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As always - I learned a lot from this conversation...thanks to all for your thoughtful and detailed contributions.
BB remains in the number one spot of music programs for me - it does so many things...and is IMHO probably incredibly underutilized across the education community in terms of what it can offer.
I especially like the things it offers that absolutely no other program offers - in terms of rockstar_not's comments about analyzing a song for the overall feel, production, mix, and 'audio magic' in it - and the exercise of analyzing it and trying to get that feel yourself using the tool. Also for lambada's comment about using it in the way I do - to really learn how those instruments you don't play complement each other to create the groove and the feel of a song, and to communicate to other musician's articulately with respect to this.
As always - loving this program and the wonderful community here on the forums.
Last edited by Joe V; 10/31/16 11:09 PM.
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Pardon me for not reading all the previous posts. I might be repeating another. But I have an early lunchtime gig today, and time is short.
Here is my take:
1) When there were very few styles, both PG Music and myself made judgement calls. A particular style might be the best style at the time for a particular song, but not really that close. But when there were only a hundred or so styles, it was "close enough" and at that time the best way to do the song. I've removed and replaced a lot of those assignments in my styles, but there are plenty of others lurking that I haven't noticed yet.
2) BiaB styles are generic by design and not song specific. Years ago I had a few requests to do a style for Elvis Presley's song, "Don't Be Cruel."
"Don't Be Cruel" uses a song specific guitar lick and without that lick, you don't have the song. I soon realized that that particular style was good for one song and one song only. Put it in any other song and as soon as you hear that signature guitar lick, you think "Don't Be Cruel".
So I realized what is the use of making a song-specific style that only works for one song? It's actually a lot easier to do the song in a DAW or Sequencer than to write a style and jump through the hurdles to overcome the limitations of Band-in-a-Box.
With zillions of styles, it sometimes makes it difficult to find the best style for that song. I know, we create fake 'disks' for BiaB. It takes longer to find the best style for each song than any other part of the process. And even then, when new styles come out, what we chose for a fake 'disk' last year might be replaced by an even better one next.
Band-in-a-Box is a tool and a toy. We play music and so try to think about it as playing, enjoy the process, and think about it as the journey as much as the result.
Insights and incites by Notes
Bob "Notes" Norton  Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Peter, Awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I LOVE those Plus styles and all the other unusual time signatures and amazing "non +" styles that pull up when you just type in +. Wow!!!!!!! So glad I was reading this thread. My life has just changed--again!! Get ready world!! Weird cross-over Bollywood Space Age Celtic Rock is on the way in multi-styles! Be warned! But ok, I have to say this is funny: Are you saying that if Hotel California goes Bm, F#m, A E, G, D and the demo is G, C and D that it isn't going to sound like Hotel California...?? are you saying that you have to actually type in the same chords as the song...so it will sound like it? Oh my goodness, I see it now! I think I get it! Ha ha ha ha ha ha. That was funny.
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A very nice copy of Beck. I would be interested in seeing the Google Doc.
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BIAB 2021 (Build 818)
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Zoom UAC-2 (USB 3 interface-built in midi)
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Band-in-a-Box is a tool and a toy. We play music and so try to think about it as playing, enjoy the process, and think about it as the journey as much as the result. This is a big part of it for me too. I have a large collection of midi files that are almost perfect copies of some great tunes and I have the skills with Biab to use those to make all kinds of song specific styles but have no interest in doing that. Sometimes I'll que them up and play along after I've muted the keys part but for me part of the fun is messing around with Biab or RB to create something myself. Also for live gigging, I don't play with tribute bands and could not give a rip if I do a song exactly like a record or not. For the gigs I play nobody cares about that. We do different changeups on the fly like just a week ago I suggested Take 5 as a reggae. We looked at each other and the drummer went what? I said do it something like this so I started a reggae feel riff using the intro to Take 5. The rest of the band just jumped in and it sounded pretty good. This was in a restaurant and the people who were paying attention really liked it. Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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I'll put up a Google-docs spreadsheet of a song I've recently 'reverse arranged' in order to make notes on our band's cover of the song. I would like to see the spreadsheet very much. Thanks Dr. Gannon for adding your voice to the conversation. The demonstration is very impressive. How you created the demonstration is most informative.
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I'll put up a Google-docs spreadsheet of a song I've recently 'reverse arranged' in order to make notes on our band's cover of the song. I would like to see the spreadsheet very much. The most recent one I did was for a song called "This Is Amazing Grace" which is a pretty popular worship song right now. I can post that, or perhaps what might be more useful to you and the community would be to go through this exercise with a more well known song? I would be willing to do this even though it takes about an hour for a typically instrumented rock song. It's good practice. Every time I go through and do this with a song I learn something new. Would you be interested in a group exercise? You pick the song, I will do my version and put it aside, then walk through a live session with a Skype call or something, then compare the group notes with my held aside version.
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))) Would you be interested in a group exercise? You pick the song, I will do my version and put it aside, then walk through a live session with a Skype call or something, then compare the group notes with my held aside version.
This would be great. Thanks Scott!
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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Sounds great. Might be a good idea to record the Skype session as people are logging in from all over the world. I'm in Hong Kong. When I post most people are asleep! 
Windows 10 Home 20H2 Build 19042.487
BIAB 2021 (Build 818)
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Zoom UAC-2 (USB 3 interface-built in midi)
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I'll put up a Google-docs spreadsheet of a song I've recently 'reverse arranged' in order to make notes on our band's cover of the song. I would like to see the spreadsheet very much. The most recent one I did was for a song called "This Is Amazing Grace" which is a pretty popular worship song right now. I can post that, or perhaps what might be more useful to you and the community would be to go through this exercise with a more well known song? I would be willing to do this even though it takes about an hour for a typically instrumented rock song. It's good practice. Every time I go through and do this with a song I learn something new. Would you be interested in a group exercise? You pick the song, I will do my version and put it aside, then walk through a live session with a Skype call or something, then compare the group notes with my held aside version. Here's a link to my Google Sheets (Had to convert it from Excel just now) for Bethel Worship's version of "This Is Amazing Grace" - mostly notes for doing this song with a modern worship band. Link to the YouTube song is included in the file. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Ag83fKGHjw-6xi3p7C_tdhMuyOSSnAWkzTh7RTNXcaY/edit?usp=sharingThis is the first time I've made a file public in Google Docs, so let me know if the link works or not. I will probably write a blog post on this exercise, as I think doing this has made me a better band member as well as helped me to make arrangement decisions for my own songs.
Last edited by rockstar_not; 11/01/16 03:03 PM.
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How about we do a Tom Petty song - 2 of his big hits that I really liked were "I Won't Back Down", and "Free Fallin" - were they big up North too, eh ?
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David Snyder, thanks for opening my eyes to all the midis freely available with all parts pretty true to the original songs. I had no idea there were so many. There seem to be 2 choices to access these: 1.) and Ultimate Guitar Subscription - to TabPro http://plus.ultimate-guitar.com/tab-pro/?utm_source=UltimateGuitar&utm_medium=Header&utm_campaign=UG+Tab+Pro&utm_content=Main+Index2.) Guitar Pro subscription https://www.guitar-pro.com/en/index.php?pg=tabsThis gentleman did a review and seemed to prefer the GPro - as David suggested (though he shared a link to the Ultimate Guitar website). https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1597210With tech moving so fast - I completely missed the huge library of accurate midis available for such low cost. And imported and played in BB - that's the icing on the cake - to slice and dice them up - view and play those tracks separately, in combination, or with different volumes. I'm actually curious to know how they got all these midis together with such accuracy. I know there are books out there that have been transcribed and are sold as "authorized transcriptions", etc. - do they actually have a tool to scan these pages in and/or just generate the midis as the transcriptions are done in Sibelius or some similar program ? And I would bet there's something interesting going on with the copyright in that domain too lol
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How about we do a Tom Petty song - 2 of his big hits that I really liked were "I Won't Back Down", and "Free Fallin" - were they big up North too, eh ? OK - "Free Fallin'" it is. I pick that one over "I Won't Back Down" because I think it's got better application to this method; that is, it has more variety of 'parts' particularly to start the song and the new parts that get introduced are pretty stark and very clear when they occur. By the way, when you do this reverse arranging activity, it's best to listen via headphones. You'll hear how the mixing engineer/producer placed tracks on the sound stage much better than over speakers.
Last edited by rockstar_not; 11/01/16 04:47 PM.
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The Google Doc worked fine. I'm looking at it while listening to the song on YouTube from your link. It's a whole stage of analysis that I have never really bothered to do. Interesting and will be integrated into my own backing tracks creation as I'm feeling ready now to create closer copies of songs. Sitting here listening to Free Fallin'. I'm not very familiar with Tom Petty, but it seems very contemporary sounding given how long he's been around. Maybe we should try to do an analysis similar to yours and see what we come up with? 
Last edited by lambada; 11/01/16 08:07 PM.
Windows 10 Home 20H2 Build 19042.487
BIAB 2021 (Build 818)
Intel(R) Core(TM), i3-4160, CPU @3.60 GHz RAM 16 GB, 64 Bit X64-based processor
Zoom UAC-2 (USB 3 interface-built in midi)
VoiceLive 3 Extreme, Sputnik Valve Condenser Mic
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J*3
I am one musician that absolutely loves the song style filter and I use it everyday of life. I don't like using midi files and working with them. This is because I am actually trying NOT to sound like the original. What biab gives me in terms of feel, tempo and suggested styles is invaluable. I am busy working on a folk swing version of Greensleeves right now.
Then when I am done I can release a my own unique cover version of a song to iTunes rather than just a bad copy which does not sound as good as the original. +1 Joanne! Ian
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If anyone wants to cover a song, there are plenty of MIDI file vendors who sell cover version MIDI files, Tran Tracks, Midi Hits, BandTrax, Peter Solley, Geerdes and more. I found these with a Google search, so I can't tell you whether they are great or not, but I did listen to a couple of demo files, and they sound good. (I used to re-sell some of Tran's work back in the 1990s and he did a great job back then, so I'm sure he still does.)
This seems like it would get you a more accurate cover version of the song than BiaB would do.
I heard a local band do Johnny Cash's "Ring Of Fire" as a Reggae song. It went over great with the audience. If you want to do something like this, Band-in-a-Box is the tool to use.
We do Stevie Wonder's "You Are The Sunshine Of My Life" as a jazz swing tune, using zzjazz almost stock out of the box (only a few edits in a sequencer) and people really like that.
We do Jimmy Buffett's "A Pirate Looks At 40" and "Son Of A Son Of A Sailor" like a Caribbean band with a steel drum player, also with big help from BiaB, and people tell me they like them better than the Jimmy Buffett versions.
Band-in-a-Box is an extremely powerful tool if you want to re-imagine songs, if you want to do a note for note cover, there are better ways to do that. This is in no way a criticism of BiaB - I absolutely love BiaB and it is one of the most important tools in my musical tool box. But there are other tools as well. Different tools for different jobs.
When I do cover songs myself, I do them by adding a track at a time into a DAW or Sequencer. I do this for a few reasons (1) I can (2) by doing this I know the song inside and out (3) I can leave an instrument or two out to play live on stage (4) I can make subtle or drastic changes that I think would enhance the experience. But if I didn't have the skills to do them myself, I'd probably buy the MIDI sequence if I wanted a close cover.
Insights and incites by Notes
Last edited by Notes Norton; 11/02/16 01:05 AM.
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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A wee bit off topic.
Quote from Peter's thread
Instead, type the first 8 bars of the chord progression that you want for your song, and don't play the pre-prepared demo, press the PLAY button (after first selecting 4 bar preview. Then you will hear the style that this feature chose, along with the chords that you want.
Is this function available in Realband?
If not can I open a SEQ file in BiaB, or do I have to key in the chords from scratch?
Chris
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A wee bit off topic.
Quote from Peter's thread
Instead, type the first 8 bars of the chord progression that you want for your song, and don't play the pre-prepared demo, press the PLAY button (after first selecting 4 bar preview. Then you will hear the style that this feature chose, along with the chords that you want.
Is this function available in Realband?
If not can I open a SEQ file in BiaB, or do I have to key in the chords from scratch?
In realband, It isn't available from the stylepicker but you can do it in realband. In realband, you would choose the style that you want, and then exit the stylepicker, so that the style loads into realband . Then type in the chords for 8 bars, and set the song duration to 8 bars. Note that this only works if you have a blank song, because you'd be wiping out existing work. If you want to do it with an existing project, to prevent wiping it out you could save it prior to doing this.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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The Google Doc worked fine. I'm looking at it while listening to the song on YouTube from your link. It's a whole stage of analysis that I have never really bothered to do. Interesting and will be integrated into my own backing tracks creation as I'm feeling ready now to create closer copies of songs. Sitting here listening to Free Fallin'. I'm not very familiar with Tom Petty, but it seems very contemporary sounding given how long he's been around. Maybe we should try to do an analysis similar to yours and see what we come up with? I have my analysis of Free Fallin' about 2/3 done. It does get tedious listening through the same song over and over, but this is also part of the discipline needed to make covers that sound authentic (if that is the goal).
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: AI Stems & Notes - split polyphonic audio into instruments and transcribe
This video demonstrates how to use the new AI-Notes feature together with the AI-Stems splitter, allowing you to select an audio file and have it separated into individual stems while transcribing each one to its own MIDI track. AI-Notes converts polyphonic audio—either full mixes or individual instruments—into MIDI that you can view in notation or play back instantly.
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Bonus PAK and 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®
With your version 2026 for Windows Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons for FREE! Or upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2026 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 27 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 25 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 12 new RealStyles.
- MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
- Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
- Playable RealTracks Set 5
- RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
- SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
- Android Band-in-a-Box® App (included)
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- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
- Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
- RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
- SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
Video: New User Interface (GUI)
Join Tobin as he takes you on a tour of the new user interface in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®! This modern GUI redesign offers a sleek new look with updated toolbars, refreshed windows, and a smoother workflow. The brand-new side toolbar puts track selection, the MultiPicker Library, and other essential tools right at your fingertips. Plus, our upgraded Multi-View lets you layer multiple windows without overlap, giving you a highly flexible workspace. Many windows—including Tracks, Piano Roll, and more—have been redesigned for improved usability and a cleaner, more intuitive interface, and more!
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
Introducing XPro Styles PAK 10 – Now Available for Windows Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!
Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.
Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
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Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Introducing Xtra Styles PAK 21 – Now Available for Windows Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!
Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Introducing XPro Styles PAK 10 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!
Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.
Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 10 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Introducing Xtra Styles PAK 21 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!
Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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