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I find all comments above are worthy of consideration. I know of someone moving to Nashville because of this. He will get eaten alive and spend a lot of money doing it. Bacharach & David wrote an excellent song about exactly that: "Do you know the way to San Jose?"
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
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You've been getting pitched 15-30 demos a week since pre-internet days? That's about 30 years. No. I apologize if that's what I said. I thought I had indicated that that was more recent. I used to MAYBE get 1-2 a week. And some weeks I wouldn't get any at all. That was because when I first started, my market for work AND for talent was right were I lived! LOL I don't live in a big city or anything either! That has been since people got much more active on social media and networking. NOT 30 years by a LOOOOONG shot! Let's take the low end of that, which is 15 demos x 52 weeks x 30 years. That's about 25,000 demos! My question is, most people making jingles would have, by now, found some good artists that they work with regulariily, and wouldn't be spending so much time still searching by being 'pitched' demos from strangers. We are talking about jingles here... not songs? I explained the numbers above, and I hope that clarified it. So not anywhere near 25,000 demos! Not. At. All.  I have found A LOT of artists I love to work with. I would say I have a roster of a little over 500 to work with. Those, are singers, guitarists, bass, drums, studio engineers...you name it. Some are better than others. Many times budget dictates the caliber of talent I get to use. Another HUGE factor for me is if they need to have to have a specific sound. As an example, years ago I had a jeweler who loved the song "The Search Is Over" by the band Survivor. He said he would do anything to get that sound. I was lucky enough to know a guy out of Memphis that worked with Jim Jamison. I had opened for Jim (not Survivor) which was just enough to get me in the door with him. He sang one of my jingles! It was a total high point for me. I had him sing a total of 3 for me over the years. I miss that he is gone. So people come, and people go. Just because they have a sound, doesn't mean it works for everything. People who sound like Janice Joplin can't necessarily sound like Britney Spears. Also, male and female are two, obviously, different sounds. Now ad in those who can record from a personal studio, and those that have to go to one. There are many variables that come into play...especially when you work on tight deadlines at times. Many times because of tours, people are available at some points, and not at others. I have my people that are my "go to" people. They are proven reliable, fast, and accurate...and available at the time I need them. Now multiply that by the number of people needed for any given project. I also have to go outside of that box to get something specific, and it's easier to know what available BEFORE you need it, then to be desperate. At least that's my take. This also brings up something that I don't think people consider. I would guess about half of those that I get are from non-English speaking countries, or it's not their native language. This can present a problem in both pronunciation of sung words or sometimes even basic communication. This is not to say they aren't talented...they very much are. But singers especially, many times can't be used. The internet has opened up a whole new world! For example, lots of businesses have graphic artists that they work with, maybe a few for different scenarios. So they find good people and stick with them. They don't find themselves getting pitched by 15-30 new graphic artists a week looking for work and responding to them, and being surprised that some of them are not that talented. Indeed. But I think that's apples to oranges. There's a good chance a guitarist or graphic artist may be able to do something that someone else can do...copy a "style." But again, with singing, it's has a uniqueness to it. As great as Berry White was he wouldn't "sound like" Steve Perry...or visa versa...or Cindy Laupar. Guitars a a bit more masking of the sexes...as is graphic arts. As far as me being surprised that some are not that talented...that wasn't my point. My point was THEY don't seem to realize it. Again, there is NOTHING wrong with not being able to sing. I CAN'T! But I'm not asking people to hire me to do it either. If I did, and they didn't...I would know why. I wouldn't have to ask. If I did need to know, I wouldn't say they don't know what they're talking about. I would listen. If I disagreed, so be it. I would see if there was any merit in it; but grow from it. For what it's worth, that's why I love BIAB. It allows me to put together things fast, and well. That's hard to beat in my book!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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I know of someone moving to Nashville because of this. He will get eaten alive and spend a lot of money doing it. Bacharach & David wrote an excellent song about exactly that: "Do you know the way to San Jose?" To be clear on this, I don't know him well, but I've heard him perform often enough. He is ok, but I wouldn't say exceptional. Sort of a small fish in a small pond. Who am I to say not to go for it? Nobody! I fear for the worst, but hope for the best for him. As far as the song you referenced, I had never heard it. I read the lyrics first, and saw who it was performed by. THEN I heard it...not at all the feel I was expecting! LOL Thanks for the share of that. I love learning new things like that!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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How do you learn?
Well if you are serious about learning, you have to be willing to ask for and receive criticism.
When I first started in digital recording wow, talk about bungled stuff...lets just leave it at that. I posted my amateurish tunes in the forum for songs and asked others to listen and discuss what was going on. I never took offense no matter how harsh the crits were. When I send songs to outside reviews, I ALWAYS ask for the strictest, most brutally honest reviews they offer. How else will I learn? And yeah, some of it stings.... but hey, it's all about getting better. Today, I find that the lessons learned and applied have given me the skills to jump into the arena with the big boys and girls... the pros, and to do it successfully.
So if I am asked to critique someone who is "less than stellar" I will offer honest advice. If you don't want to hear the truth, don't ask. I'm not going to tell them it sounds good if it doesn't sound good. There's no need to be a buzzkill but I'm not going to lie to them either. there are tactful ways to tell someone they need more work or that perhaps they are in the wrong line of work, and I have really tried to work on being a bit more diplomatic. Most often that comes down to.... did they ask for my opinion? If not.... I keep my diplomatic mouth closed.
If they did ask for thoughts, opinions, critiques..... OK.. they asked....What I will do first, is try to find something in the song, it might be the guitar playing or perhaps the tone of the guitar, or the singer's voice characteristics, something that they ARE doing right and start with that. I tell them what I like about that and then go from there.
If it's recording & production, same deal. I don't comment as often now on songs here, or in other forums where I used to be really active and reviewing every single song. Frankly, I don't have the time to listen to everything let alone write an honest critique of every song. I mostly comment on the songs that really stand out and capture my attention or that are really good and perhaps are lacking one thing to make them nearly perfect.
I've been taken to task here, publicly as well as through PM over some of my comments. I guess I was a bit too outspoken in those instances. I tend to call it like I see it and not everyone is looking for or wanting advice. They just want to be told "good job" and sometimes I will simply say that too.
hope that helps.....
If not.. I can tell you what I really think!!
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Wendy, excellent idea about a checkbox. I'd like to encourage musicians without a long critique. Peter?
I don't think that constant praise is necessarily a good thing. It can be very destructive in large doses.
Donny
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Wendy, excellent idea about a checkbox. I'd like to encourage musicians without a long critique. Peter?
I don't think that constant praise is necessarily a good thing. It can be very destructive in large doses.
Donny +1 I would actually "Like" this comment if there was way to 
Last edited by HearToLearn; 01/25/17 12:57 PM.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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How do you learn?
Well if you are serious about learning, you have to be willing to ask for and receive criticism.
When I first started in digital recording wow, talk about bungled stuff...lets just leave it at that. I posted my amateurish tunes in the forum for songs and asked others to listen and discuss what was going on. I never took offense no matter how harsh the crits were. When I send songs to outside reviews, I ALWAYS ask for the strictest, most brutally honest reviews they offer. How else will I learn? And yeah, some of it stings.... but hey, it's all about getting better. Today, I find that the lessons learned and applied have given me the skills to jump into the arena with the big boys and girls... the pros, and to do it successfully.
So if I am asked to critique someone who is "less than stellar" I will offer honest advice. If you don't want to hear the truth, don't ask. I'm not going to tell them it sounds good if it doesn't sound good. There's no need to be a buzzkill but I'm not going to lie to them either. there are tactful ways to tell someone they need more work or that perhaps they are in the wrong line of work, and I have really tried to work on being a bit more diplomatic. Most often that comes down to.... did they ask for my opinion? If not.... I keep my diplomatic mouth closed.
If they did ask for thoughts, opinions, critiques..... OK.. they asked....What I will do first, is try to find something in the song, it might be the guitar playing or perhaps the tone of the guitar, or the singer's voice characteristics, something that they ARE doing right and start with that. I tell them what I like about that and then go from there.
If it's recording & production, same deal. I don't comment as often now on songs here, or in other forums where I used to be really active and reviewing every single song. Frankly, I don't have the time to listen to everything let alone write an honest critique of every song. I mostly comment on the songs that really stand out and capture my attention or that are really good and perhaps are lacking one thing to make them nearly perfect.
I've been taken to task here, publicly as well as through PM over some of my comments. I guess I was a bit too outspoken in those instances. I tend to call it like I see it and not everyone is looking for or wanting advice. They just want to be told "good job" and sometimes I will simply say that too.
hope that helps.....
If not.. I can tell you what I really think!! Herb, There is a fine line between CONstuctive and DEstructive criticism . Few of us have that unique gift. I had a boss who could reprimand me without breaking my spirit. He was a grand total of one in my entire working life! Donny
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))) I would post examples, but I really don't think that would be fair, nice, or professional.
How about posting examples of jingles (favorites that you've made) from your 20 years in the biz? I love jingles, and listening to music is more fun than reading these kinds of arguments. You may get some publicity and business from it, if someone hears them and needs some jingle work.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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I'm not too hot on the idea of a like button. I was a moderator on a forum where we tried that and the number of posts plummeted afterwards...you know just hit the like button and move on like facebook. Nobody should be shy about saying a few words about something that appeals to them on the forum. Jump in and enjoy! We appreciate positive comments and constructive criticism from all. Really.
Bud
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos
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I grew up and frequently jammed with Bob ( Zimmerman ) Dylan in HS circa '56-59 (I'm 2 months older) but I would probably never qualify him as a singer, if asked.
Also, the Everly Brothers were turned down by every studio in Nashville before 'making it'. They would play in the alley behind Ryman Auditorium hoping to be heard.
Donny
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))) I would post examples, but I really don't think that would be fair, nice, or professional. I meant posting examples of some of what I receive and feel...well...could use a lot more practice? Then I guess people could decide if I missed out on the Beatles. How about posting examples of jingles (favorites that you've made) from your 20 years in the biz? I love jingles, and listening to music is more fun than reading these kinds of arguments. You may get some publicity and business from it, if someone hears them and needs some jingle work. I would love to do that; but I primarily write for agencies, stations, and sometimes direct to client. In all cases, the jingles are a complete buy out. So it becomes property of the person who pays me. That being said, I am starting some new products this year that would allow me to post some of the work I do. Some of it using PG Music products. I also want to make sure I don't devalue may service because of potential clients having the perception that "it's not that hard." Thanks for the interest!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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I'm not too hot on the idea of a like button. I was a moderator on a forum where we tried that and the number of posts plummeted afterwards...you know just hit the like button and move on like facebook. Nobody should be shy about saying a few words about something that appeals to them on the forum. Jump in and enjoy! We appreciate positive comments and constructive criticism from all. Really.
Bud Sure, come in here with your real life experience, great wisdom and solid points. I wouldn't have thought of that...the part about postings dropping. Great points!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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I'm not too hot on the idea of a like button. I was a moderator on a forum where we tried that and the number of posts plummeted afterwards...you know just hit the like button and move on like facebook. Nobody should be shy about saying a few words about something that appeals to them on the forum. Jump in and enjoy! We appreciate positive comments and constructive criticism from all. Really.
Bud J&B, I didn't mean to exclude comments but allow listeners an option to "like" so as to be positive reinforcement. I would think that would actually boost participation. Many (including myself) hesitate due to fear of being thought stupid although I have rarely seen anyone flamed on these PG Forums. Donny
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I grew up and frequently jammed with Bob ( Zimmerman ) Dylan in HS circa '56-59 (I'm 2 months older) but I would probably never qualify him as a singer, if asked. Agreed. Though, I don't remember him singing jingles either. Also, the Everly Brothers were turned down by every studio in Nashville before 'making it'. They would play in the alley behind Ryman Auditorium hoping to be heard. There is a difference though. They weren't turned down for not being able to sing. They had a sound the record companies weren't looking for at the time. I think we can agree they had a sense of pitch and rhythm and some pretty amazing talent. What I'm referring to are people that don't sing in key...I don't mean as in a creative choice either. They also may not have much of a sense of rhythm.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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Caaron,
This response is just for the occasional person you mentioned who takes offense when you decline their services. When somebody listens to the same song you just listened to, but they hear "cha-ching" while you hear "ba-boom"...
It's hard to hear an opinion we don't like, and easy to disagree with something we can dismiss as easily as personal opinion.
But if you can run whatever these people submit through software like Melodyne that can show a graphical representation of how well each note sits where its supposed to... in terms of both pitch and timing... you might not have to offer your opinion at all. Let the picture do the talking.
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Peter, IIRC, wasn't Mac the Jingle Master? He used BIAB exclusively.
Donny
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eddie1261
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eddie1261
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So - if its the best i can do as a rank AMATEUR i shouldn't post until its been polished,processed and mastered for fear of offense?
Post whenever you think you have a good representation of your song. And ALWAYS remember this. Everybody here, at even step on the musical evolution ladder, wrote their first song at some point in their life/career. For the most part, the songwriters here are not generally full time professional musicians. The guy who gigs her the most plays covers and in his own words never got the hang of writing. Some (like me) have put out a CD just because we can, and largely for our amusement and sense of accomplishment. Also remember that your songs are your songs. They mean something to you. Nobody can ever tell you that your ideas are wrong. You won't get a lot of deeply negative vibes here. You'll get more gentle suggestions, all friendly attempts to help you learn the game a little better. Try the suggestions if you choose to, and if they don't suit your vision, delete that change and you will be back where you started. Keep in mind that nobody here will ever try to discourage you. Just remember that Kevin will ALWAYS say you have too much reverb. (Sorry man. Couldn't resist!  )
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Eddie,
More cowbell and a bagpipe solo, please?
Donny
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My thoughts..... put better than I could say it... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I71cY9Ysy5U(wink x2)
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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On this forum, I have been around a LONG time - mid to late 90's when I started learning here. I've run into exactly one person (hasn't posted in this thread yet!) who thinks their musical poop doesn't stink and about 1 month a year, they'll show up here asking how to get more radio play with their stuff; how to market; ask opinions about the latest feed-on-the-ignorant music publishing scams, etc. Their stuff is schlocky / stinky bad; lyrics full of cliché; songs that go nowhere, etc. They have changed user names a couple of times after a few persons have tried to kindly suggest actual improvements in mostly kind ways, but it is clear over the years, that this person doesn't believe that their material has anything wrong with it - they believe that all that is missing are different marketing perspectives and methods. Have I said any of the above to that person? No. I do not believe it will do any good to or for them. I actually believe this person might have some personality defects of some type just based on the delusional behavior they have exhibited with their posts. Fixing delusion is above my pay grade! With rather rare exceptions, most of us here are just making music because it's plain good fun. We've had a couple guys that make their living in the recording/producing industry, and many that do the 1 or 2 person band gig full time; coming this way by way of the singular product BIAB. The folks relying on this for their income, they are the professionals. I consider my music hobby to be like an amateur photographer that has studied the craft, but I'm not fooling myself that I will ever be able to replace my income with music hobby income. What I do is akin to giving a framed photo I've taken to family and friends and sometimes they will hang the picture in a prominent place, many times it ends up in the storage room. Totally o.k. with that. Does this give me any kind of right for 'brutal honesty'? Nope. Even when it's tempting, still doesn't give me a right to that. In a week, I will be participating in February Album Writing Month, where thousands of people across the globe will be trying to write 14 songs each over a 4 week period. There will be a whole bunch of bad songs I will write, and the others will write, but there will also be a couple that will get some nice comments (if past years are any indication) and I will find many that made me smile in some way, and I always take the time to let somebody know if that was the case and give a very specific hint at what it was that made me smile. Some of those folks have become my favorite artists over the years. There's a guy who plays the hang drum (think of an inverted steel drum with more pure tone, played with the hands) who just simply makes goosebump inducing songs each and every year. If a song makes you smile or get 'that feeling' that only music can provide. Let the artist know with a kind comment or some cash sent their way. Oh, and if anyone's interest was piqued: www.fawm.org is the February Album Writing Month challenge. Site goes live in a day or so for 2017. There will be lots of opportunity to practice kind commenting.
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Today's the Last Day of the Band-in-a-Box 2026® for Mac Special!
Order before 11:59pm PDT today (May 15, 2026) to save up to 50% off your Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac® upgrade and receive a FREE Bonus PAK loaded with great new Add-ons to use with this new version!
Don't wait - order today!
Check out all the new features in the redesigned Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®!
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac - Special Offers End at 11:59pm PDT on Friday, May 15th, 2026!
Order before 11:59pm PDT on Friday, May 15th and SAVE up to 50% on most Band-in-a-Box® version 2026 for Mac Upgrade packages... and that's not all! With your version 2026 for Mac purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks... that's 222 NEW RealTracks available with version Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac!
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac® today for as little as $49! Check out the Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all available purchase options.
Learn more about the Free Bonus PAK and 49-PAK here.
If you have any questions about which package is the best option for you, just let us know. We're here to help!
202 New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2026!
With Band-in-a-Box® 2026, we've released 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 468-488) in a variety of genres—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Funk & World (Sets 468-475):
Our new jazz, funk & blues RealTracks include a groovin’ collection of RealTracks and RealDrums! These include more requested “soul jazz” RealTracks featuring artists Neil Swainson (bass), Charles Treadway (organ), Brent Mason (guitar), and Wes Little (drums). There are new “smooth jazz” styles (4), which include a RealTracks first: muted trumpet, as well as slick new smooth jazz brushes options for drums. Blues lovers will be thrilled—there are more “classic acoustic blues” styles, including guitar (5), bass (4), and drums (10) with blues master Colin Linden, featuring understated and tasty background acoustic soloing, plus brushes drums and acoustic bass. There are also new electric blues RealTracks, including electric blues with PG favorite Johnny Hiland (3) and soulful electric slide guitar from Colin Linden (4). If you love funk & gospel, there are great new options this year, including gospel organ (3) from Charles Treadway, as well as new funk, tango, and rock ’n’ roll drums (3) and bass (1). And for big, bold arrangements, we have uptempo soul horns (4) featuring a three-part hip horn section with options for a full mix or stems of each individual horn — plus an accompanying rhythm section (4) of drums, bass, guitar, and electric piano!
Rock & Pop (Sets 476–482):
Our new rock & pop RealTracks bring a powerful mix of requested favorites, fresh genres, and modern chart-inspired styles! We have more of our popular “Producer Layered Acoustic Guitars (15)” featuring Band-in-a-Box favorite Brent Mason. We’ve continued our much-requested disco styles (10), and added new Celtic guitar (5) with a more basic, accessible approach than our previous Drop-D or DADGAD offerings. There are also highly requested yacht rock styles (17), inspired by the smooth, polished soft-rock sound of the late ’70s and early ’80s — laid-back grooves, silky electric pianos, warm textures, elegant harmonic movement, and pristine production aesthetics. Fans of heavier styles will love our new glam metal (13), capturing the flashy, high-energy sound of ’80s arena-ready guitar rock. We also have a set of rootsy modern-folk rock (18), with a warm, organic sound combining contemporary folk textures and driving acoustic strumming. And we’ve added lots of new modern pop styles (16) — the kinds of sounds you’re hearing on the radio today, featuring exciting new drums, synths, and cutting-edge RealTracks arrangements.
Country, & Americana (Sets 483–488):
Our new country & Americana RealTracks deliver a rich collection of acoustic, electric, and roots-inspired styles! We have new country pop (9) with legendary guitarist Brent Mason. There is also a potpourri (14) of bouzouki, guitars, banjo, and more, perfect for adding texture and character to contemporary acoustic arrangements. We’ve added funky country guitar (5) with PG favorite Brent Mason, along with classic pedal steel styles (5) featuring steel great Doug Jernigan. There are more country songwriter styles (8) that provide intimate, rootsy foundations for storytelling and modern Americana writing. Finally, we have “background soloing” acoustic guitar (12) with Brent Mason — simpler, but still very tasty acoustic lines designed to sit beautifully behind vocals or act as a subtle standalone solo part.
Check out all the 202 new RealTracks (in sets 468-488)!
And, if you are looking for more, the 2026 49-PAK (for $49) includes an impressive collection of 20 bonus RealTracks, featuring exciting and inspiring additions to add to your RealTracks library. You'll get new country-rhythm guitar styles from PG Music favorites Johnny Hiland and Brent Mason, along with modern-pop grooves that capture today’s radio-ready sound! There are also new indie-folk styles with guitar, bass, 6-string bass used as a high-chording instrument, acoustic guitar, and banjo. Plus, dedicated "cymbal fills" RealDrums provide an added layer that work very well with low-key folky styles with other percussion.
The 2026 49-PAK is loaded with other great new add-ons as well. Learn more about the 2026 49-PAK!
2026 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®!
With your version 2026 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons for FREE! Or upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
- The 2026 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 27 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 25 new RealTracks and 23 new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 12 new RealStyles.
- MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
- Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
- Playable RealTracks Set 5
- RealDrums Stems Set 9: Cool Brushes
- SynthMaster Sounds Set 1 (with audio demos)
- iOS Android Band-in-a-Box® App
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2026 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyle.
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- MIDI Styles Set 93: Look Ma! More MIDI 16: SynthMaster
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 47: More SynthMaster
- Instrumental Studies 25 - Soul Jazz Guitar Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 20: Songs with Vocals 10
- RealDrums Stems Set 10: Groovin' Sticks
- SynthMaster Sounds & Styles Set 2 (sounds & styles with audio demos)
Learn more about the Bonus PAK and 49-PAK for Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Mac®!
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