I can honestly say that in my forty plus years of making my living working in music, this is the first time I have ever heard of bands and club owners having to pay ASCAP for doing covers in the clubs.
We were a cover band - classic Country/old Rock and Roll. All of the other local bands were/are cover bands as well. In all my years, nobody ever approached us about the need to pay royalties for all the songs were were doing/covering. Nor any other band. As I said, it was never heard of.
I DID get tagged for not keeping up with my musican's union dues many, many years ago.
I am the Raleigh Chapter Coordinator for the Nashville Songwriter's Association International. (NSAI.) We meet once a month (the third Wednesday) at Sam Ash. Some really talented people around here (in all genres) are a part of NSAI.
We would love to have you drop by our group sometime as a guest speaker, if you want, to share what you know about the industry. People would eat it up with a spoon.
You may even find a songwriting buddy, and I will be happy to answer any questions you have about Band in Box. I will send you a PM with my email, but I am pretty easy to find. It is hard for me to be a troll because I am all over the Internet. Too late for privacy now. My whole life is out there so I have nowhere to hide.
People VERY close to me work with the lawyers and other folks at NC State Government so looks it like we have a few things in common.
Happy Thanksgiving.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
As with about anything, there are invisible under currents clouding the issues of copyright in the USA. And, as is almost typical, the trails lead back to the congressional dome. How many remember Sonny Bono of Sonny and Cher? Remember when he became a US Representative? Some of the copyright "reforms" Sonny was able to push through were actually laughable. Here's a reasonably educated article: https://harvardmagazine.com/2012/07/a-radical-fix-for-the-republic
I can honestly say that in my forty plus years of making my living working in music, this is the first time I have ever heard of bands and club owners having to pay ASCAP for doing covers in the clubs.
We were a cover band - classic Country/old Rock and Roll. All of the other local bands were/are cover bands as well. In all my years, nobody ever approached us about the need to pay royalties for all the songs were were doing/covering. Nor any other band. As I said, it was never heard of.
I DID get tagged for not keeping up with my musican's union dues many, many years ago.
You live in Canada. ASCAP and BMI are American PRO's. Canada has it's own equivalent and it's own laws regarding intellectual property.
Many restaurants locally in NC-USA have ASCAP or BMI stickers on their doors. I've played in many bars also with the sticker on the front door. One place, a private club where we were the house band, had a visit from the PRO rep and while they never came to us to ask questions, the owner informed us they did speak to him and he wanted us to provide a set list of the songs we played over the last several months.... the further back the better. They don't speak to the bands because the bands rarely own the venue. It's the owner who has the liability and responsibility to pay the royalties and license fee. Shortly after the PRO was there and we provided the set list to the owner, a BMI sticker was proudly placed on the front door glass.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
I agree, Pat, but either way, the cost gets pushed along to the venue.
Thank goodness none of those regulations were in effect, or least not employed during the time I was coming up through the ranks.
Now, at my advanced age, I'm settling for writing and recording my tunes with no thought of using those home-brewed songs for anything but my own pleasure. But, I guess there's really nothing wrong with 'Still trying to hold on to a dream that's long gone' (lyrics from one of my latest songs).
I've made it a point to notice, and so far all the commercial places I've played have had ASCAP stickers, not on the front doors, but mostly at the manager's office.
I feel good about that.
But I can't help feeling sorry for the non-profit condominium that is paying.
But I don't agree with the 25mph speed limit on Indrio Road either, but I obey it. I'm sure the people with children on that street appreciate it.
Insights and incites by Notes
PS. JohnJohnJohn I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that subject. Everyone has a right to an opinion, and friends don't have to agree on everything.
Notes, the music cops, not a good thing for small or private menu's, and strong DWI laws, a good thing all around, have been the causes for closing many places for bands to play around here.
The fitness trainer asked me, "What kind of a squat are you accustomed to doing?" I said, "Diddly."
64 bit Win 11 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Notes, the music cops, not a good thing for small or private menu's, and strong DWI laws, a good thing all around, have been the causes for closing many places for bands to play around here.
The strong DWI laws have definitely taken their toll on our business. But driving drunk should not be tolerated. It is never OK to endanger the lives of innocent people.
That's why I moved from the lounge business to the private party business back in the early 1990s. The people in the retirement community can drive their golf carts home. The people in the condominium can take the elevator. The people at the yacht and country clubs come out for dinner with dancing afterwards and leave the club with the legal limit in their bloodstreams.
As the lounge business got worse for musicians, I see more and more competition for the private gigs. That doesn't bother me though, we are better than the majority, and our gig schedule proves it.
I know this is drifting off topic, but IMHO the biggest thing hurting our business is Television.
When my parents grew up, TV was 3 channels in black-and-white with tinny sound. In my younger days TV was a half dozen stations with grainy color, low rez picture(525 lines), and tinny sound (it was a function of the analog bandwidth devoted to the audio part of the signal). In order to see and hear live music, you had to go out where live music was being played.
Now you have a zillion channels, super HD screens that can be more than 50 inches, and up to 7.1 high fidelity digital sound. You can have The Rolling Stones, Slash, Nicki Minaj, or Ariana Grande in your living room. No need to go out. And with a Cable or Satellite monthly subscription payment that can easily climb to $300, who can afford to go out?
To get back on topic. I think the ASCAP people should leave the private party people alone. I know it's the letter of the law, but I think it oversteps the intent of the law. But that is just this layman's opinion.
I was particularly interested in seeing settlement data from the elderly people who know nothing about computers yet were taken to task for the actions of their grandchildren.
A true story, the CPA firm I work for has some Hollywood actors as clients. One is now in his late 80's and while not a big star was in tons of shows 30 odd years ago as a costar including a few iconic movies. He's been a member of the Academy for years. He was sent a confidential DVD maybe 8 years ago to watch and vote on. His grandson got hold of it, ripped it and posted it online. It had an embedded code to identify where it came from and our client lost his Academy membership over that.
Notes, I was in wedding bands for years so we personally was not really affected by the DWI laws. However a number of my friends quit playing because one, there were fewer and fewer places to play and two, some bands lowered there price to what I was making playing rock in bars back in the 60's, and that wasn't much back then!
The fitness trainer asked me, "What kind of a squat are you accustomed to doing?" I said, "Diddly."
64 bit Win 11 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
I don't want to do weddings, unless they are second or third marriages, but it's a good gig and there is decent money there.
In South Florida there is much more business in the 55 year old and up market, and ever since the 1990s that's where my focus has been. Like weddings the DWI laws are not a factor.
Playing yacht clubs has another advantage, I've been take out for the day on some pretty nice boats that I could never afford to even think about.
The strong DWI laws have definitely taken their toll on our business.
Yup.... NC was .12 and moved to .10 and there really wasn't a big change.... but when it was dropped to .08... people started to get scared. You lose your license automatically for 10 days and perhaps longer after the judge gets done with you.
The .08 started on January 1 of that year... and I was in a house band at the time. The crowds were noticeably smaller instantly. The NC HP used to set just down the road from the club and pull people over who they saw coming out of the parking lot. I was followed numerous times but wasn't concerned because I had stopped drinking on the job long before the DUI level changed because band members were considered employees of the bar...even though we were sub-contractors .... and the ABC law enforcement was a bigger threat than the NCHP. They could also bust us and the bar.... so we curtailed the drinking to prevent issues.
But I could tell some stories on this before the band learned our lessons.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.com Add nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.
What are XPro Styles and Xtra Styles PAKs?
XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!
Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!
Get the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Get Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 19 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!
Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:
Purchase your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac during our special to save up to 50% off your upgrade purchase and receive a FREE BONUS PAK of amazing new Add-ons. These include the 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK, Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana, Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes, MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano, Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7, Playable RealTracks Set 4, RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark, and more!
Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
Playable RealTracks Set 4
RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
One of our representatives will be happy to help you over the phone. Our hours of operation are from
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I will send you a PM with my email, but I am pretty easy to find. It is hard for me to be a troll because I am all over the Internet. Too late for privacy now. My whole life is out there so I have nowhere to hide.
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