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So Bud, if you were getting paid that amount in the 60's, I would think that had to be pretty great pay at that time?
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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If that band plays every night, they need to make $3,333 per night to make 100k per month. Nobody makes $3,333 on Mondays and Tuesdays. That means they make somewhere around $5000 per gig for 20 gigs per month. We have all scored that random corporate gig for 5k on rare occasion, but consistently? But whatever. I am not going to argue about it because I don't really care. This software and forum is pretty much for songwriters and solo/duo acts and what some copy band in Wisconsin makes is not really all that relevant to what this forum is about. This one post asked that question, so okay, but a large number of people here are songwriters. Either you are a member of that band or they are your friends because you have mentioned them several times. To my ears, my own opinion, they are just another copy band (that stole their name from Andy Kaufman's alter ego character), and I do not appreciate copy bands. At all. Any copy band. Zoso comes through here with their Led Zepplin act. Never seen them. They are just another copy band to me. I am a songwriter, which I believe takes a higher level of skill set. We have had this conversation here before. 
Last edited by eddie1261; 03/15/17 10:40 AM.
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So Bud, if you were getting paid that amount in the 60's, I would think that had to be pretty great pay at that time? In 1965 - 1966 if you had a van with your band name on the side in "fancy" letters, some friend who was a roadie wannabe, and some sharp clothes, maybe some glittery Kustom amps and a shiny Farfisa organ then you were rock stars -- really. Oh and make sure you had a raised drum stand  Ours was 2x4's, plywood and wingnuts for quick assembly. Rent a gym in a small town, pay the DJ a percent of the door to play your 45 for a week before and the kids poured in...$500-700 after expenses was common. But for frats and clubs $300 was about all we could ever get. But you are right that money went a LOT further. I'd go by the bank on Friday, withdraw $20 and have money left over after the weekend. Gas was 30 cents a gallon, etc. Had it not been for the draft I would have dropped out of college in a heartbeat and made all the $ I could. A friend and I rented a recording studio in block times and recorded small bands for a set price. We offered them all the studio time it took to get an A and a B side and 500 45's to take with them. I forget exactly what we charged but we made a good bit doing that. Who knows, had I been able to stay on that journey it would likely have been a heckuva lot more interesting than 35 years in the hospital admin business -- on the other hand I have a retirement income
Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more. If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks! Our Videos
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If that band plays every night, they need to make $3,333 per night to make 100k per month. Nobody makes $3,333 on Mondays and Tuesdays. That means they make somewhere around $5000 per gig for 20 gigs per month. We have all scored that random corporate gig for 5k on rare occasion, but consistently? Neither of those are how they do it. But whatever. I am not going to argue about it because I don't really care. This software and forum is pretty much for songwriters and solo/duo acts and what some copy band in Wisconsin makes is not really all that relevant to what this forum is about. This one post asked that question, so okay, but a large number of people here are songwriters. I was under the impression this would be acceptable to the topic. To me it was very relevant to the conversation. Either you are a member of that band or they are your friends because you have mentioned them several times. I know of them because they are from the area I live. I used to (25 years ago) play in a competing band. I never brought them up here before, that I know of. So rather than argue, point me to the threads. You may want to pic your mic up.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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In 1965 - 1966 if you had a van with your band name on the side in "fancy" letters, some friend who was a roadie wannabe, and some sharp clothes, maybe some glittery Kustom amps and a shiny Farfisa organ then you were rock stars -- really. Oh and make sure you had a raised drum stand Ours was 2x4's, plywood and wingnuts for quick assembly. Rent a gym in a small town, pay the DJ a percent of the door to play your 45 for a week before and the kids poured in...$500-700 after expenses was common. But for frats and clubs $300 was about all we could ever get. That sounds so fun...for my younger self! lol Those seem like "golden times" to me. But you are right that money went a LOT further. I'd go by the bank on Friday, withdraw $20 and have money left over after the weekend. Gas was 30 cents a gallon, etc. Had it not been for the draft I would have dropped out of college in a heartbeat and made all the $ I could. I was curious about that because I ran your rates on an inflation calculator and it seemed like a decent amount of money to me! A friend and I rented a recording studio in block times and recorded small bands for a set price. We offered them all the studio time it took to get an A and a B side and 500 45's to take with them. I forget exactly what we charged but we made a good bit doing that. Ok, THAT is cool! You were there in best of times for that kind of thing. I'm envious! Who knows, had I been able to stay on that journey it would likely have been a heckuva lot more interesting than 35 years in the hospital admin business -- on the other hand I have a retirement income Hey, hospital admin are the rockstars of the health industry, right? Plus, I always assumed bands to all have strong 401k and retirement plans. Isn't that what most people at that age are diligent about?  I have to say, I love hearing this type of thing. Those times just seem so carefree...not the draft part. Just the living music part! Thanks for expanding on that for me!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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You do realize your example doesn't even make sense, right?
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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You may want to pic your mic up. It's a rental.
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Vic's band is good and they are playing Vegas....
$1.2 mill gross is a heck of a lot of money for a band like that. If they are getting that kind of money.... God Bless them for finding a way to make a decent living playing music in these times.
Pompalmoose is another duo that makes their income from the web and not from gigging. In fact they hired some musicians, and did a 30 day tour. They actually lost money on the tour. So they work from their studio and put music on the net and sell it direct to their fans. No touring, low overhead, and what a cool way to make a living huh?
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Radio shack doesn't rent mics!  Stop in during my shift and I'll see what I can do.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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You do realize your example doesn't even make sense, right? Makes perfect sense. Learn 4 chords, the famous Pachelbel Canon progression, and you too can play in a copy band. Hundreds of songs that never deviate from that 1-5-6m-4 progression. And if you can only handle 3 chords, you can play in a Kiss or Skynard copy band!!
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Makes perfect sense. Learn 4 chords, the famous Pachelbel Canon progression, and you too can play in a copy band. Hundreds of songs that never deviate from that 1-5-6m-4 progression.
And if you can only handle 3 chords, you can play in a Kiss or Skynard copy band!!
Here is what I am trying to say. Your comments seem to have almost nothing to do with the OP's subject...gig prices. So far your contribution has been about how you don't care about information that had to do with the subject at hand, what this forum is really about, and how you don't like "copy bands." I'm fairly certain that a number of people on this forum generated these gig prices, whenever they played, from play at least some covers at some point. Don't take my lack of response going forward as I have nothing more to say. I am, for the first time, going to use the block feature. It's at the advice of another forum member. I frequently remember your comments and see that you're not about an opposing view on whatever the subject at hand may be. I actually like that! Your's isn't about contribution, it seems to be about disruption. You make accusations that, when challenged, you can't back up. Still waiting for that list of other times I have referenced this band. That didn't go unnoticed. I see no point in having a conversation, now or in the future, with someone who does thing like that. So, I wish you the best, and see ya My apologies to the OP. Hopefully that will end this part of it...at least from my side.
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
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You do realize your example doesn't even make sense, right? Makes perfect sense. Learn 4 chords, the famous Pachelbel Canon progression, and you too can play in a copy band. Hundreds of songs that never deviate from that 1-5-6m-4 progression. And if you can only handle 3 chords, you can play in a Kiss or Skynard copy band!! How about a copy band that only played YOUR songs, would you go to see them! Musiclover
Last edited by musiclover; 03/16/17 04:05 AM.
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How about a copy band that only played YOUR songs, would you go to see them! Musiclover Nightly!
Last edited by eddie1261; 03/16/17 10:15 AM.
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[quote=musicloverHow about a copy band that only played YOUR songs, would you go to see them! Musiclover Nightly! [/quote] Somebody does like copy bands around here, I rest my case! musiclover
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Somebody does like copy bands around here, I rest my case!
A tribute band to ME??? Oh HELLZ yeah!!! 
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There is ONE tribute band I would see, and they are in Russia. Some of you may have heard of them, particularly if you are on Facebook. They are a Chicago tribute band called "Chicagovitz". It is EXACTLY like seeing/hearing old Chicago before people started quitting in a snit or shooting themselves..... They just did a CD of I think 11 songs and I bought it from CD Baby. And if they toured here, I would go see them. Everything is spot on.
And that is my last off topic post here in off topic. Though I suppose I could make it on topic by saying they would make a TROUGH full of money playing here.
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There is ONE tribute band I would see, and they are in Russia. Some of you may have heard of them, particularly if you are on Facebook. They are a Chicago tribute band called "Chicagovitz". It is EXACTLY like seeing/hearing old Chicago before people started quitting in a snit or shooting themselves..... They just did a CD of I think 11 songs and I bought it from CD Baby. And if they toured here, I would go see them. Everything is spot on.
And that is my last off topic post here in off topic. Though I suppose I could make it on topic by saying they would make a TROUGH full of money playing here. Yep.... I've seen the video of that band.... quite a talented bunch of comrades. On this side of the pond.... I actually won a pair of tickets to see a Lynyrd Skynyrd Tribute band in Raleigh on Saturday night but my wife is not feeling well. She has something that has her coughing and sneezing and ... it's truly painful to see and hear. So unless she recovers in a dramatic fashion, we'll probably miss that show.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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I'm a little late to the party, and I have an early gig today, so I didn't have time to read all the responses. Please excuse any redundancy. Yes, we play for about what we did 20 years ago, while inflation eats away at our buying power. <...snip...>
Who's to blame? The clubs for exploiting the bands? The musicians themselves for undercutting each other and undervaluing their music? The perception of the people for thinking music is supposed to be cheap or free and not being willing to pay to see live bands? Solo guys with backing tracks on a computer who will work cheaper than a 4 piece band?
or.... all of the above? 1) Taxes and smaller mark-up for bar/food prices. Back when the MADD Mothers crusaded against drunk drivers, the State of Florida (and others) used it as an excuse to raise the tax on drinks $0.50 per drink. The bar I was playing in raised their price $0.25 and ate the rest. Food and other services have raised prices to the clubs as well and they are in the same spot as the musicians. 2) Karaoke Jocks. Not Karaoke clubs where the audience gets up and sings (although that hurts some) but people who don't play instruments, buy Karaoke software and go out and play clubs as if they were musicians. This increases the supply of entertainers and supply and demand rules. Plus since they have no investment in instruments and gear or the time to learn, they tend to undercut their prices to get in the door. And since the clubs are working with reduced profits, they tend to think these entertainers are a good bargain even if the product turns out to be inferior. 3) Open mic nights. Musicians will play for free and bring a group of customers with them. Too good for the club to pass up even if the music turns out inferior. 4a) Cable TV. In my parent's generation, TV was black and white, with reduced bandwith for audio, tiny speaker, and tinny sound. Later color TV with bigger speakers but the same thin bandwidth for audio so tinny sound. TV was free, but you had to go out to listen to live entertainment if you wanted to hear good music. 4b) Cable TV continued: Now we have "Home Theater" with giant super HD screens, 7.1 surround sound, and you can have The Stones, Adele, Ga Ga, Chesney, or whatever famous artist/group you like in your living room, like you have a front row seat, and just about whenever you want to stream them. 4c) Cable TV continued: TV used to be free, now it's easy to pay $300/month for TV subscriptions. That money used to be spent in night clubs for live entertainment. Multiply that by millions of Cable TV subscribers, and you can see why attendance is down in clubs. People just don't go out like they used to. 5) The music industry killed itself. It used to be that the music was an expression of an entire generation. From Al Jolson through Frank Sinatra through Elvis Presley through The Beatles everybody of that generation knew the words to their songs. Then came disco which split the market followed by (in no particular order) Metal, Rap, EDO, Pop, R&B (not to be confused with traditional R&B), Alt Rock etc. Not everyone listened and knew the words to Metallica, Dave Matthews, or even Michael Jackson. Instead of a youth radio station, most markets had several different formats for the same generation. So music no longer became the glue that held an entire generation together, therefore it lost its importance. 6) DJ clubs. The youth market and the wedding market that used to be predominantly live bands are now predominantly DJ run. Again, more supply for the same demand. And now DJs have even replaced bands in the adult market. --------- Subtract from the above (OP). 1) Singles playing with backing tracks. I've never seen a single replace a 4 piece band around here. They play in rooms that always hired a single. They just sound fuller than they used to. A big club with a big stage and a single with backing tracks replacing a 4 piece band with a real drummer? Ain't gonna happen. --------- I'm glad I grew up when I did. I've managed to make a decent living all my life playing music (with the exception of two jobs when I was investigating what it would be to be 'normal'. I found that for me normal is over rated). I've paid off a house in a very nice neighborhood, bought brand new cars (although they were Dodge price point instead of BMW price point), a couple of sailboats, and a nice yearly vacation to 5 continents. I could have made more with the electronics engineering I took in college, and even tried that for a couple of years (playing music on the weekends). But I'm living my life on my own terms, I'm not a wage-slave to some inhuman corporation, I don't take orders by some Dilbert type boss, and instead of saying "I have to go to work today", I say "I GET to go to work today" and I mean it because playing music is my second favorite thing to do. In addition I've been treated as a peer by the top musicians of the day, I got to jam with many of them, record with others, I almost made 'the big time', and I've had the opportunity to be intimate with dozens of beautiful women culminating with the best one of all who I married. And for these experiences I actually got paid. How lucky is that!!! Do I regret choosing Music over Engineering? Not one bit. I feel sorry for the younger musicians who don't have the opportunity that I had. Insights and incites by Notes
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Good article Notes. I think you should pitch it to some music magazine publishers.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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