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Lenovo YOGA 900 Window s 10 Home 64bit M4 pro Mac mini 1tb HD 24GB mem casio wk7500 presonus audiobox i2 usb interface
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Thanks for calling attention to this Mike. (sob!) I'm heartbroken (sob!) A song line comes to mind - "We may be fighting a losing battle but having a lot of fun trying to win!"  Cheers on a Saturday Night!
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Tuck and Patti Andress record at home.
Their album, Love Warriors, won a San Francisco Bay Area Music Award for Best Jazz Album.
--Mac
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The authors make a perfectly good case why "Home Recordings" on the 99.9% probability will never sound as good as a major studio. I accept that, mainly because it is true.
Sound quality aside, the question is "can a home studio song win major awards?" The answer is -- "it depends". If the "song" is vastly superior, then yes. However, the quality of the "inherent" song is subject to personal opinion. Then it becomes more political. Songs recorded in major studios are more "politically correct". Cry about it all you want, but relationships, networking and "who knows you" becomes the deciding factor when song quality is comparable.
Kevin
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Of course, they haven't come across RTs yet... 
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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What they don't talk about is that home recordings can make superb demos and bring rewards if the songs are good. Brings to mind Kenny R's "Buy Me A Rose" - recorded on a bedroom 4-track - which hit #1 . . . .but not the bedroom version. Kevin your points are well-taken. Connections and exposure mean alot. Ian
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I know a gentleman who was given a Barry Gibbs song to record. He went back to Nashville to record it only to find out that Conway Twitty had decided to do it. That is the way the music business works. The studio is going to go 99.99999 and as many 9's as you can go with the established artist. The same thing is true with the recording engineer. The thing that is most important for a person with a home studio is can I produce a demo quality cd. Most studios, even if they use your song will have it rerecorded using their people. It is just the nature of the business. You can guarntee that there have been many grammy award winning songs sent to the studio, recorded on less than stellar equipment. In the end it is the melody and the words and the performance that make a grammy award winning song. Listen To My MusicRead My Blog
My TunesPsalm 57:7 My heart, O God, is steadfast, my heart is steadfast; I will sing and make music.
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Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Sorry to rain on the article but there are several flaws with the question then the method used to answer the question.
Firstly, how many songs which make loads of money each year win a Grammy? Perhaps 1/100 of 1%? I doubt it is even that high.
So in my mind, the question - can a home recorded/edited/mastered song win a Grammy is almost an irrelevant question.
I'll throw a question back - when has the Grammy awards show ever been mixed and broadcast properly? It is one of the worst examples of a live show almost every single year it is broadcast. They totally butchered the Sting/Allison Krauss duet of a few years ago.
Put the folks that engineer Austin City Limits in charge, or the Ramsey Lewis Masters of Jazz show in charge of the Grammys.
Secondly, they only interview professional studio engineers. How do you think these guys will answer such a question? If they aren't biased, I don't know who is.
They would be better to interview people who make money hand over fist with home recorded music - like Sufjan Stevens, or Elliott Smith (well he's dead now), or Beck (well his home studio can be argued to be pro).
Every issue of TapeOp magazine (free subscriptions in the US) features usually at least one band/producer, etc. that is doing work out of their home, for profit.
A Grammy would look really cool on the mantle above the fireplace - but it's not even a reasonable goal for home recordists.
The fact of the matter is that scores more people have access to technology affordable for their homes to make works of art that can be shared with others.
It's just like digital photography has brought access to the fun of photography to the masses in a way that only professionals could afford in the past. My 7th grade daughter has the concept of 'bracketing' and taking multiple shots of a subject, only to save and preserve the best, down in a self-taught way, through experimentation, with her little $100 panasonic camera I bought for her for Christmas a couple years ago.
The article's points on input, monitoring and acoustics are right on. If you study and understand these concepts, you can overcome much of the limitations of the differences between the home studio and pro studio for very little money if any.
Example: Mix quietly, audition loudly elsewhere in other rooms. This helps your nearfield monitors to behave in the near field. Take note of peaks and valleys in the spectrum (usually below 1000Hz) in the places where you audition. Teach yourself the concept of memorizing what these holes and peaks sound like by using a 31 band EQ on the output buss while listening to music you know forward and backward. Start with the vocal formant dominant frequencies of 250/500 Hz 'oooooo', 1000 Hz 'aaaaaaah' 2000 Hz 'eh', 4000 Hz 'eeeee'.
Don't have a 31 band EQ in hardware, no excuse - get a VST plugin for free to do this.
Monitoring quietly also saves the hearing system and allows for longer sessions, and preserves relationships with close-by neighbors.
Example: Properly micing guitar cabinets vs. using a good amplifier simulator.
I'll take choice 2 every time, because I know I would spend far too much time treating my recording/mixing/editing room acoustically and that I don't have a stack of Fender and Marshall and Vox amps sitting in that room like what sits in the simulator taking up only hard drive space!
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It can be done. And all you need is PG Music software and RTs It just hasn't been done YET
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Hi All
When you consider the investment pro studios have in their equipment,it's not surprising
that we "Hobbyists" don't stand much chance.
$30,000 for One compressor,I would like to know what it can do that my $200 one can't?
You would need to be extremely lucky and be in the right place at the right time,or know
someone who could help for it to happen.
However it has been done,to say it's impossible is like saying we should all give up and
sell our gear,no way.
Alan
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Hey, folks! Remember Sun Studios? Chess Records? Are you going to dial them out because they were made with 'inferior' recording gear??? I think not Of course it can be done. Alan, is it worth it to spend 10 times the amount of money on a piece of kist that might get used once in a while. No! Ultimately, its the song that sells... lyrics and melody, rhyhm and rhyme works for me ALL the time
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Quote:
$30,000 for One compressor,I would like to know what it can do that my $200 one can't?
Alan
This is where the Law of Diminishing Returns kicks in hard.
However, that little bit of gain over the lesser offerings can be a lot when all is taken into consideration, and therin lies the difference. Things like noise are additive in nature.
Designing out that noise level can be expensive both component and assembly-wise. Then there is the Law of Supply and Demand to be considered also. The engineer who takes on design, manufacture and sale of the high end compressor must price according to projected sales possiblities in order to remain viable. They may be selling double digit unit numbers as versus the thousands of consumer sales.
Alan, the Mastering Engineer who does it for a living likely looks on the gear in the same way you view the guitar, as you recently did in a thread here about highend or brand name guitars versus the less expensive ones. There are tools and then there are the Tools of the Master.
--Mac
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Part of the issue, to me, is that one may hear a crappy song promoted to a money audience that goes platinum and a great artist, great song with great production values fall flat in the market because the time was wrong.
When we listen to Barry Gordy's wall of sound today some of it makes me cringe but back in the day, it was hot because we were all looking for "Love"
My wife and I were discussing how to bring our music to the public without selling out to the promotion of the genera. How do you write and produce a Gospel CD that gets the message you want to talk about without losing your ethics in the battle to be heard? Our thought is to do it ourselves and focus on the message not the illusive super exposure that the Gospel Music industry may have.
I have seen too many people lose themselves in the industry they thought to master. It could be Hollywood or Nashville or ...........(Fill in the blank)
I guess dangle your own carrot, Wyndham
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Quote:
Tuck and Patti Andress record at home.
Their album, Love Warriors, won a San Francisco Bay Area Music Award for Best Jazz Album.
--Mac
Tuck and Patti also use multi-thousand dollar A/D converters, have a studio at their home, and have a professional engineer doing the mixing. Tuck always sits in on the mixing to get what he wants, but he doesn't do all the mixing himself. At least, the last time I talked to him earlier this year, anyway.
My favorite Tuck and Patti album is "I Remember You."
Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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But,
Mac, you do recording in your own home, radio ads, jingles, etc. It may not be 'Grammy' material, but it does end up on the airwaves. You record and do all the mixing, engineering at home in a home studio, correct?
As Scott said, 0.001% of all songs done in a year may be considered for a Grammy Award, so there are lots of songs out there, some that may be done in a home studio, either consumer, prosumer, or semi-pro (or, even pro quality home studios...they do exist) that don't make it, for one reason or another.
As part of this, I have to wonder how many songs are submitted to A&R, singers, bands, etc., every year that never get recorded, for one reason or another. Not questioning whether they are good enough or not, but just don't make that cut.
I don't think the original question is a 'realistic' question, but that's my two cents.
Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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Quote:
My wife and I were discussing how to bring our music to the public without selling out to the promotion of the genera. How do you write and produce a Gospel CD that gets the message you want to talk about without losing your ethics in the battle to be heard? Our thought is to do it ourselves and focus on the message not the illusive super exposure that the Gospel Music industry may have.
I have seen too many people lose themselves in the industry they thought to master.
Right, you get to have your stuff heard by exactly 9 people. Maybe 11 if you're daughter manages to give a couple of cd's away with her Girl Scout cookies.
"...Lose themselves in the industry they thought to master".
"...bring our music to the public without selling out to the promotion.."
This sounds like the eternal mantra of the consummate wannabe. We all naively talked like that in the coffeeshops across from the college while a wide eyed coed was ernestly reading her poetry.
"focus on the message and not on the illusive super exposure..."
What are you talking about??
You don't want super exposure because you're afraid of losing your ethics and/or losing yourself in the industry? That's the name of the game and you just learn to deal with it if you want your music to go anywhere.
Strictly speaking someone somewhere has produced a legitimate hit that was done using a $1000 home studio setup but it's realistically impossible. About like the odds of winning the Super Lotto. Mathematically sure, someone wins it every month but your odds? About 5 million to one. Personally, I think the odds of winning the lotto are higher than getting a hit out of your basement. Matter of fact my best advice, seriously, is to by lotto tickets then when you win you can promote yourself.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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My question is, is that what we are looking for? I just want to produce a great sounding recording. Which some of you here helped me do.
Everywhere I have played my cd (made with real tracks) it has been a hit and I've sold copies to all that hear it. In fact last weekend I was at a big party and they played my cd along with some other ones which where recorded in multi million dollar studios. The quality of mine sounded just as good as all the others on their system. It sure shocked me or should I say I was pleasantly surprised. Thanks to PG and all you here who helped. And yes some of the songs are being used on radio stations and on TV shows (mostly ones involving boaters cause that was my focus).
That's all the thanks I need.
Last edited by edbulmer; 09/14/09 04:41 AM.
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Quote:
My question is, is that what we are looking for?
In the context of that article, yes. To me the Grammy thing is not to be taken literally like Scott did. I take it as a metaphor for producing a successful recording at home. Everybody has their own definition of success but in the context of this article it means a hit record that sells what, 50,000-100,000 copies maybe? Whatever it is, the question is can that be done using a project studio at home? Very unlikely imho. One good Sennheiser mic can cost 6K, am I going to try to use that in my bedroom? Note the part of the article talking about the quality of the input signal. Decent demo's can certainly be done, then if you sell it it gets redone in the big studio.
I read about pro's who use Pro Tools LE at home because those files can be sent to a big studio and worked on there since they all have the big $15K Pro Tools system and those home produced files can be loaded right in. A star artist who sings and maybe plays guitar can have a dedicated vocal booth set up in a spare room at home with 20K worth of mic's and preamps. That person can do a vocal track into their pc and send the file over the internet to the studio where it can be plugged into the full band recording that was just done in Studio A. That's cool but the point of this article is it's basically talking about all us semi pro amateurs using at the most a few thousand dollars worth of stuff set up in the corner of the bedroom like me, not a true pro who lives in a multimillion dollar house with a dedicated megabuck studio built into one of the guest rooms.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Bob, I tend to agree with you that money helps buy some mighty fine equipment, and the better the input chain, the better the final sound is going to be. Let's consider a couple of other points. Winning a Grammy, or selling half a million copies of your song/album for all intents and purposes are the same thing in this context. 1. Who are you selling to? If you're selling to a Rap/Hip Hop/Techno audience, I would assume that you could lay down most of the tracks right on the computer from using loops and synths, and then add vocals from an isolation booth, or maybe you want to capture some sort of ambient background, so you wouldn't even necessarily need the vocal booth. 2. Live album. If you were doing a Live rock band, as Bob Harvey has done with his band, he's recorded it live into PowerTracks, and then done the mixing at home. You don't need too much more than what you already have for that. So, it is possible that you could record, and then master in your home studio, for a Live album. 3. Solo piano. You might pick up a system like this one: http://www.helpinstill.com/ that will allow you to 'mic' a piano with no acoustic background noise (think of a guitar pickup for a piano). You should be able to do that with a piano, a halfway decent A/D converter and a laptop. Again, mastering in your bedroom. 4. Pop tunes, I doubt very much. 5. Orchestral music, you might be able to get away with something like GPO, if you were trying to do background sounds, but not as orchestral music. I think the technology is fast approaching the time when you *can* produce something at home, but it largely depends on WHAT you are trying to record, and what audience you're trying to hit. Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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