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Joined: Dec 2011
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I agree with MarioD on this one. I run 5 "hard" snyths and lots of "soft" synths. All of the "hard" synths feed into a MOTU Midi Express. From my controller keyboard, I can access each "hard" synth and all of my "soft" synths through my DAW tracks with no wiring changes just by assigning each track to a synth. All audio feeds into my MOTU 828 MK3. No external mixer needed.
Jeff
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2025, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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Charley, I bow to your vastly superior experience in this arena, but honestly I expected such a response from you. One thing that I neglected to mention in my previous post is all those mixers save one came out of churches. So no smoke residue and probably fairly low dust environments. Makes me wonder what they upgraded to. Heh. Probably XR12/16/18/32.
My DAW is built around Cakewalk Sonar Platinum (now Cakewalk by Bandlab). I have a free copy of Studio One v3, which I actually like quite a bit. It has some distinct user-friendly advantages over Cakewalk. But I frequently use Cakewalk's musical notation window for composition and editing, whereas Studio One lacks any musical notation capability. Yes, one can purchase Notion v6 (or later?) and use it as a rewire device to export musical notation into SO, but why do I need to go to all the extra expense? And not only that, I don't find Notion particularly easy to use. So I'll keep muddling forward with Cakewalk, and hopefully I can fix this problem I'm having with it not wanting to play with my external MIDI devices.
I guess it's time to go get my ducats lined up and think about who and where to purchase the XR12 from.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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Joined: Apr 2013
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Good luck with your decision. My guess is the channel count of those mixers in a church setting, the need was likely for more channels/routing than less so I'll guess the upgrade to X32. The X32 provides 16 busses/monitors as well as Matrix's for streaming and broadcasting. Use of the Scenes/Snippet/Cues are also a highly desired for churches that do a lot of productions. My X32 went to the Church I attend. I still get to program it and fix all the 'issues' with what button to push on occasion.
I think choosing the XR12 is a great choice for you and that you'll immediately see a noticeable improvement in the tracks you record. Being able to eliminate a guitar hum (gate) and compression to vocals as they're recorded, apply a de esser during recording, slight EQ - all without any latency or strain on your CPU will give you cleaner tracks to work with and help tame and control your ambient room environment. You'll not have to take time in your DAW working to fix things from the start before you even begin to mix because they will no longer be there. You'll continue to get the benefit of that great Delta interface and I think you're good for another 17 years of great recording in your home studio. I'm a bit jealous....
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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Mario, the fact that you're using a MIDI hub got me to thinking. Maybe I should look into getting one too. I have a couple of Midisport 2x2s and a Roland adapter, which might work okay, but to be honest, I've had some difficulty getting any of them to work in my DAW. Dunno what the problem is, but I suspect it's a configuration issue. Originally I thought that one of my instruments was defective, but when I had the same problem with another instrument, that indicated to me the problem lies elsewhere. One of these days I'll figure out where that elsewhere is. That was my thought when you had mentioned your issue. I'm curious if using multiple midi patch bays is problematic more often then not. I would think those configuration fur balls would be long addressed/resolved by now. The 'chaining' of multiple midi patch bays is just another "fuzzy" factor for me. EDIT: when I'd commented that all midi devices may not be able to be chained for some reason? My currently chained modules have 1/4" stereo analog Ins & Outs which is how how I chain them up....I've never had luck using the 5pin din outs/thru's to chain my modules. Manifestation of user ignorance and ability to configure correctly.....absolutely. I also have a JV880 (not that I actually need it with what I currently use)that is not in the chain because it does not have 1/4" inputs. I did give the 5pin din configuration path a try using the midi ins/outs/thru's when I got the JV880 but no luck and much frustration. But....everything has been working well with my current system now so you won't find me trying to fix a working toaster. Carry on....
Last edited by chulaivet1966; 01/04/19 06:24 AM.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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chulaivet, actually I have only one Midisport 2x2 active at this time. The other is a spare, as is that Roland adapter. I bought the Roland because somebody convinced me that the Midisport was defective, but I have the same problem with it too. I'm pretty sure the Midisport is ok, because it used to work just fine. Which has led me to wonder if maybe a Windows update may have caused the problem I'm having. Cuz one day it was working fine and then the next day it wasn't.
If it is a windows compatibility issue, I don't hold out a lot of hope. M-Audio's most recent driver for the Midisports is already several years old. But I must also remind myself that I had the same problem with the Roland too. So I'm hoping it was user error of some unknown type. Just haven't figured out yet what it might be.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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If it is a windows compatibility issue, I don't hold out a lot of hope. M-Audio's most recent driver for the Midisports is already several years old. But I must also remind myself that I had the same problem with the Roland too. So I'm hoping it was user error of some unknown type. Just haven't figured out yet what it might be. That got me slightly curious. I'll hold out some hope that your issue is a configuration one that can be resolved. DELETED LINK: that was not the M-Audio site....and I don't trust those third party driver sites....sorry for my haste. My DAW is still on Win7 so I've had no PMO's (pvss me off's :)) Do update us on your quest....carry on.
Last edited by chulaivet1966; 01/04/19 07:06 AM.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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chulaivet, download the driver for your Midisports. Then delete the current driver and install the one you downloaded. https://m-audio.com/support/download/drivers/midisport-windows-driver-v6.1.3Occasionally updates messes up drivers and you have to reinstall them. In my DAW my MOTU midi express 128 shows up in the MIDI input and output listings as express1, express 2 etc. Each one is independent of the others. This should be the same in BiaB and RB. Yours may read midisport1, midisport2 etc.
I'm in a fitness protection program. I'm been hiding from exercise.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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Welp, I just ordered a Behringer XR12. Time to start making room for it in my rack and figure out the best way to wire it into my system.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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MarioD Thanks....appreciate the link. cooltouch Excellent....you do realize some pics will be in order.  Back to it....
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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Joined: Jan 2006
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XR12 or something similar (which everybody makes now) + control surface (say "Thank you, Mario.")
You just can't beat the price-features-routing-performance-footprint quotient for these mixers. If you already have a touchscreen system, you may not even need an additional control surface.
Paj
8^)
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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XR12 or something similar (which everybody makes now) <...> Hm, while this might be generally true, I did do quite a bit of research into these types of mixers and I found that the XR12 was rather unique in terms of value for its price point. The only other mixer I've found close to the XR12's price point is the Soundcraft Ui12, which actually costs more, and is one of those 12-channel mixers that really isn't. The XR12 has 12 inputs, all of which are available as 1/4" TRS, whereas the Soundcraft only has eight inputs near as I can tell, four of which are 1/4" TRS. I need those 12 TRS inputs. I plan to rack-mount this mixer. The XR12 comes with rack ears. The Soundcraft has an odd-looking form factor and I doubt it is rack-mountable. Even if it were, this would make certain features, like its USB inputs, inaccessible.
Last edited by cooltouch; 01/05/19 01:53 AM.
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Well, I just thought I'd post a follow up to all this. The XR12 arrived a couple days ago. I spent most of yesterday getting frustrated trying to set it up with my DAW, but today, with the helpful coaching from a couple of folks over at the Behringer forums, I was finally able to get it to sync with my DAW. I'm playing around with a mic -- one of my trusty Shure SM94 condensers -- on the four XLR channel inputs and it sounds pretty good, once I had the gate configured for vocals. Prior to that, it was way down in volume. Now the volume is great. Tweaked the EQ some for my voice to sound its best and I'm all set to record voiceovers! . . . or some such.
Ok, well I guess it's time to say goodbye to my trusty old Mackie 1202VLZ Pro. It's been good knowing ya old feller, but it's time to move on.
Last edited by cooltouch; 01/12/19 12:40 PM.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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The true advantage of using an audio interface over a mixer is usually clarity. Also you mentioned mixing in the mixer and not the DAW. If you mix in the mixer and the send to the DAW a stereo mix you can’t change it as much. Maybe some overall EQ, or compression but if you record each track dry to he DAW then you can mix and master with greater options. Maybe the drum track or tracks need a certain fix the is different from the bass, or piano or guitar panning has far more options in the DAW.
If you Mike drums or have more than one guitar or several vocal tracks each group can have their own fax buss. But if you do all that in the mixer you are stuck with that. What ever our decide on make sure it gives you simple but many options for mix down and mastering. As Charlie said a good mixer with multiple in/out can rock. Here’s the $64 question is this to track just you or a group of players?
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)
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Hey Rob, this is getting hooked up to my DAW and, for the foreseeable future, at least, it's just gonna be me. I use my DAW for music composition primarily. Most of the time I use MIDI instrumentation to flesh out my compositions. The only reason why I'm even hooking up the external instruments I have is because they're all MIDI and I'll need to get their audio into the mix. I don't need to have them all hooked up at once -- this is just the way I'm used to doing it. In fact, I'm finding that I'm two channels short of 1/4" hookups to get all of them hooked up.
Just today I was kicking around the idea of keeping my 12-channel Mackie and using it for some or all of those instruments, so I'd still have some room on the XR12. But then I remind myself that I don't need them all hooked up at once.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Band-in-a-Box 2026 Video: AI Stems & Notes - split polyphonic audio into instruments and transcribe
This video demonstrates how to use the new AI-Notes feature together with the AI-Stems splitter, allowing you to select an audio file and have it separated into individual stems while transcribing each one to its own MIDI track. AI-Notes converts polyphonic audio—either full mixes or individual instruments—into MIDI that you can view in notation or play back instantly.
Watch the video.
You can see all the 2026 videos on our forum!
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- MIDI Styles Set 92: Look Ma! More MIDI 15: Latin Jazz
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 46: Piano & Organ
- Instrumental Studies Set 24: Groovin' Blues Soloing
- Artist Performance Set 19: Songs with Vocals 9
- Playable RealTracks Set 5
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Join Tobin as he takes you on a tour of the new user interface in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®! This modern GUI redesign offers a sleek new look with updated toolbars, refreshed windows, and a smoother workflow. The brand-new side toolbar puts track selection, the MultiPicker Library, and other essential tools right at your fingertips. Plus, our upgraded Multi-View lets you layer multiple windows without overlap, giving you a highly flexible workspace. Many windows—including Tracks, Piano Roll, and more—have been redesigned for improved usability and a cleaner, more intuitive interface, and more!
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Introducing XPro Styles PAK 10 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!
Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.
Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 10 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Introducing Xtra Styles PAK 21 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!
Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!
Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!
Special offers until December 31st, 2025!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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