyone else's songs! I think there are two or more separate issues here. Regarding the issue of advertising PGMusic products, I think everybody should post their stuff regardless of whether or not they comment. Regarding the etiquette that differentiates an organized and polite forum from a chaotic and rude one, I think the people who have a specific opinion about how things should work (in either direction) should lobby for and reinforce rules of order. All groups work this way... its a phenomenon known as "forming, storming, norming and performing" In the end a behavioral norm evolves that a majority supports, and then the group functions effectively and harmoniously until someone rises up a disrupts the harmony to push for a new norm. This whole discussion, by the way, is part of the storming and norming process. However the discussion is assimilated by the group as a whole and gets acted upon going forward will be the new (or continued) group norm.
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There are currently 24,975 members and probably less than a hundred active members posting on an ongoing regular basis in the forum.
I track the total views more than the comments. Comments tend to come in the form of either enjoyment of my song or suggestions to improve it in some manner. I truly appreciate those who take time to comment and have total respect for what they have to say.
When I joined the Forum, I monitored the various forums for two months before venturing to make a comment on a post.
It was two months after joining the forum before making my first post and I only made a total of three comments in the 8 months after joining the forum and did not post a song for a year. My first post was on a song where the lyrics were top notch but the arrangement seemed to be an afterthought which in the reply, the forum member said the arrangement was not given much thought.
I followed and listened to a song repeatedly for 8 months before having the nerve to critique the arrangement of another killer song that I felt was a good arrangement but was also the weak link of the song.
My point is that it takes a bit to overcome the intimidation of critiquing what for the most part is quality material by talented songwriters. It appears that most members never overcome the intimidation but do take time to listen. I appreciate this listens and possible shares just as I do the comments. I've noted songs in the User Forum with hundreds of listens but maybe only 10 comments.
Some of this may even out some as PGMusic Radio on Soundcloud matures.
Last edited by Charlie Fogle; 08/01/16 04:53 AM.
BIAB 2026:RB 2026, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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I think Pat makes many great points.
Overall, I don't think if you post a song here, you owe anyone anything. IF they choose to step up and help in anyway way they can, great! That's up to them. No one makes you do it; it's simply a choice.
For me, another choice, is in posting songs...or not to. You have to know your audience. The style(s) of music I write, tend to be more to the "pop" side of things. Not necessarily what the forum considers pop, but what current radio considers pop...or pop country.
I get what I like to write isn't everyone's thing here..and isn't by a long shot from what I've seen. As a result, I don't see much value in posting things I feel people don't want to hear. It benefits almost no one.
So, I have posted 1 partial song on the forums. I appreciated how nice everyone was with it too! I was just figuring out the program at the time.
The flip side is, I do listen to a lot of the music on here. I don't judge it by the standards of what I do or don't do. They only person I really compare that person to is the person they were last week, month, or year. As a general rule, I see growth in peoples skills. That's exciting to me!
I very seldom comment, because, I'm not asked to. There is the general asking for comments, but everyone does a great job already. There was a time I did, but explanations that end up in further explanations and, at times, defending an opinion seemed pointless.
Now, I choose to just enjoy. And there is MUCH to enjoy!
Overall, my take is post your songs if you would like to. Comment if you would like to. It's really not more complicated than that to me.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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Overall, my take is post your songs if you would like to. Comment if you would like to. It's really not more complicated than that to me. A nice, simple, balanced approach! And really, a system like this is self-policing I would think. Those who post and never comment are unlikely to receive many comments as time goes on while those who post and comment will prolly get more!
Last edited by JohnJohnJohn; 08/02/16 11:21 AM.
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Overall, my take is post your songs if you would like to. Comment if you would like to. It's really not more complicated than that to me. A nice, simple, balanced approach! And really, a system like this is self-policing I would think. Those who post and never comment are unlikely to receive many comments as time goes on while those who post and comment will prolly get more! this is actually the system in place now, and Its highly likely that it will continue. I agree that it it's a self-perpetuating system, and that's why it would be hard to change it to anything else. But, our opinions aside.. we should all ask ourselves this: If Peter Gannon weighed in, what position do you think he'd take? I think he would want no encumbrances above and beyond the necessary legal ones.
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.......
For me, another choice, is in posting songs...or not to. You have to know your audience. The style(s) of music I write, tend to be more to the "pop" side of things. Not necessarily what the forum considers pop, but what current radio considers pop...or pop country.
I get what I like to write isn't everyone's thing here..and isn't by a long shot from what I've seen. As a result, I don't see much value in posting things I feel people don't want to hear. It benefits almost no one........
I think you are wrong here. I, for one, like to hear what others are doing with BiaB/RB. I have listened to a number of genres, some I like and others not so much, but I have learned something from all of them. Exposing me to something that I would not normally hear can be very beneficial and educational. Also it shows the versatility of PGMusic's products. Maybe a potential buyer will listen and say that is my kind of music and since this product can help me produce it then I will buy it. A win-win all the way around. Just my two USD cents.
OK, a random thought;
Why does toilet paper need a commercial? Who's not buying it?
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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For all of us, there's really no way around getting comments requires giving them in kind. I participate in February Album Writing Month ( www.fawm.org ) and there are thousands of active participants each February. There's a few folks on there that get multiple tens of comments on each of their songs and they fall into two categories: 1. the person is just a comment-a-holic and their comments are encouraging and insightful 2. there are a few folks on there that have a certain amount of fame in that community that are prolific and excellent songwriters and each year the community looks forward to their output. One of the guys is actually a darling of the Taxi.com website and has pretty regular sync licensing placements. Then there are the rest of us that generally get as many comments as we give out. My ratio typically goes like this; for each comment I give, I get 0.75 comment back. But I will spend waiting times at oil changes, dr. waiting rooms, sports practice time for kids, etc. listening through loads of songs at once and picking out something that made me smile or caught my attention and highlight that in a simple comment like "I really enjoyed the cadence of the wordplay in the 2nd line of the chorus" and call it out specifically. If it's someone that I know I've traded comments with over the years, then he/she is usually up for constructive criticism and it seems to be appreciated. That's part of the point of that community once you get settled in to it. Very few uncalled for unnecessarily negative comments - those posters are usually shamed from the community. In 2015 or 2014, there was one particular commenter that was outed for their single line comment: "Sh*t's weak, bro" and it became a sort of meme for the community as what not to do. I would encourage all of you PGers that are into songwriting of any type to join the FAWM challenge next February. PG products are grossly under-represented there and it's such a ripe market because the challenge is to write 14 songs in the month of February each year. 14.5 (collaborate with someone for the 0.5) in leap years. -Scott
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[Bob, Notes Norton] >>I don't post songs and seldom listen to others. Please don't misunderstand, it's not because I am not interested in the music made by my forum friends, it's because my Internet connection is too slow. ------------------------------- Hi Bob (Notes) (and anyone else with a slow internet connection). There's a potentially helpful solution for people with a slow internet connection. If when you stream audio it pauses and starts again, the solution is to first download it, and then you can play it from your desktop. Many people on the user showcase post on soundcloud.com. You can download songs from soundcloud.com using something like this http://9soundclouddownloader.com/ Just paste in the URL of the soundcloud song. And you get a mp3 download. When it downloads to your PC, you can play it on your PC at full speed and there will be no stopping and starting. This one is for soundcloud, there are likely other ones for different services. A slow "dialup" internet connection can download an mp3 song in about 3 minutes, and you can be doing other things on the internet while it downloads.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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[David] However, there seems to be a very thin minority of some posters who are posting a lot stuff but don't seem to get around to responding very much to those who are their listeners, if you look at the statistics.
=========================================
David,
Well said, and I agree. Hopefully this serves as a gentle reminder for everyone (myself included!).
Peter
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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[Bob, Notes Norton] >>I don't post songs and seldom listen to others. Please don't misunderstand, it's not because I am not interested in the music made by my forum friends, it's because my Internet connection is too slow. ------------------------------- Hi Bob (Notes) (and anyone else with a slow internet connection). There's a potentially helpful solution for people with a slow internet connection. If when you stream audio it pauses and starts again, the solution is to first download it, and then you can play it from your desktop. Many people on the user showcase post on soundcloud.com. You can download songs from soundcloud.com using something like this http://9soundclouddownloader.com/ Just paste in the URL of the soundcloud song. And you get a mp3 download. When it downloads to your PC, you can play it on your PC at full speed and there will be no stopping and starting. This one is for soundcloud, there are likely other ones for different services. A slow "dialup" internet connection can download an mp3 song in about 3 minutes, and you can be doing other things on the internet while it downloads. Thanks Peter, I'll check that out. Bob
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Dear Peter, Thank you for developing the technology, the platform, the software, the company, the distribution channel, the upgrades, revisions, tools, website and forum so we would have something to post in the first place. I think we can let you off the hook on this one, if you feel you have been in any way negligent. There have been a lot of interesting comments here. Wow. Carry on good people! Keep the hits flowing. I think everyone is on a roll these days.
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