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Songwriting
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I love Band-in-a-Box and use it a lot and use it to make backing tracks. However, I feel like the Real Tracks seem to be randomly generating the chord voicings based on the chords I choose and the background parts seem random. With that in mind I have this question: When do you feel it's ok to not use Band in a Box to create a song and when do you think it's ok?
Computer: Macbook Pro, 16 inch 2021
DAWs: Pro Tools, Logic, and Maschine
plays drums, percussion, bass, steel pan, keyboard,
music producer/engineer
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Songwriting
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Hi, Here's my take on your post in case it's useful  Realtracks do not specifically generate chord voicings. They are an audio file that are created by a musician who plays chordal accompaniments and/or melodic riffs. These audio recordings are then mapped to identify which chord occurs where within the track. When a chord progression is typed into BIAB, BIAB uses PG Music's chord mapping to isolate the region of Realtrack that contains the required chord and then copies, pastes and seamlessly stitches that chord as needed. In this way, fragments of Realtracks are used to create a backing track. If you go to \bb\Realtracks and open any of the audio files there, you will hear the original audio recording. Regarding using BIAB for songwriting, I use it all the time. In fact, I could not write the songs that I do without the software. The program gives me heaps of musical possibilities and drives me in very creative directions. Some users on these forums prefer to use a guitar or piano (for example) to create with and then use BIAB to build the backing. That works them. As I see it, at the end of the day, BIAB is a tool and how any of us use it depends on how we see it as being useful for our needs. All the best, Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2026
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Songwriting
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Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,381
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Joined: Aug 2018
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If I was Sir Paul McCartney and could write, ARRANGE, play and record every instrument...I'd probably still use BIAB. Because I am not him, and I don't have his money or experience.
Noel explained what Real Tracks do. I'll give you a few suggestions that may or may not apply to your work with it on any particular piece.
1. Make sure that the KEY you have entered is actually the key for the melody those chords support. In addition, make sure every chord entered is either a) a chord without notes that don't belong in the key or b) there for a particular musical reason. Chording instruments will (more or less) play your chord, but soloing instruments taking advantage of BIAB's intelligent arranging will have an easier time creating coherent lines. Lastly, use slash chords. They may not give every instrument a new voicing, but will "force" the band as a whole to deliver a different feel. C/g will sound different than simply C, at least in many styles.
2. Use the shots, rests, holds, pushes, and a more frequent chord entry (even if you have multiple bars playing the same chord. These will nudge BIAB to select a new chord-related riff in nearly all instruments and will probably give more variety and melodic structure.
3. Use the multi-riff functions in RB to widen your choices of riffs in solo, background, and chording instruments.
4. Edit in DAW...this may include (if the interval is not too big) pitch-shifting notes here and there.
That's all I can think of at present.
Last edited by Tangmo; 04/18/19 04:46 PM.
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Songwriting
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Joined: Aug 2018
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One more.
5. Audition other tracks to add to or replace existing tracks in the style.
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Songwriting
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<<< When do you feel it's ok to not use Band in a Box to create a song and when do you think it's ok? >>
I think the correct answer to both the instances is always. It's always ok to not use BIAB and it's always ok to use BIAB to create a song. Maybe you're asking how to best choose when to use BIAB or not on a project. I thought of three circumstances to influence one's decision of the necessity of using BIAB or not.
1. You can't play the part. Either one can't play the instrument at the skill necessary or wants to use an instrument that he or she can't play at all or doesn't have access to an instrument.
2. You can play the part but a BIAB track played by a BIAB artist plays it better. This can be something other than skill. You may be a great bass player but you recently pawned your equipment or you cannot get a track recorded because of problems with getting your recording clear, without noise or eliminating room noise and so on.
3. You can play the part expertly but it's inconvenient or you just don't want to play the part. Time is the main constraint here as well as space. You may be working on a project that needs drums but it's two am and the project is due first thing in the morning. It may be more beneficial to use a BIAB drums render to add a drum track. It takes time to set up an instrument, mic's, tuning etc. and you don't feel like spending a lot of time on set up and tear down.
BIAB 2025:RB 2025, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
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Songwriting
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Joined: Dec 2003
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One of the reasons that I use mostly MIDI is that I can move BiaB generated chord voicings to chord voicings of my choosing. You might want to consider investing in a good MIDI sound source, either hard or software, and looking at the MIDI side of BiaB.
With the exception of some ambient, new age and cover songs most all of my songs start in BiaB. As been stated BiaB is a tool that you choose when to use. There is no law that states every song must use BiaB. The possible exception to that rule is the Showcase forum.
I think my wife has started to show the first signs of dementia.
She said she can't remember what she ever saw in me!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Songwriting
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Joined: Dec 2013
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I don't write songs with BIAB. I produce songs with BIAB by using RT's to create an arrangement. There are instances where the availability of a RT (a studio musician as it were) gives me options in the arrangement I otherwise wouldn't have, such as inserting an instrumental break or solo part. One of the reasons that I use mostly MIDI is that I can move BiaB generated chord voicings to chord voicings of my choosing. You might want to consider investing in a good MIDI sound source, either hard or software, and looking at the MIDI side of BiaB. Hey, Mario. I wish I knew more about MIDI. I've tried a few times, unsuccessfully, to get into it and so I stick with RT's. As I see it, at the end of the day, BIAB is a tool and how any of us use it depends on how we see it as being useful for our needs.
All the best,
Noel Exactly. <<< When do you feel it's ok to not use Band in a Box to create a song and when do you think it's ok? >>
I think the correct answer to both the instances is always. It's always ok to not use BIAB and it's always ok to use BIAB to create a song. Maybe you're asking how to best choose when to use BIAB or not on a project. I thought of three circumstances to influence one's decision of the necessity of using BIAB or not.
1. You can't play the part.
2. You can play the part but a BIAB track played by a BIAB artist plays it better.
3. You can play the part expertly but it's inconvenient or you just don't want to play the part. Bingo!
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Songwriting
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 24,357
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I don't write songs with BIAB. I produce songs with BIAB by using RT's to create an arrangement. There are instances where the availability of a RT (a studio musician as it were) gives me options in the arrangement I otherwise wouldn't have, such as inserting an instrumental break or solo part. One of the reasons that I use mostly MIDI is that I can move BiaB generated chord voicings to chord voicings of my choosing. You might want to consider investing in a good MIDI sound source, either hard or software, and looking at the MIDI side of BiaB. Hey, Mario. I wish I knew more about MIDI. I've tried a few times, unsuccessfully, to get into it and so I stick with RT's. ................... Anytime you need help feel free to ask. I'd be glad to help.
I think my wife has started to show the first signs of dementia.
She said she can't remember what she ever saw in me!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Songwriting
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Joined: Aug 2014
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I use Band-in-a-Box to write ALL THE TIME.
Here is how:
All of my life, I have written many of my best songs by being in a band, and going into long JAMs. After jamming for a while, you will find something you like and run with it, like an inspiring riff, or a new chord progression, a novelty--something FRESH. The muse of music is fickle, and she craves the unexpected. Much more than any other art form, I think.
So, if you DO NOT have a band to jam with you can jam with BIAB demos, see a clever chord progression, find a cool sound or beat, and run with it. Then, depending on your skill level you can add your own stuff. I almost always add some live guitar, and keyboards or whatever to the Real Tracks because I am a musician. I use Band-in-Box as a band, exactly how it sounds.
This approach works wonders for me. If I just sat there with a guitar on my lap strumming some chords, I would come up with a good song once in a while but then get repetitive.
Music, to me, is all about jamming and looking for inspiration inside a jam.
For me the jamming aspect, which BIAB provides, is 100 percent of it--if not 110% of it.
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Songwriting
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Joined: Dec 2013
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I use Band-in-a-Box to write ALL THE TIME.
Here is how:
All of my life, I have written many of my best songs by being in a band, and going into long JAMs. After jamming for a while, you will find something you like and run with it, like an inspiring riff, or a new chord progression, a novelty--something FRESH. The muse of music is fickle, and she craves the unexpected. Much more than any other art form, I think.
So, if you DO NOT have a band to jam with you can jam with BIAB demos, see a clever chord progression, find a cool sound or beat, and run with it. Then, depending on your skill level you can add your own stuff. I almost always add some live guitar, and keyboards or whatever to the Real Tracks because I am a musician. I use Band-in-Box as a band, exactly how it sounds.
This approach works wonders for me. If I just sat there with a guitar on my lap strumming some chords, I would come up with a good song once in a while but then get repetitive.
Music, to me, is all about jamming and looking for inspiration inside a jam.
For me the jamming aspect, which BIAB provides, is 100 percent of it--if not 110% of it. David said pretty much what I was going to say. Except, I was always a lousy musician and played only in a few bad garage bands as a teen. So, for me, BIAB is like having, for the first time in my life, a great band to inspire creativity. I sometimes have an idea which pops into my head and find or create a band from BIAB to bring it to life. Other times, I go fishing and just play demos for the Real styles. I hear a musical phrase or band sound that just hits me and I'm off. I write most of my songs this way over the past several years. I am SOOOOOOO thankful for this product.
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Songwriting
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One of the reasons that I use mostly MIDI is that I can move BiaB generated chord voicings to chord voicings of my choosing. You might want to consider investing in a good MIDI sound source, either hard or software, and looking at the MIDI side of BiaB. Therein lies the answer. Like you, I like using MIDI, not only for the reasons you mentioned, but it allows me to edit individual notes, write songs right on the staff and a whole host of other options. Then I'm playing back through a Korg (rack mount) Triton brain and Korg NX5R (My favs)... Sweet sounds!!! Kajun Jeaux
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Hey Kajun, I also have the Korg NX5. Got it new about 21 years ago. Really love the synth sounds.
 Steve BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 4 TB M2 SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
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