|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
I feel confident this is essentially done, but still open to suggestions. This is the first completed song by the Freelance Rider Company and features my lryics brought beautifully to life by the vocal arrangement and expression talents of Tony "twisted6s" Pruden. http://www.cynicalsigns.com/projects/frc/tos/collaboration/who_am_i/Who%20Am%20I.mp3Created with Band in a Box 2009 & Realband 2009, mixed in Sonar 8 Pro and mastered in Wavelab 5. Thanks for any feedback!
Last edited by Texrat; 10/02/09 11:00 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 20,493
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 20,493 |
Hi Texrat,
Very professional work! I agree with you, this is done. The sound that I am hearing is well balanced, musically engaging and well produced. You've done a brilliant job.
All the best,
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2026
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,199
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,199 |
Hi Texrat, If this song is the quality of the recordings on your upcoming CD I will buy it  Very professional indeed. Well done Regards Michee
Windows 11 64 bit, Biab 2024 1111, Realband 2024
i7 Desktop Computer 16Gb Memory
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 809
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 809 |
Excellent work and great vocal too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Thanks guys! It seems to me that it needs a bit more stereo separation... not sure. Anyway it's entered into a songwriting contest at ourstage.com: http://www.ourstage.com/tracks/XUBIPKPJQVRN?autoplay=true
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,086
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,086 |
The vocal on this is fantastic. Love it. Good lyrics - great melody.
The only problem I have with the demo is this. You've got this great vocal going with harmonies and effects - big vocal sound - then here comes this really plain jane music bridge which is somewhat of a let down in the song.
Otherwise A+. Keep up the great work.
Josie
Last edited by Sundance; 10/03/09 08:33 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Yeah, I wanted to beef up the bridge but the singer likes it as is...
By the way, is anyone hearing a leftward bias in the balance?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,122
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,122 |
Great work.......well done, nice mix and balance. My kinda song to begin with anyway. Love the lyrics, and the arrangement. I'd agree with sundance on the bridge issue, but none the less, it is a great song and well produced.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Thanks! I mixed the instrumental parts but Tony did everything from there except final mastering. I'm really fortunate he agreed to collaborate on this.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 904
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 904 |
Hi Texrat,
Great Song, great vocals.
the drums are not as good as the rest, though. Because:
* To much panned to the left
* To many high frequencies (turn down the range between 6-12khz)
* To much and sizzling / whizzy /buzzy (?) reverb (if you turn down high frequencies also in the reverb return, a cutoff at 4-8khz, then you`ll get rid of this sizzling reverb on the left side)
* Drum Arrangement is very strange, especially this pseudo half time thing, where the snare hits randomly once in a while (very akward at the beginning of the bridge)
So if you`d redo the drums in BB and drag some high frequencies out off the mix, you`re done. The rest is very good!!
Sandra
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Thanks Sandra. I'll convey your points to Tony, and see what we can/will incorporate.
The panning is some weird thing I cannot figure out. I can be perfectly centered in every application involved (even output meters registering good balance), and the song(s) come out anywhere from 5% to 20% biased left. This has persisted despite changing sound cards. The common denominator is Windows XP as far as I can tell... but not sure where or why. I have been manually compensating but it's hit or miss and often requires hours of work.
As for the drums, they are 100% BiaB, but maybe I can do something with them... note though that the mp3 has some odd sounds not in the source WAVE (which sounds MUCH better than what I've linked), so it looks like I need to work on the exporting from Wavelab.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Ah-HA!
It looks like the Ozone 4 mastering plug in (using it in Sonar) can correct the balance issues with the Stereo Imaging feature, and I'm cleaning up drum transients too. I might just be able to make this better...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,342
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,342 |
Citaat:
Hi Texrat,
Great Song, great vocals.
the drums are not as good as the rest, though. Because:
* To much panned to the left
* To many high frequencies (turn down the range between 6-12khz)
* To much and sizzling / whizzy /buzzy (?) reverb (if you turn down high frequencies also in the reverb return, a cutoff at 4-8khz, then you`ll get rid of this sizzling reverb on the left side)
* Drum Arrangement is very strange, especially this pseudo half time thing, where the snare hits randomly once in a while (very akward at the beginning of the bridge)
So if you`d redo the drums in BB and drag some high frequencies out off the mix, you`re done. The rest is very good!!
Sandra
I can only agree with Sandra.
I think a mastering engineer could cure most of it.
You've got a winner on your hands!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,722
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,722 |
Texrat,
I agree with all that has been voiced above (especially the bridge) so all I'll add is my kudos in acknowledgement of a very strong performance of a well written and produced tune.
Later,
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Well, playing around with Ozone 4 is helping. I've fixed the balance issues, the drums sound better, and I have pulled the instruments out a bit more. That plugin is amazing.
Have not heard back from my collaborator on his thoughts. I'm heading to Amsterdam for a week but when I get back I'll see what else I can do.
Thanks again all!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913 |
Texrat, I agree with Sandra on all points.
I would not leave the balance issues of the drums to a mastering engineer - this is a mix issue. It will be very difficult for a mixing engineer to correct a panning issue of just one instrument of a stereo mix. If you try to fix it with a plugin, it's going to do odd stuff with the rest of the instrumentation and arrangement, which to my ears, seems well balanced.
The sparse drum parts in the bridge simply do not fit with the rest of the song which has a fairly rich sounding arrangement. It's at that point when the drum parts shout from the rooftops - " I'm a MIDI drum part! " It would be a shame to leave them as is. Think of adding in some ride cymbals - manually played, where you vary velocity and so forth, to stretch things out between the snare hits - even consider zapping the somewhat random snare hits from that bridge section altogether - you might like it.
It's possible that you have a MIDI controller panning the drums over so far to the left. Could be right at the opening of the song. Have you looked at an event editor to see if there's a pan setting on channel 10?
I do have some comments about the instrumental section - the pad/strings get kind of muddied up down in the low end of things. Also, that section is begging for a solo melody line on guitar. Or a piano solo. Or pedal steel - some kind of solo. Right now, it just kind of hangs there and doesn't do anything.
Just my thoughts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69
Enthusiast
|
|
OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Thanks for the feedback. Those are actually RealDrums, not midi, but I get your point. The panning issue isn't just drums-- it's actually EVERYTHING. Every song, every track. I can see it in Sonar-- I just don't know the cause. The only way I have found to truly correct it is with Ozone 4 (which was discovered after this mix) and I'm ok with the results. But that said, I am determined to keep digging into root cause. I think I need to say I am 100% self-taught here, and am really just a lyricist with medicore acoustic guitar strumming ability who uses Biab/RB + Sonar to bring my songwriting to life. The work on this song (and others in the project) is the result of 6 months hard effort on learning through trial and error while unemployed. "Idiot's guide to Composition" has been a big help too.  Unfortunately most of the instrumental work I do is canned (eg, Biab realtracks and midi), due to bugs (amazingly enough, glitches have produced usable passages!) dumb luck, brute force or help from someone (like the closing piano midi, which a friend provided). I'm really talentless in the solo area and not sure what I can do here. But I appreciate every educational opportunity-- you guys are GREAT.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 904
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 904 |
Hi Texrat,
You are NOT talentless. To choose a nice Realtrack / Midi, tweak it a little and put it all together needs talent. And you`ve got talent. The song is great, and everyone loved the vocals and lyrics. So it`s really just about the drums. Take the given advices from the folks here on the forum, learn from it, and you`ll have a great mix.
Hang in there, and let us hear some more stuff of yours,
Sandra
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,086
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,086 |
+1 to Sandra's post. Whatever problems you have - talent is not one of them. If you were to start a new thread about your panning problem there are people on here who might be able to help you track down the cause and fix it. You shouldn't be having that problem in RB. Josie
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913 |
Texrat - I get the sense that you took my advice a little too harshly. It's a quite nice song that is nearly there and there are just a few tweaks needed to really 'take it to the next level'. It's worth doing.
Coming across my monitors, the panning issue really sounds like it is limited to drums only. Now, I did a little test with a pan control while listening - and perhaps it could be an EQ issue - more highs seem to be coming through the left channel than the right channel. Because of your instrumentation choice, it makes the drums sound biased more left than right as the high hats and snare have the most noticeable content in the high end of things. What reverb plugin are you using with what settings?
When you say you see a panning bias in every track in Sonar, how exactly are you seeing the left/right difference? In other words, how is Sonar analyzing the tracks? Are you looking at VU meters for each track in a post process sense or before plugins on each track? Make sure to look strictly at mono sources, like the original vocal tracks in this case - they are very likely mono.
The RealDrums tracks should show equal levels on the kick events for L/R, but don't count on any of the other sounds showing up equally left and right.
-Scott
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Update to Build 10 of RealBand® 2026 for Windows®!
If you're already using RealBand 2026 for Windows, download build 10 to get all the latest additions and enhancements.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® users: Build 904 now available!
If you're already using Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, make sure to grab the latest update! Build 904 is now available for download and includes the newest additions and enhancements from our team.
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® users: Build 1237 is now available!
Already a Band-in-a-Box 2026 for Windows user? Stay up to date and download the build 1237 to get all the latest additions and enhancements.
PowerTracks Pro 2026 for Windows is Here!
PowerTracks 2026 is here—bringing powerful new enhancements designed to make your production workflow faster, smoother, and more intuitive than ever.
The enhanced Mixer now shows Track Type and Instrument icons for instant track recognition, while a new grid option simplifies editing views. Non-floating windows adopt a modern title bar style, replacing the legacy blue bar.
The Master Volume is now applied at the end of the audio chain for consistent levels and full-signal master effects.
Tablature now includes a “Save bends when saving XML” option for improved compatibility with PG Music tools. Plus, you can instantly match all track heights with a simple Ctrl-release after resizing, and Add2 chords from MGU/SGU files are now fully supported... and more!
Get started today—first-time packages start at just $49.
Already using PowerTracks Pro Audio? Upgrade for as little as $29 and enjoy the latest improvements!
Order now!
Band-in-a-Box 2026 for Windows Special Offers End Tomorrow (January 15th, 2026) at 11:59 PM PST!
Time really is running out! Save up to 50% on Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® upgrades and receive a FREE Bonus PAK—only when you order by 11:59 PM PST on Thursday, January 15, 2026!
We've added many major new features and new content in a redesigned Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
Version 2026 introduces a modernized GUI redesign across the program, with updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, and a new Dark Mode option. There’s also a new side toolbar for quicker access to commonly used windows, and the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, making it easier to customize your workspace.
Another exciting new addition is the new AI-Notes feature, which can transcribe polyphonic audio into MIDI. You can view the results in notation or play them back as MIDI, and choose whether to process an entire track or focus on specific parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
Upgrade your Band-in-a-Box for Windows to save up to 50% on most Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade packages!
Plus, when you order your Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade during our special, you'll receive a Free Bonus PAK of exciting new add-ons.
If you need any help deciding which package is the best option for you, just let us know. We are here to help!
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® Special Offers Extended Until January 15, 2026!
Good news! You still have time to upgrade to the latest version of Band-in-a-Box® for Windows® and save. Our Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® special now runs through January 15, 2025!
We've packed Band-in-a-Box® 2026 with major new features, enhancements, and an incredible lineup of new content! The program now sports a sleek, modern GUI redesign across the entire interface, including updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, a new dark mode option, and more. The brand-new side toolbar provides quicker access to key windows, while the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, creating a flexible, clutter-free workspace. We have an amazing new “AI-Notes” feature. This transcribes polyphonic audio into MIDI so you can view it in notation or play it back as MIDI. You can process an entire track (all pitched instruments and drums) or focus on individual parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
There are over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
When you order purchase Band-in-a-Box® 2026 before 11:59 PM PST on January 15th, you'll also receive a Free Bonus PAK packed with exciting new add-ons.
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® today! Check out the Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.
Happy New Year!
Thank you for being part of the Band-in-a-Box® community.
Wishing you and yours a very happy 2026—Happy New Year from all of us at PG Music!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums57
Topics86,084
Posts799,908
Members40,030
| |
Most Online44,367
Mar 4th, 2026
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
There are no members with birthdays on this day. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean