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Hi guys. If you make it through this song, I'd like your opinion(s) about the hook phrase at the end. Should I remove that last one? Is twice too cheesy to your ear(s)? All other opinions are welcome, also. Thanks. https://soundcloud.com/andyandersonmusic/forever-is-a-long-long-timeAnchor.sty (I changed all the instruments) 518 Elec Bass 494 Trumpet NashivlleEven16^20SideStck,HHat RDs 2503 Piano Acoustic Held 2024 Piano Acoustic Rhythm CountryJohn Ev 85 2200 Guitar Nylon background In Gb, 84 bpm
Andy
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You have a wonderful voice and you show strong emotions especially at the end of a phrase. Your band is too weak for your voice it needs more bass depth. I don't know why you think your ending is cheesy.
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Andy, Your song made me sit and listen. Habits not hearts… are hard to break Keep the song as it is, it is beautiful. I think it would sound great with just you and the piano as the words are strong enough to stand on their own. enjoyed! Alyn
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Very cool tune Andy. Loved the vocal and lyric. Awesome story teller
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Thank you, MFsor, Alyn, and Scott. That all so encouraging.
Later, I realized that no one had the benefit of hearing it without that last repeat, but as-is the words did come out a little different than the other spots, kinda proper ending inflection-y. But having your opinions on it, and the whole thing is really helpful, so thanks MFsor -- I can always draft a version with more bass/meat and just see. Suggestions on other instruments, or a style (or maybe a song you think might be a good, rough example?)
Thank you, Ayln. I try to make all words count, and keep it all simple, avoiding the cliche when I can, or something so abstract that as a listener I'd have to really study them to figure out what they mean, if anything. "The raven flew over the iron pit and got peanut butter in his paper raincoat." Paper raincoat...hmmm...that's nice....
I'm not all that, but for me it's easy to hear lyrics where the writer just went for the easy rhyme and arbitrarily forced something clunky in, rather than rethink the whole verse to come up with a better solution. Jimmy Webb said when that happens, take your favorite line out of the verse. It's probably the problem. You can always put it back in.
In a perfect world, I'd love to only use the piano, you are right about that, Alyn, and I'll give that a try. I'm dependent of using the BIAB generated, regenerated tracks. I don't know how to manipulate notes, I mean I know how, but moving them around in the sheet screws everything up, so there are spots where any instrument stops abruptly, or has a hitch when making the change from one chord to the next set. Sometimes I've enveloped it down or punched it out and put another instrument over that spot.
Thank you all again, any that might follow this, for taking the time to listen and respond.
Andy
BIAB 2017 Ultra
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Habits not hearts… are hard to break
One of the best of many very good lines!! This is well written. You obviously have written songs for a while. I would go a little different direction with the arrangement and vocal. You sing well but your vocal feels more folk/country and I think this calls for more of a Sinatra ballad feel. Very nice song!! Take care. Greg
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Thanks, Greg.
Yeah, I'm a folky, classic-country-ish guy. When I play it live, I'm a solo, sparse finger-picker, it's a different vibe. Since I discovered BIAB in February I've felt that my voice couldn't quite hold up with the bigger production. Hopefully it's a learned thing; either I'll grow my vocals out somehow, or be able to reel BIAB back a bit closer to home.
I wrote my first song in Nov 2012. A crappy little song, but it started something going and my world expanded rapidly and exponentially. I knew almost no one in Portland (after 10 years), and now so many, and musicians about everywhere. Just like this forum...music is a bridge.
Later, Greg, and thanks again for your input.
Andy
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I'm with the majority opinion here, too, Andy. Very nice track. I'm kind of a soft touch, but that's beside the point, here. What you have accomplished has created a kind of style all your own. That means the possibilities are as endless as the thoughts and feelings you put into future work. I could see sitting down and listening to a CD of just these songs. Hope you're not a one trick pony ... 
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Ha! Thanks, Ed. My challenge here has been to produce more of my upbeat songs. I only have about a 50/50 mix of them, just enough to keep people from slitting their wrists. Most.
This a real learning experience and it's easy for me to see why I've always been so damn disappointed at a commercial studio. Fun until I'd hear the tracks, throw up, write them a (small) check, and slit MY wrists.
I didn't know what I wanted, so they didn't know, recipe for failure. I had 74 BIAB drafts of that last song. Tweaking, instruments, tempo, you know all that.
Anyway, thank you, Ed. Greatly appreciate you taking the time to listen and comment. And that was quite a compliment and I'll remember it forever.
Andy
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Hi Andy I really enjoyed these and feel encouraged now I've listened to your songs as well as your advice.  I tend to agree that a stronger band might be interesting to hear as would a vocal / piano version for Forever is a Long, Long Time. There's some classic lines in the lyrics. I had a listen to several of your songs. I'm sure they would go down really well on Streetjelly. I know folks there would love your style. Mother's Day is also a beautiful song. In due course perhaps I'll have something to say about the melodies and arrangements. But all good. :-) You should put it up on the Forum.
Last edited by lambada; 11/01/16 08:28 PM.
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Thank you, Lambada. All these suggestions are gold. At the end of the day everything is what I like, but trying some changes is easy enough in BIAB. I have 4-5 that are melody completed to the point of adding vocs, so still drafty and I don't have an emotional tie to any arrangements yet, so an especially good time to look at the feel of them before trying for vocals.
QUESTION: Do you guys peel back the instruments just to do your vocals, or sometimes?
I've found, (and this might just be my newness with all this, a product of the way my home studio is set up like the lower model equipment (I do have several mics and several headphone models I try, or why some vocals don't sync with the melody as well as maybe they could), that I need to sing against things that don't overwhelm my voice, like a light percussion for the beat, and held, bare chord keys, with any rhythm (fill) low enough so I can hear myself, but loud enough to keep me in the melody. Then I add the track to the DAW and add instruments to see what does and doesn't work.
How do you guys handle producing vocals?
Thank you all for any input/suggestions. I really like this particular way I can ask for feedback. On occasion I have asked some out of state touring folks, and a few of the only Nashville/L.A. I know, but I almost never ask anyone I know for input here in Portland. I did once or twice and all of a sudden someone was broadcasting they were the co-writer.
Andy
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Andy,
Nicely done. Reading through your comments, it is surprising that you express "difficulties" recording vocals - yours are very well recorded - clear and even and sitting nicely in the mix.
If you want to discuss this in more detail (as it seems you might), you might consider raising these points in one of the other forum areas - perhaps "Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production" - I think you would get a lively discussion there - and many would benefit from the discussion. There are a lot of folks would do not follow the Showcase posts - but would readily jump in on discussions in the Recording area... also, if you choose to do that, it would help if you mention what you are using in your recording process - any hardware, what DAW, plugins, etc.
Enjoyed your song. Nicely arranged, sung and mix. The piano might be bumped up a dB or 2 - it is a bit low (most people tend to mix pianos too low, in my opinion).
floyd
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You're more than welcome, Andy.
And such good and helpful comments your are getting.
As an aside, I have been studying up on the state of computing, lately. We have all heard of "the internet of things," meaning, driverless cars and wristwatches that turn up the thermostat an hour before we arrive home.
There is a that underlies this trend, and that is the Holy Grail, computers that think.
We become familiar with terms like big data, virtual reality, recognition software, and deep learning. Basically, the camera takes in so much information that the computer begins to resemble a human brain. What makes it possible is the new processors and storage.
So, where am I going with this? Probably the same place Band in a Box has been going for a while. 1) Example, will a sampled sax that echoes an emotion or thought ever actually compete with a live human, on the scene?
2) Isn't part of our game here to test the limits of the technology, which, admittedly, BB is the or one of the leaders?
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Thanks guys. I'm sure it's 60% my inner critic, Ed. But, ya' know, I can't put stuff out there that I'm not comfortable with, even if I'm being ridiculously hard on myself. ...if I could find the 1 and 1/2 people that bought my album a few years ago, I'd buy it back and put a stake in its heart. I'm surprised THEY didn't ask for a refund. I got an $8 check from CDBaby a few months ago. I didn't know it was still available. They are in Portland and I went over and got all the discs from them. Yes, I'll move that question to the other forum. I thought about that 10 mins after I posted! Late to the party as always! Thanks again.
Andy
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And thanks, Floyd. I'll look at that piano. You are a good writer and your songs are produced so well.
My hearing stinks, so mixing is like opening a beer can with my big toe.
Andy
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And thanks, Floyd. I'll look at that piano. You are a good writer and your songs are produced so well.
My hearing stinks, so mixing is like opening a beer can with my big toe. Hahaha...I'm assuredly a member of the hearing stinks category with a severe high f loss and tinnitus...but I've learned to work around it with the help of member of the forum and the good ears of my younger wife There's not much less to say. You've gotten some thoughtful and informative comments. From our perspective floyd pretty much summed it all up. We enjoyed it...and the lyric is really memorable. Look forward to hearing more! J&B
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos
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Thank you, Janice and Bud. The ears here are definitely helpful. Also, new monitors arrived yesterday. What a difference!
Andy
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Andy,
Hi again! Welcome to the forum. I enjoyed listening. You've got a great voice. It's easy to hear that you've been writing songs for a while.
Best regards,
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2026
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Thank you, Noel.
Portland, Oregon is kinda the Austin, Texas of the northwest USA. A large songwriting community in my genre, folk/Americana/lyric driven stuff, so a lot of good examples.
I'm from north Louisiana, and when I go there, it's completely different. Mostly covers, R&R, R&B, and country rock. People endure me, but I know they would rather be rockin' and doing Jello-shots.
I don't know anything about Australia's music scene. I'll have to Google it. Years ago I knew guys that went there thru some arts grant, exchange, or the like.
Later, Noel, and thanks for all your previous help here. I've come a long way.
Andy
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Hi Andy,
I have listened to your song a few times now and like the way it flows.
Your vocal is a very powerful way to deliver those lyrics.
I enjoyed it.
All the best,
Jez
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