PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production BIAB Made It to Music Supervisor

Your Band-in-a-Box for Windows purchase includes RealBand. You'll find the features of RealBand and Band-in-a-Box complement each other. Both are great additions to have in your musical toolbox.

Audacity is another tool many of us use but technically Audacity is not a DAW, it is an audio editor. It's not a DAW because DAWs work with both audio and MIDI. Audacity doesn't work with MIDI.

You may be able to use the Behringer USB mixer as an audio interface. If Audacity can use the Behringer USB mixer then Band-in-a-Box and RealBand will be able to use the mixer to move audio in and out of your computer.

Fingers,

I will try and make this as simple as I can. I am glad you have Audacity because that will come in handy toward the end. Everything I am saying is to help you stay within "spec" and not get kicked out. For stuff you want to play for your friends, you can do whatever you want. But if you want it to get passed on this is what I recommend.

1. Less is more. The more effects, or more tools you add to your process, the greater the risk you run of sounding thin and metallic. Same goes for tracks. Seven or eight are enough, though when you start getting fancy you may triple the vocals or double the drums, but in terms of instruments don't go over four or five. Deadly.

2.You need a simple decent DAW and an a good audio interface and a great condensor mic and good solid cables for your guitar. Everything has to be shielded. You have to spend at least $300 on the mic. Go to a music store and ask for help on buying a good condensor mic that has the different patterns, such as the cardioid pattern which you will use most frequently.

3. Get a microphone stand shield for your mic. This is critical. It will save you hours later trying to fix vocals or anything recorded with that mic. It traps the sound around the mic, short non-scientific version.

Mic Shield

4. Get a good audio interface like the Focusrite. That also comes with a bunch of free Eqing software to get your started.

5. Avoid mixers. Go straight into the audio interface. Anything that has electrical power that comes before the audio interface input will add some electrical noise and alter the cleanness of your signal. That will add to the brittle metallic sound later.

6. Your condensor mic will require "phantom power." That button is on the Focusrite. Remember to turn it on when you are using the mic. Turn it off for everything else going direct (like guitars.)

7. If possible, record all your parts dry (no effects) and then add effects to them later. In the free DAW "Real Band" that comes with BIAB, you get Amplitube for free. There are some awesome Band in a Box amp and pedal presets in the free Amplitube that comes with Real Band. Check out all of them. There is some stuff in there that will make your dry electric sound like Keith Urban but it is under control and won't make you sound metallic. There are some Amplitube bass presets that will clean up the bass part well.

8. If you are using a Real Track electric that already has an effect (Not a DI or Direct Input choice) leave it alone. Adding an effect on a track that has an effect is the kiss of death in mixing for these purposes. It will sound thin and metallic. You can add an EQ to it, but you can't add an amp effect on top of an amp effect unless you really know what you're doing. The explanation on that is too long for these purposes.

9. Keep it really simple and let Band in a Box do its thing insofar as the mixes that come with Xtra styles, which I highly recommend if you are going into production work. Get all 4 packs and buy all of them that come out. Trust me on this one. They are pre-mixed. They have all of the modern sounds and modern mixes you are looking for. Again, less is more. They have done the work for you. You can flip through the demos on the web real fast to find what sound you want for a certain sound that is being asked for.

10. Use audiophile version if you can. The sounds are ready to go and you don't need to hardly touch them. If you use the regular version, export the files for each track and then use audacity to do a gain change and shape the tracks until they sound great.

11. Inside your DAW (like Real Band) record just a few really good tracks on your own but KEEP IT SIMPLE. You HAVE to invest in some EQ tools, there is no way around it. I don't use Real Band for mixing, so ask people here who do what EQing tools they use in Real band on drums, Vocals, guitars bass. Create presets you can use over and over. Spend a lot of time finding those Eqing tools and building those presets. Again, I don't use Real Band for mixing, just track generation so I can't say. I use Sonar still for mixing and have about a thousand dollars worth of VSTs I suppose (or maybe more) so I am afraid I won't be of much help in the beginning stage set up.

12. Whatever you do, keep it very very simple and only add the effects you have to to give the vocals some richness, add sparkle and thump to the drums, or tame the bass.

13. Export.

14. Go into Audacity and look at that file. I almost always do three things.

A. I do a 1.5:1 compression on the file to bring it into line. Compressed based upon peaks box unchecked.

B. Then I do ONE pass at compress based upon peaks. "Check" the box.

C. Then I normalize to -0.9. That gives me some head room.

Finally, I go into Ozone and use the simple of very gentle polishing.

I use the TT_DR Meter to make sure I am not clipping, and that my dynamic range is at least 9 but preferably 12. If you can find this meter, get it. It will be your most valuable tool. If it says "over" on the TT DR meter they will kick you out. If the dynamic range is like "5" they will kick you out. Overcompressed. In audacity, if your .wav looks like a big blue brick they will kick you out. It is overcompressed and maxing out at every area of the loudness meters.

Making a production ready song BIAB is very possible, but it takes a village to raise a song.

Dive in and start learning and ask as many questions as you can of the pros and they will help you.

You can start right away using audiophile version if you are doing just instrumentals.

Just create a song in BIAB, let BIAB do its thing, export (save as .wav) go into audacity, do that compression routine, normalize, cut out the click track, give it a one sec moment of silence, a slight fade out at the end to get rid of any noise and a one sec or two sec silence at the end, print, and you are good to go.

Submit.

That's about it for the day.

Let me know how else I can help.

FYI: My song "Running from the Law" was mastered usually EXACTLY the same steps described in Audacity above with only a very mild polish in Ozone. I think it is now on about 15 internal playlists at SongTradr in addition to being forwarded. Check out the .wav form. If you ADD anything to BIAB you should not take a .wav form that looks like this and turn it into a brick or add anything that sounds harsh or metallic. You have to stay warm. The warmth of the tone is EVERYTHING.

Be careful.

https://www.songtradr.com/user/song/david-snyder/running-from-the-lawd120


https://www.songtradr.com/user/profile/david.snyder

Great info on your last couple of posts David!

For Fingers..... The RAM on your PC is a little low at 4 Gig. If you upgrade some of those software tools that David referred to, you may need to at least double your RAM. Some software eats a lot of resources.

Yeah, Steve you are right. 8 gigs of RAM is what you will need. Your computer uses 2 while it is idle.

But 8 is more than plenty for what you will be doing, as long as you aren't running Google Chrome in the background.

David brings up another good point with his Google Chrome remark. Have nothing running in the background that can interfere with your recordings. That is disable your Ethernet card and turn off you anti-stuff like anti-virus, anti-spyware etc. Just be sure to turn them back on when you are finished with your music session.

Well, I am not sure I will ever turn off my firewall while I was connected to the Internet, or EVER, or not sure you need to turn off Norton (I wouldn't ever), but definitely go into task manager stop all that other junk that gets going if it isn't a system program. Mario has a point there.

Some people don't realize that if you have 8 tabs open in Chrome you have 8 instances of Chrome running.

And you go, Gosh, why is my computer not running???? Is it something evil???

Amazon "music helper" or whatever it is called is atrocious. Yeah, suck up all my memory and CPU. Very helpful. Thanks Amazon.

Jim Fogle - Thanks for the information and input.

I was under the impression that BIAB being a 32bit application it could only access up to 4gig. Even though other applications could use more. Limiting the number of plugins and/or rendering tracks can greatly reduce memory use. Having a really good sound card however is paramount.

My thoughts

Tony

David-

I really appreciate you taking the time to give me all this information. I just met you but, in my life. I have found that people like you who are generous with their time and talents will have great blessings & positive outcomes in their endeavors. Best of luck with your submissions.

If you want to hear some of my previous home studio recordings, go to this link

http://www.theskynotes.com/new.htm

(This is a website for a band I play in once a month.)

(I am addressing your comments below in parenthesis)

1. Less is more. (I agree with this philosophy).

2. Mics & DAW (I have some great mics and will get a decent DAW.)

3. Get a microphone stand shield for your mic. (Have one of these as well).

4. Get a good audio interface like the Focusrite. (I will check this out)

5. Avoid mixers. Go straight into the audio interface. (Kind of figured this)

6. Your condensor mic will require "phantom power." (Got it - been there done that)

7. If possible, record all your parts dry (no effects) and then add effects to them later. (Always have recorded this way)

8. If you are using a Real Track electric that already has an effect (Not a DI or Direct Input choice) leave it alone.
(I try to use minimal effects)

9. Keep it really simple and let Band in a Box do its thing insofar as the mixes that come with Xtra styles, which I highly recommend if you are going into production work. Get all 4 packs and buy all of them that come out. Trust me on this one. (I will check this out)

10. Use audiophile version if you can. (OK will do)

11. You HAVE to invest in some EQ tools, there is no way around it. (Got it - I have 100's VST's from my days of using Yamaha DSP FACTORY with Minnetonka MTRAX software They might be outdated but I have them somewhere)

12. Whatever you do, keep it very very simple and only add the effects you have to to give the vocals some richness, add sparkle and thump to the drums, or tame the bass. (AGREE)

13. Export.

14. Go into Audacity and look at that file. I almost always do three things.

A. I do a 1.5:1 compression on the file to bring it into line. (I usually do 1:2:1)

B. Then I do ONE pass at compress based upon peaks. "Check" the box. (I will try this)

C. Then I normalize to -0.9. That gives me some head room. (I will try this)

Finally, I go into Ozone and use the simple of very gentle polishing. (I will try this)


Making a production ready song BIAB is very possible, but it takes a village to raise a song. Dive in and start learning and ask as many questions as you can of the pros and they will help you.

(Thanks again for your encouragement and advice. I did submissions for NSAI reviews 4-5 years ago, entered song contests etc. Have some friends who have gotten songs on TV through TAXI and also and a friend with a connection to NEW LINE CINEMA.

Right now, I am looking to make some great recordings of my originals and to be inspired to write new ones with BIAB. I do have 8-10 instrumentals to do with BIAB and may consider sending them off them to
some song submission sites.

Have a great weekend - FINGERS

32gb here. I like having BiaB, Logic Pro X, Ozone 8, Nectar 2, Neutron 2, a few Waves products and Safari open simultaneously with no speed issues. FWIW I just bought a new iMac with 8gb and upgraded it myself for < one half what Apple wanted.

Bud

Sounds great Fingers!

I went your site. Hey, I like your songs man. If you ever want advice on NSAI give me a shout. I am a coordinator.

Sounds like you are off to the races. Let me know how I can help.

BTW, I see I have 64 new messages from SongTradr. Looks like 6 more songs just got forwarded and made the final cut and are being listened to by people all over the place and have been added to 8 to 10 more internal playlists.

Hmmmmmmm. I'm starting to really like Band in a Box.

You are an animal Bud.

I was just sayin' I think for what Fingers is doing, 8 is all he needs.

But since you are recording Rush in your living room and need 32 mics for the drums I can see how you need the extra horsepower.

I can't wait to hear Xanadu Redux: Return of the Steely Eyed Gargoyle and the Crimson King on Bastille Day: Part Five.

Get on with your bad self.

Well, thanks to this thread, I joined the Songtradr site today and will be getting some of my stuff uploaded over the next few days. Although the site recommends highest quality possible - they list 48kz I usually save my files at 44.1/16 and will continue to do so and see how that flies.

I've followed a few BIAB forum members I've found on the site so far and a few have already followed me in return. Thanks for that.

David,

Congrats on your songs getting through to music supervisors. That's no easy feat to accomplish these days!

Also, thank you for taking the time to post such explicit information on software, settings and how to use. This insight into your recording and processing techniques provides very valuable information for all of us.

All the best,
Noel

David- Congrats on your songs making it to the final cut. Glad you enjoyed my tunes. Have not had time for NSAI but if I get back into it, will hit you up for advice. Thanks again, Kevin (Fingers)

David, after reading your post earlier about Songtradr possibly using analizers for loudnes I took a closer look at the songs I was uploading and submitting today. After making the adjustments I ended up having 3 out of six songs shortlisted and 2 forwarded.

I look at my other songs on there and I came to the realization that I need to remix a lot of them. Luckily I just got some new VSTs that will help with this.

Thanks for sharing your tips and observations on this.

That's great Charlie. Hey I followed you too! Hey man, you need to post a pic! Everybody else has one!!

Thanks great Samuel. Which category was that?

I am really happy for you. We all need to hang together. It's us against 100,000!



Hey I see there is a Hank Williams request going on. I KNOW there are some people on here who could slam dunk that one!

Yeah everyone out there selling plugins is telling you need to max it out and make it as loud as you.

No---you don't. You don't need to do that at all. That trend is going backwards.

Let's do this together y'all!!!!

Thanks Noel.

I have always found that success is a team sport.

Yes I saw that you followed me. All of the BIAB Forum members I found, I followed and they reciprocated. Great fellowship. Thank you for following and thanks to the others as well.

I also saw that Hank Williams posting and submitted "My Sad Story" after uploading it. I now have 3 songs uploaded with more to come.

Picture? Hmmm that's a challenge but my page on that site is still a work in progress.

I also agree 100% with you that BIAB is completely capable of producing top level, commercial releases. On many different levels.