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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
Journeyman
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OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399 |
Currently the algorithm for stitching together bits of bass phrases to a progression can be jumpy melody-wise and very obviously "BIAB" when compared to - for example how a real pro double bassist like Ron Carter would approach a line.
And Ron Carter IS one of the artists with real tracks here!
The problem is that sometimes there are big jumps interval-wise where there is a chord transition. A real bassist will usually have grace notes and lead-in notes that are close to the upcoming strong chord-tone.
But the current algorithm doesn't take note of this. It might be that when the ability in BIAB to have per-note pitch transformation possible this might be achieved. ( I actually did this myself with a version of the zPlane software on my own project may years ago to solve similar issues ).
But until that - it just requires a more judicious choice of "snippets" motifs and lines that sound more musical and realistic in a walking bass context.
Because - for example - currently on YouTube - where many have uploaded jazz backing tracks for people to use - it is very very obvious when the jazz backing track came from BIAB.
Even with Ron Carter on the real tracks.. it gives the game away that it ISNT Ron Carter... because the lines just aren't ones one hears Ron doing. on any of his real material using standards.
As it happens I don't find this an issue so much with non-walking bass parts for non-jazz styles and that is because those styles of music tend to often have the bassist doing motifs in a manner more suitable to the BIAB algorithm.
But jazz walking bass is where the inauthenticity becomes obvious. At least it does to those who play jazz or have listened to it as a fan for many decades.
Last edited by nonchai; 10/16/19 01:54 AM.
Big Sur, Mac Mini i7 2018, 64GB RAM 2TB SSD
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Lockdown beard, podgy face, beer belly, bald patch ... yadda yadda
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 559
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 559 |
How about a walking bass part that hits the correct note on the downbeat of a measure, rather than another note in the chord?
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
Journeyman
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OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399 |
agreed. that would be a good start.
Big Sur, Mac Mini i7 2018, 64GB RAM 2TB SSD
Yamaha PSR SX 900, Cubase, Ableton, UNIFY, OPUS ORCHESTRATOR, MASCHINE, Vienna Ensemble Pro ,Audiofuse, L6 HELI, KOMPLETE, Komplete Kontrol 88
Lockdown beard, podgy face, beer belly, bald patch ... yadda yadda
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,478
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,478 |
This might be a good suggestion for the Styles and RealTracks wishlist.
Last edited by VideoTrack; 10/23/19 05:19 PM. Reason: typo
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
Journeyman
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OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399 |
Big Sur, Mac Mini i7 2018, 64GB RAM 2TB SSD
Yamaha PSR SX 900, Cubase, Ableton, UNIFY, OPUS ORCHESTRATOR, MASCHINE, Vienna Ensemble Pro ,Audiofuse, L6 HELI, KOMPLETE, Komplete Kontrol 88
Lockdown beard, podgy face, beer belly, bald patch ... yadda yadda
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,607
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,607 |
The jazz bassists don't always play the root or the fifth on the downbeat. Listen to John Pattitucci, Ron Carter, Stanley Clarke and Christian McBride, you'll hear a root once in a while.
Asus Q500A i7 Win 10 64 bit 8GB ram 750 HD 15.5" touch screen, BIAB 2017, Casio PX 5s, Xw P1, Center Point Stereo SS V3 and EWI 4000s.
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
Journeyman
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OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399 |
The jazz bassists don't always play the root or the fifth on the downbeat. Listen to John Pattitucci, Ron Carter, Stanley Clarke and Christian McBride, you'll hear a root once in a while. For sure - and you missed the most obvious "breaker of the rules" imo - Gary Peacock. But regardless - none of the above sound so obviously like a BIAB "stitched patchwork-quilt" attempt at a walking bass line. See it isnt so much about whether a chord-tone is being applied on a strong-beat as just the kind of unnatural jump - caused - not by any musical artistic decision - but but the mere bolting on of one phrase segment to another - by means of an algorithm that clearly hasnt listened to too many bassists - whether vanilla or the bass-gods you mentioned.
Last edited by nonchai; 10/28/19 09:07 AM.
Big Sur, Mac Mini i7 2018, 64GB RAM 2TB SSD
Yamaha PSR SX 900, Cubase, Ableton, UNIFY, OPUS ORCHESTRATOR, MASCHINE, Vienna Ensemble Pro ,Audiofuse, L6 HELI, KOMPLETE, Komplete Kontrol 88
Lockdown beard, podgy face, beer belly, bald patch ... yadda yadda
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Band-in-a-Box Wishlist
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
Journeyman
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OP
Journeyman
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 399 |
Big Sur, Mac Mini i7 2018, 64GB RAM 2TB SSD
Yamaha PSR SX 900, Cubase, Ableton, UNIFY, OPUS ORCHESTRATOR, MASCHINE, Vienna Ensemble Pro ,Audiofuse, L6 HELI, KOMPLETE, Komplete Kontrol 88
Lockdown beard, podgy face, beer belly, bald patch ... yadda yadda
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