I often get rubbish when I change a style or load a different song or rebuild a song. This will not correct until I restart the application. The it will be ok again until the next time.
I have attached an example of the output after this happens.
I don't think I have seen this on the 32 bit version. It has either started or become a lot worse since upgrading to 2020.
Is this a known issue? What can I do to fix it?
EDIT: I just discovered that the m4a output as attached here is actually fine. It is just the computer Audio out that becomes rubbish. I have tried to record it in the .wma file. the recording is faint but the sound really is that bad with something trrrrr in it.
The second .wma file "BLue Skies rubbish out spagetti1.wma" is a different style _BARSPGW for the same song.
This problem is not song specific as far as I can tell.
Last edited by berntd; 05/08/2008:12 PM.
Band in a Box Latest: ULTRA 2020 (734) on Win 10 And: MEGA 2020 (720) on Windows 7
Tell us more about your computer hardware, CPU, memory etc.
Also, download Geekbench and tell us the score you receive.
Start Windows Task Manager and check what the CPU load is, especially when playing the song. This may be related to your Audio setup.
Also, are you using MME, WAS or ASIO drivers?
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
Tell us more about your computer hardware, CPU, memory etc.
Also, download Geekbench and tell us the score you receive.
Start Windows Task Manager and check what the CPU load is, especially when playing the song. This may be related to your Audio setup.
Also, are you using MME, WAS or ASIO drivers?
OK but keep in mind that this problem occurs randomly after a number of song loads , style changes, rebuilds. The problem is now gone as I restarted so the CPU use is not representing the time of problem for this song. For the performance, the exact song is playing. CPU use varies between 55 and ~88%
I use WAS drivers.
Computer info , results and Performance are all attached.
regards Bernt
Last edited by berntd; 05/07/2009:41 PM.
Band in a Box Latest: ULTRA 2020 (734) on Win 10 And: MEGA 2020 (720) on Windows 7
coming to think of it, this may have started after I set the driver to ASIO and then back a gain when experimenting with MIDI / Audio latency. I am not sure though. It could also have started after I upgraded recently to 2020. It all happened at the same time. Sort of.
Here is the current audio setup.
Band in a Box Latest: ULTRA 2020 (734) on Win 10 And: MEGA 2020 (720) on Windows 7
One way I can reproduce fairly quickly when I play the song and open the style picker and choose a different style and play a few times and eventually exit the picker.
EDIT: It also happens in the middle of the song, suddenly after the song has auto repeated about 4 or 5 times.
Last edited by berntd; 05/07/2010:09 PM.
Band in a Box Latest: ULTRA 2020 (734) on Win 10 And: MEGA 2020 (720) on Windows 7
Here is the most likely cause of your problem (see first image): CPU maxed-out, and no free memory. The page file will be thrashing also.
In Task Manager, click on Processes tab (or details tab) and then click on the CPU column to sort by CPU, and see what tasks are using the processor (see second image). Do let us know the findings.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
Right now, I reckon this is not related to my computer.
Here is what you asked for. 1 is with it working and the other is after it has decided to not work any longer. It takes me about 5 minutes to get it to the stage where it stops working. Quite spectacular.
Someone else should try and reproduce it. The _BG_BAND is a good start.
Band in a Box Latest: ULTRA 2020 (734) on Win 10 And: MEGA 2020 (720) on Windows 7
I just threw together a short song using that Style and played it, and the CPU maxed at 6 to 7% while playing.
Can you tell us more about your sound setup? Is it external / internal?
Have you tried changing WAS to MME to see if that makes any difference?
This is not a known problem as far as I am aware, but I may be incorrect.
Additionally, there is an update to Build 720 available, so you may consider upgrading, but I doubt that this is related.
I wonder if someone else can try to see what results they get?
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
One other thought: Does it do this if you launch the 32 bit version?
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
Berntd, there might be a way to creep up on the issue. Apologies in advance for the detailed reply.
You need to monitor the CPU loading in Task Manager.
- Start everything from scratch, and don't start BiaB. - Check the CPU loading from Task Manager. The graph chart is a suitable way to monitor. If it is low, proceed. If it is high, then it's something other than BiaB. - Check the Free Physical memory. It should not be exhausted as in your earlier screen capture. - Start BiaB and check to see if the CPU has crept up unacceptably. Memory usage might change but with no song loaded or playing, the CPU should remain at the previous level - Load your Blue Skies song, check CPU again. - Play the song and watch the CPU. Does it progressively increase as the song plays? - Replay the song again, and again, does CPU load or memory gradually increase?
I think the underlying problem is a resource issue with the computer. What is using the resources needs to be determined.
In very simple terms, Computers use a 'swap file' which is an area set aside on disk to store additional memory. When more Physical memory (RAM) needs to be made available for another program to use and there is none available, other programs have some of their memory temporarily written to the disk Swap File, freeing up that memory for that other program. When that program no longer needs the memory, the memory is freed (or written to another part of the swap file) and the original memory stored in the swap file is read back to RAM to the original program. It does this by reading it back from disk. This can happen in a very short time-frame (1000ths of a second). However, if this happens too frequently, the computer spends too much time writing and reading the swap file, a term known as 'thrashing'. At that point it's a downward spiral. The computer cannot cope.
Not being critical, but constructively, your system has very little physical memory. I think that whatever else runs on the computer is consuming a lot of memory (remember, the operating system needs a fair chunk also).
I think that more RAM would help, but it's beneficial to try to track down the real cause of the problem.
How old is the computer? Is it a desktop or laptop? What other programs do you have running at the same time as BiaB? Have you installed other programs recently?
Hope this helps in some way.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
i've got a dv6 and the memory it came with was not enough for day to day use so i upgraded the memory which is quite cheap. if i remember rightly there are only two memory slots so you will need 2 x 4 mg memory modules to take it up to 8 gb although i only added one 4meg so i've got 6 meg which is a bit odd but works much better.
i don't use it for music but the installed memory was a bit light for everyday use so i think videotrack is right about your RAM being a bit tight.
At the end of the video you mentioned 'you did not see it as a resource problem'. Sorry, respectfully I cannot agree. The CPU is maxed out. There's not enough memory. That to me relates to a resource problem for the reasons that I tried to explain earlier.
Do you have another computer that you can install BiaB on?
Does the same occur with the 32 bit version?
What is the CPU load when the song is not playing?
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
Specs from the online manual... Minimum System Requirements Minimum 1 GB RAM (2 GB+ recommended) Minimum 1.0 GHz processor (2 GHz+ multicore recommended)
It's time to upgrade or replace the laptop. Your memory is just a little above spec (although 8 Gig would be better IMHO) and your processor is getting behind too. More stuff is being added to the BIAB software each year which will make an old laptop work harder. If you're unable to afford upgrades at this time just use 32-bit. Yes, you may be able to do a tweak here and there to be able to improve performance but as more time goes by the upgrade/replace will be unavoidable. Good Luck!
Re: @Noel, I think you mean me, Trevor/VideoTrack. Noel is Noel96.
As I've tried to explain before, believe me, you will witness a performance degradation with CPU loads and limited available free memory like your system shows. You can labor the point, but the fact remains, in real-world terms, for real-time processing operations, it's maxed out. There is simply not enough spare headroom available.
Also, I would personally never use an AMD processor. But that is my personal choice.
Yes, BiaB is the program that appears to give you the issue, but most likely because the computer can't cut it.
Quote:
... but of course the good VSTs are 64bit.
What VST's do you have loaded? You didn't mention VST's before. VST's use computer memory resources, even when not playing.
What happens if you don't load any VST's at all? Does that make a difference? BlueSkies is all Realtracks.
If your not satisfied with the operation, I suggest you now contact the developers, PG Music, mentioning this thread. We are only end-users, trying to help and assist and explain.
As Steve mentioned: 'Good Luck'.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
Further tests I have loaded and played and changed styles on over a dozen songs and it remains fine and plays perfectly. Until I load Blue Skies.
The problem changes with different audio driver setups as follows:
WAS: It will become problematic and this seems repeatable but control is maintained in that I can stop the song, load another one and it will work fine again.
MME: It will become problematic and control is totally lost and the BIAB process has to be killed with task manager.
ASIO 4 All: It plays in small chunks. Sound, no sound, sound, no sound. Control is maintained, other songs can be loaded and it will work fine.
Band in a Box Latest: ULTRA 2020 (734) on Win 10 And: MEGA 2020 (720) on Windows 7
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