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I know this will make folks mad BUT if your new to DAW use buy Power Tracks Pro. It's 29 dollars and has 100s of features you'll know about howevr that's better than Reaper,etc. that'll have 1000s of features you know nothing about.
PT will keep the waters less muddy and works perfectly as an add on to BIAB.
JohnnyD
Hi John, Even though I have only been on the PGmusic forums for less than a week, I have learned enough about the people here to say that I would be very surprised if anyone here would get mad about your recommendation of Power Tracks Pro. I think that your rationale for suggesting that to Vincente is a wonderful one, and I agree completely that Reaper (and some other DAWs) are so complicated at first that it could put someone off. I am grateful for the other suggestions, too.
Last edited by drutgat; 10/14/18 11:52 AM.
"If The Beatles or the 60's had a message, it was 'Learn to swim'. And once you've learned - swim!"
John Lennon
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I used SONAR for decades. When we thought they were gone, I tested all the demos I could find and switched to Mixcraft.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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I used SONAR for decades. When we thought they were gone, I tested all the demos I could find and switched to Mixcraft. In my last huge purchase on a computer to do audio recording (in 2007), I went Mac, and I have to say that I really, really liked the simplicity of workflow in GarageBand - more than Logic, actually. That was a great 'starter' DAW. Am going to look at Mixcraft now, if it is still around.
"If The Beatles or the 60's had a message, it was 'Learn to swim'. And once you've learned - swim!"
John Lennon
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Wow, so much great advice here.
I'm just gonna add that I think Matt Finley said it best earlier in the thread "Most people will recommend the one they know best because if you learn one there is rarely a good reason to use another."
The most important thing, IMO, is to pick one based on what you read here and stick with it.
Each DAW will have its own way of accomplishing things and its own learning curve.
That said, as someone else in this thread very wisely pointed out, since it appears that the DAW of choice in these forums seems to be Reaper, go with that to the extent that you may be soliciting advice from forum members throughout your musical journey.
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+1 for learning RealBand and seeing if it meets your needs. If not, start shopping for something that has features you need. I grew up with Cakewalk from the DOS days. You can now use it free at www.bandlab.com , but it pretty much expects you to be connected to the Internet. https://cakewalk.bandlab.com/
Last edited by PhillyJazz; 10/15/18 02:58 AM.
Jan - 12 Core AMD Ryzen 9 3900X
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I should confess I don't use RealBand, but like PhillyJazz I had long since learned Cakewalk Pro Audio (which became SONAR, which recently became BandLab). I'm wrongly following my own advice by not learning this particular "new" one when I already knew another quite well. Many users here make a great case to learn RealBand for the special abilities it has, most notably regenerating sections of a track.
If I were starting out, I certainly would have learned RealBand first. Then moved to a standalone DAW.
Standalone DAWs are like foreign languages. They all do the almost the same things; they just go about it differently. The more of them you learn, the easier it gets as you see the similarities. Often it's a case of learning the terminology (what one DAW calls this, another calls that).
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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I agree that RB is a good place to start if you are a BB user. In addition, you can generate additional RT's for the same instrument so you can make composite tracks. I also like the interface for RB. Once you get used to the DAW concept (I am just getting comfortable), I would think about Reaper. I have been watching the videos about Reaper lately and it seems to do things that RB can't. I am going to bring my next BB project into Reaper to see how it goes. As far as your wife killing you for spending the money, you might want to put it in perspective for her. You could be a big game hunter, a car enthusiast or spend your dough on boating and fishing gear. Recording is a lot cheaper.  2b
i5-3210 laptop. Win 10 Home. 2.5ghz, 64 bit. 6gb RAM. Focusrite Scarlet 2i2.
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And if you go the Cakewalk by BandLab (formerly Sonar Platinum), which is free and very full featured, you can view both the older Sonar Platinum tutorials, as well as Cakewalk by BandLab tutorials, as not a lot has changed. Here are a few YouTube links: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1f5zJZGlT6ghttps://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCPMyFyv8V07CnKoVWraOOGsjw06jzBI1https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB82E55314B11E41CYou can also access a fair amount of Cakewalk content at Groove3 (however, that is not free).
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2025/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Thanks, John. I didn't know that. I will take a look.
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+1 for learning RealBand and seeing if it meets your needs. If not, start shopping for something that has features you need. I grew up with Cakewalk from the DOS days. You can now use it free at www.bandlab.com , but it pretty much expects you to be connected to the Internet. https://cakewalk.bandlab.com/ Hi PhillyJazz, Thanks for the Bandlab link. Even though it has loops for various genres, it seems to be aimed at the Electronic Dance Music crowd in terms of the sonic quality of the instruments and so on. For "sonic" read "MIDI". Still, it is somewhat interesting. Very, very different from Sonar.
"If The Beatles or the 60's had a message, it was 'Learn to swim'. And once you've learned - swim!"
John Lennon
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So what's the catch there .... ?
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Okay, don't get confused here folks. Yes, BandLab is an online platform for creating (as indicated, loop based EDM music), but that's not what we're talking about here. When Cakewalk went out of business, Bandlab bought their software resources and are now marketing what was previously Cakewalk Sonar Platinum as Cakewalk by Bandlab. This is a full featured DAW that has been in use by many musicians for many, many years, capable of creating all types of music.
So, by downloading the Bandlab installer, in addition to using your account to access the online Bandlab software and loops, you also use it to install and keep updated the new Cakewalk DAW on your computer. The only difference between Sonar Platinum and the new Cakewalk by Bandlab is they don't have all the additional add-ons (because those agreements were originally made between Cakewalk and the 3rd party vendors, which wasn't included in the transfer of Cakewalks intellectual property).
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2025/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Thanks John for the detailed explanation. That certainly clarifies the position. We are talking about two separate products, essentially.
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I have not tried using it offline, but I had not used it for a while, and when I fired it up, it demanded I log into my bandcamp account and update my status. I don't know what would have happened had I been offline.
Jan - 12 Core AMD Ryzen 9 3900X
32GB DDR4
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MOTO 2
Ketron SD4,SD1000
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Yes.. I merely brought up Bandlab as the means of obtaining Cakewalk. I do not know that there is another (legal) way to install the bits locally, as Sonor is not "abandonware."
Jan - 12 Core AMD Ryzen 9 3900X
32GB DDR4
Win 10 64-bit
Samsung m.2 SSD Boot drive,other SSD internal and USB drives.
MOTO 2
Ketron SD4,SD1000
Yamaha RX-v381amp
VB-Audio virtual cables
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I deleted Bandlab installer after I got cakewalk and it still runs fine.
win 10 64 bit 16gb,i7 chip, ssd 500gb, m-audio air, ,Roland BK-7M, 1000,shure sm7b,sonar,acid,mixcraft, variety of plugins.Sample tank 3,Kontakt. TC Helicon Voicelive 3 2 . https://beatmaster1.bandcamp.com/releases
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Cakewalk by BandLab is not (or at least was not) run from the BandLab site. From BandLab one downloads the installer and runs it. Then you let the installer download and install Cakewalk by BandLab and whatever extras they now have (eg the Melodyne demo). Once installed the download tool just sits there, a download tool will be required for updates etc.
If you have a present install of Sonar, Cakewalk by BandLab will pick up all the goodies you may have loaded. It will also pick it any VSTs (assuming you have the correct paths set in preferences). As said many times Cakewalk by BandLab is basically Sonar Platinum without all the add ons. In reality it is the add ons that really cost.
My two bobs worth
Tony
HP i7-4770 16GB 1TB SSD, Win 10 Home,
Focusrite 2i2 3rd Gen, Launchkey 61, Maton CW80, Telecaster, Ovation Elite TX, Yamaha Pacifica 612
BB 2022(912) RB 2022(2), CakeWalk, Reaper 6, Audacity, Melodyne 5 Editor, Izotope Music Production Suite 4.1
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Okay, don't get confused here folks. Yes, BandLab is an online platform for creating (as indicated, loop based EDM music), but that's not what we're talking about here. When Cakewalk went out of business, Bandlab bought their software resources and are now marketing what was previously Cakewalk Sonar Platinum as Cakewalk by Bandlab. This is a full featured DAW that has been in use by many musicians for many, many years, capable of creating all types of music.
So, by downloading the Bandlab installer, in addition to using your account to access the online Bandlab software and loops, you also use it to install and keep updated the new Cakewalk DAW on your computer. The only difference between Sonar Platinum and the new Cakewalk by Bandlab is they don't have all the additional add-ons (because those agreements were originally made between Cakewalk and the 3rd party vendors, which wasn't included in the transfer of Cakewalks intellectual property).
Hi John, Thanks for this. That is what I thought was the case, but when I created the Bandlab account earlier today and played around with the interface and website, I saw no mention of Cakewalk, even though I was looking for it. There was a download link, but it in no way gave any clue that the product you could download was any different from the very different-from-Sonar product online. I will try again.
"If The Beatles or the 60's had a message, it was 'Learn to swim'. And once you've learned - swim!"
John Lennon
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Charlie,
Interesting post about hardware DAWs. How do you transfer files from BB to the machine?
2b
i5-3210 laptop. Win 10 Home. 2.5ghz, 64 bit. 6gb RAM. Focusrite Scarlet 2i2.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
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Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
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New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
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Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
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This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
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We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
Check out all the 202 New RealTracks (in sets 456-467)
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You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
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-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
- Playable RealTracks Set 4
- RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
- SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
- 128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
- 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
- FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
- Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
- Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
- Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
- RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs for Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®!
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
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Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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