I'm thinking about re-doing them with a Ketron and higher bitrate because things are better now
Notes, Yes. I think they really deserve this. I think you will be doing the product the justice it really deserves, and potential customers a great favor.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
When I wrote earlier about the differences between GM and non-GM midi I was referring to stuff like Garritan uses the mod wheel for volume control. That's not GM spec. SampleTank has some drum kits that are GM mapped but most of them use Imap. This allows keyboard players to use their hands to play drum parts on a keyboard in a much more natural way than GM drumkit mapping allows for. Same thing with other drum controllers. All use different mapping than the standard basic GM.
Most of the big name softsynths don't even have a GM soundbank. Ask yourself why is that? It's because GM is way too restrictive with it's midi controls, way too restrictive with it's instrument banks. Notes talked about how the patch map numbers are the same. True but you only get one or two patches of each instrument. One nylon guitar, one standard grand piano and one bright piano. A piano VST by itself has dozens and they give you stuff like mic placement controls, lid up/down/partial controls, room ambience and much more. Partial pedal dampening. None of that is in the GM spec.
The best horn and string VSTi libraries are the same. All the different lip, mouth, bowing articulations that have zero to do with GM. It's all those controls that allows a good player to make synths sound real.
That's what I was talking about. GM is very basic and pro's could care less about it.
Bob I agree that is basic and limited and that is why a lot of amateurs also do not use it. Even BiaB is breaking away from strictly GM by adding VSTi and ST2 and Sforzando (sfz).
Have you noticed how many "how do I add (insert a VSTi), "how do I assign a MIDI channel" etc BiaB questions lately? Some forum members are discovering there are better MIDI sounds than what comes with BiaB, even though there are much better sounding VSTis then what comes with BiaB now. But the fact is ST2 and SFZ both sound a lot better than BiaB GM plus you can do more with them.
As far as I am concerned GM is dying a slow death.
YMMV
The fitness trainer asked me, "What kind of a squat are you accustomed to doing?" I said, "Diddly."
64 bit Win 11 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
The only thing standard in GM are the patch numbers.
The 127 continuous controllers are the same on all synths, GM or not, they are part of the Standard MIDI File set. Whether a particular synth responds to all 127 CC's depends on the synth maker. And there are GM and non-GM synths that don't support them all.
And yes, GM synths don't have every sound known to the synth world, but neither do no-GM synths. But GM synths do include the standard 127 voice GM set.
And no, all GM synths are not restricted to one sound for each of those 127 instruments. My SD 90 has a minimum of 4 variations and up to 20 variations of the same sound simply by adding a MSB and LSB into either the patch selector or entering them with CCs.
My XV5050 has thousands of sounds and it included a GM bank. Same for my SD90. My Ketron has 4 banks, one of which is GMIDI - so please don't be spreading the misconception that GMIDI synths are limited to GM sounds. There are plenty of synths that do not have a GMIDI bank that have thousands of fewer sounds than my XV.
There are good sounding synths with a GM bank and lame sounding synths with a GM bank. There are also good sounding synths without a GM band and bad sounding synths without a GM bank.
All GM specifies are common patch numbers for 127 patches - or twice that for GM2. Everything else is covered by the Standard MIDI File specs, and both GM and non-GM synths either include or don't include everything in the specs.
The only thing standard in GM are the patch numbers.
And yes, GM synths don't have every sound known to the synth world, but neither do no-GM synths. But GM synths do include the standard 127 voice GM set.
And no, all GM synths are not restricted to one sound for each of those 127 instruments.
My XV5050 has thousands of sounds and it included a GM bank. Same for my SD90. My Ketron has 4 banks, one of which is GMIDI - so please don't be spreading the misconception that GMIDI synths are limited to GM sounds.
There are good sounding synths with a GM bank and lame sounding synths with a GM bank. There are also good sounding synths without a GM band and bad sounding synths without a GM bank.
All GM specifies are common patch numbers for 127 patches - or twice that for GM2. Everything else is covered by the Standard MIDI File specs, and both GM and non-GM synths either include or don't include everything in the specs.
My search today was to find a method for humanistic feels from BIAB. I believe you may have satisfied my quest. Ive heard some really dynamic jazz backing tracks that was said to been created by BIAB. But as you've stated they probably used a DAW for the final product. So I should learn how to get BIAB multi midi tracks properly imported in a DAW. I have LogicPro X, StudioOne V3, and Cubase. Will one work better than the other. My main need for BIAB is to create dynamic backing tracks for my wife (singer) and I (sax) to perform with and not sound boring.
I would very much appreciated if you would share anymore words of wisdom.
My search today was to find a method for humanistic feels from BIAB. I believe you may have satisfied my quest. Ive heard some really dynamic jazz backing tracks that was said to been created by BIAB. But as you've stated they probably used a DAW for the final product. So I should learn how to get BIAB multi midi tracks properly imported in a DAW. I have LogicPro X, StudioOne V3, and Cubase. Will one work better than the other. My main need for BIAB is to create dynamic backing tracks for my wife (singer) and I (sax) to perform with and not sound boring.
I would very much appreciated if you would share anymore words of wisdom.
Thank you
The DAW that will work the best for you is the DAW you are the most familiar with and understand the best to edit audio and midi. BIAB exported tracks are 44.1k/16 bit audio files so they are recognized by every DAW exactly the same.
With time and patience working and learning BIAB, you can make as professional quality backing tracks as anything you can find on the market.
Yes, my demo files are done on the mediocre plug-in soft synth that PG provided at the time. I could have put them on the best sounds of my array of modules, but then if someone bought them and played them on the Coyote or whatever, they might think I misrepresented the product. Plus they are recorded as mp3 files - some with a low bit rate of 32kbps because back then people used dial-ups.
I'm thinking about re-doing them with a Ketron and higher bitrate because things are better now, but it's finding the time. We are gigging doing 4-5 one-nighers per week in the season and 2-3 in the off season, and I'm also trying to make more MIDI styles and Fake Disks that can use either MIDI or RT styles. (I haven't watched a single TV show since the late 1980s)
And if MIDI sounds fake, than the majority of keyboard parts you hear on hit records and plenty of the other instruments sound fake to you as well.
But that wasn't my point.
My point is expression is 100 times more important than the sound. And MIDI allows you to customize the expression. MIDI allows you to change the expression to whatever you want it to be. It allows you to manipulate the music to say what you want it to say.
Yes, our promo video sounds MIDI-ish, and most of the songs definitely have BiaB in there somewhere. I've added some song specific licks and kicks in them to make them sound like the songs I'm representing, and not sound like someone using an arranger keyboard or BiaB live accompaniment. What I've done to them you couldn't do this with RealTracks.
Plus, we have been working steadily since 1985 and get more work and charge higher prices than those duos playing 'real instruments' with a drum machine.
The public doesn't give a @!#&% whether your sounds are MIDI or "real", they want to hear the music the way they want to hear it.
Now the RealTracks sound great, as a musician I appreciate good tone. But I am also a pro musician and know what the public wants. And what the audience wants is actually more important than what I want.
You can play for yourself, you can play for other musicians or you can play for the general public. If you are good enough, you'll get the audience you asked for.
If the RT fits the bill perfectly, I'll use them. Sometimes I'll use RT or some RT instruments on songs, especially jazz standards that are chord/melody based instead of riff based like a lot of modern pop music.
But most modern pop music is riff based and any auto-accompaniment style is generic by design. With MIDI I can modify the BiaB output and put the riffs and kicks in.
I repeat because it's important, the public doesn't care if the sound is MIDI. They want to hear and feel the music. Try doing James Brown's "I Got You (I Feel Good)" with a real track and tell me how many people are going to dance to it. Or thousands of other songs that need something that identifies them.
You can't do this or thousands of other songs with RealTracks, but you can manipulate MIDI tracks to do this. We do this song and the crowd loves it.
Notes
I get where your coming from, but for me it's all about real tracks. Why would I pay for audiophile edtion just to use MIDI. Sure, I'm not going to have the backing track emulate the oringal song, but I'm nopt all about that. If the general public doesn't care about whether or not you use MIDI or not, then people would not pay money to see live bands. I do understnand your point as I have tracks made by a guy that use cheesy keyboard sound recorded onto mp3. Also, I don't have the time to meticulously edit every detail for ever MIDI track.
Computer: Macbook Pro, 16 inch 2021 DAWs: Pro Tools, Logic, and Maschine plays drums, percussion, bass, steel pan, keyboard, music producer/engineer
<...snip...> If the general public doesn't care about whether or not you use MIDI or not, then people would not pay money to see live bands. <...>
People pay to SEE live bands because they want to WATCH them make the music.
I have been in a duo since 1985 with 100% MIDI backing tracks that I make myself. We work steadily and are probably the highest paid duo in my area. We currently have a house gig for 9 years running now and have had repeat business that have hired us since the 1980s.
It's what I do for a living.
The public neither knows nor cares that my tracks are 100% MIDI. They like watching Leilani and I sing and play guitars, sax, flute and synthesizers along with the tracks.
What we do is play our music expressively, choose the right songs for the customers, and entertain them.
And I might add that our MIDI tracks sound more "life" than pre-recorded tracks.
What?
Is this blasphemy?
Actually not. There is a difference between having a mix for a recording and a mix for live. What do you hear as you approach a gig with a live band first? Snare drum and bass?
By having complete control over every instrument I can remix things for live performance. I can kick up the snare and kick drum leaving the rest of the drum set alone. I can also exaggerate the groove and put the snare ahead or behind the beat a tad when appropriate. I can even mix a little timbale on the 2 & 4s on the snare to approximate the drummer hitting the head an the rim at the same time and put a couple of MIDI tics between them.
I can pump the bass up, I can change the guitar to a different brand of electric, I can detune the horns a little to approximate stretch tuning to make them sound better and do all kinds of things to make the backing tracks sound more "live" than a recording mixed to sound good in your living room.
That's not to negate Real Tracks, because everyone has their own way of doing things and there is more than one right way to make music.
This works for me, paid off the mortgage, and buys me a yearly international vacation.
XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.
What are XPro Styles and Xtra Styles PAKs?
XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!
Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!
Get the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Get Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 19 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!
Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:
Purchase your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac during our special to save up to 50% off your upgrade purchase and receive a FREE BONUS PAK of amazing new Add-ons. These include the 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK, Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana, Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes, MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano, Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7, Playable RealTracks Set 4, RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark, and more!
Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
Playable RealTracks Set 4
RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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