PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production QUESTIONS BOUT ORCHESTRA LIBS.

Very interesting site Dan. Thanks for posting the link.

Jeff

Dan.
thanks for the VI info. my problem is finding the time of course for everything like a lot of people. as well as writing new songs.
(whether they are any good. who knows. but its my passion as well as my life with my lovely wife; who, god knows why, puts up with my music madness and my crazy guitars blasting out lol. )

frankly i feel really stupid in not realising the depth of the sample library market dan.
i feel ive been transported to some new dimension or twilight zone or galaxy with too many planets to count lol.
and the problem is sorting the wheat from the chaff of course.
cos what i'm trying to do (without chewing up a ton of disk space and $$$) is to augment the RT's with added carefully chosen instruments/libs not in the RT's or under represented.
for example i havent found a harpsichord RT in biab as but one example. or a spinnet.

i find frankly in songwriting that too many choices can also muck up a song. i like the george martin approach..
make your decisions and live with them good or bad like they had to decades ago when they had few traks.

today i found another interesting femme lib called "allura".
(not free). pretty impressive.
to be fair i can see why some people need repaying for putting together sample libs. it must be a ton of in studio work and time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OpUxlIBfQk
there are other you tube links for different allura vids.
just google.

best
oldmuso

ALL.
ok ive searched and search on you tube etc for further
female vocal libs. i dont mean synthesised vocs.
looks to me like a group of talented pro female back up singers could make decent money pumping out low cost vsti vocal libs from mezzo sopranoe down through the various femme vocal ranges. from solo libs through to duos/trios/
various back up singer numbers.
i mean non synthesised classical or rock or blues or various other music genre femme vocals. not finding a lot of femme voc libs unfortunately that cover various female vocal ranges. OR have i missed any low cost/free libs ?
gonna look at wind instruments next and gradually work through each orchestral section looking for further libs.
any further help/links to low cost/free femme voc libs much appreciated.
best
oldmuso

IF you have the full version of Kontakt these Angelic vocal pads are really good:

https://store.precisionsound.net/product-category/vocal-choirs/

I own a number of Angelic vocal presets with many not supported any more.

I have no experience with the following but maybe something here will work for you:

https://blog.native-instruments.com/5-free-vocal-libraries-for-kontakt/

https://www.angelicvibes.com/free-ambient-vocals/

+++ Realivox Ladies +++ $299 US.

+++ Realivox Blue +++ $149 US. One of the four voices in Realivox Ladies.

I will add that both of these will work with the free Kontakt Player.

Mario/jim.
thanks for being such champs with your info/input/links.
but ive concluded my venturing into the land of large orchestral/vocal/instrumental libs was stupidly naive from my research to date.

haveing made songs in the past in a few big recording studios before setting up my own modest rig i think i conclude that only the big recording studios/film makers have the budgets to afford the most sophisticated sample libs. ie its a big boys game.
it seems to get a really good lib together can cost several k at a minimum from my deep dive into the topic.

however if you can recommend a lib combo for a few hundred buks that covers where i'm weak in the bb RT's. that would be grrreat !

heres where i'm weak in RT's.
(i have ultrapak 2020 and will probably upgrade next year if some of my wishes are implemented. )
i mainly do rok songs (not metal ) and occasional ballads.
(no country or jazz. blues rarely.)
but my "thing" is useing orch sounds in rok songs and ballads. i want to do more of this.

i'm weak in;
.cellos
.slide guitar for rock.
.horns eg trumpets.
.flutes/whistles
.clarinets
.other wind instruments eg oboes/bassoons
.latin perc
.violin groups
.good rok saxes. i can use some rt but after lots of edit work/regens.
.ditto above for harmonicas.
.femme opera and rok back up vocs.(already mentioned in earlier posts)
.stand up bass
.rok choirs
.other orchestral/symphonic instruments usefull in rok songs.
all above royalty free of course/plug ins/vsti's

(i hate dongles. used them in the past. end up with a nest of them. so i only buy dongle free products. thank god pg have not gone to dongles. )

one problem of course is though i like a particular RT i cant use it sometimes in a fast rok song often cos its tempo range might not match. or i get a stretch artifact.
ive got guitar rt's out the ying yangs. the rhythm ones i often find usefull. but the solo ones i really have to manipulate with lots of regens and/or daw edits and/or plug in tricks and/or adding my own guitar. i'm an ok guitarist , but not great.
dont get me wrong ; i'm not knocking bb but i need more than sometimes bb can give me.

anyway if anyone has added ideas within my puny few hundred buks budget; i'm all ears.
its the same prob i have with sports channels packages on tv !. (i'm a soccer nut.) they get too costly so i dont buy them.

in ending my other worry is i'll buy a fancy library/plug in , and it either gets obsolete or i find i dont find
some patches usefull. or there are too many patches to go
through as i like to work fast when ive got a song idea.

best and thanks again.
oldmuso

These are my choices based on what I have:


.cellos - Amadeus - $149 - free Kontakt player - https://sonicscores.com/amadeus/

.slide guitar for rock. no idea other than for the full version of Kontakt

.horns eg trumpets. Amadeus

flutes/whistles Maybe Kontakt player - don't know for sure
Mine are all for the full version of Kontakt

.clarinets Amadeus

other wind instruments eg oboes/bassoons Amadeus

.latin perc no idea except for the full version of Kontakt

.violin groups Amadeus

.good rok saxes. i can use some rt but after lots of edit work/regens. VG instruments - $76 or less
https://vgtrumpet.com/
Not as good as Swam's $250 but a lot cheaper
https://audiomodeling.com/swam-engine/solo-woodwinds/swam-saxophones/

.ditto above for harmonicas. No idea - I'm looking for a good one myself

.femme opera and rok back up vocs.(already mentioned in earlier posts) Amadeus

.stand up bass Amplesound - $149 -https://www.amplesound.net/en/pro-pd.asp?id=21
Maybe Kontakt player - don't know for sure

.rok choirs no idea

.other orchestral/symphonic instruments usefull in rok songs. Amadeus
Maybe Kontakt player - don't know for sure

I recently became interested in orchestral libraries, and like you, I wanted to add different nuances and instruments to my compositions. To begin with, I would advise you to spitfire orchestra the basic one. I filled out the survey and within 15 days they sent me the download link for two computers. It is stand alone and works with biab 2020 which is the one I have. For me it is very intuitive and it does not sound bad as it comes, it has few articulations but since it is not the main instrument in my recordings it does not worry me much and it is very good as mentioned above.
It consumes few resources and filling out the survey is free, so you waste time alone.

Another vst that you could try is the korg triton that comes with all its orchestral, dance, world, etc. expansions. The particularity and utility that I usually give it is the split function, which allows dividing the keyboard into instruments, you can have several instruments active in a session.
register at korg and get the triton demo fully functional. You can use it completely for 20 minutes each time you start it, it is also stand alone and for now, although Biab recognizes it, I have not been able to make it sound.
They are two things that you could try and value, it would only take you time.
I use a translator, in case it is not well understood
All the best

I might be showing a lot of ignorance here, maybe this is too country, but could a pedal steel work for you? https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=654617#Post654617

You can use it 15 minutes at a time if you don't have full Kontakt, just the player. The demo sounded terrific and totally versatile.

thanks for the replies.
looks like amadeus is for me as a base lib.
plus the spitfire.
cathie ; that sounds very good. but still a tad "country"
for my tastes. gonna look into it further. thanks.

best and rock out people.
oldmuso

I was ridiculously excited to have remembered it. RealStrat5 is definitely a rock guitar, but dunno if it has any kind of slide capabilities. I don't even know how to figure that out. And that's all I know about guitar VSTs.

Cathie/all.
re guitar vst's.
sometime for fun have a listen to , on you tube
"crazy bout my mercury". the version by david lyndley.
IT ROCKS !
great for parties and lots of fun times.
i could hear it a thousand times and never tire of it.
its also a lesson in clever songwriting imho as well.
listen to the version on you tube with the blue background
with el rayo x. the original record version.
rather than the live versions.

i have never heard any plug in be able to get lyndleys
sound on that record.
if anyone knows the gear he used i'm all ears. lol.

best
i'm listening to it right now and dancing round the room lol
oldmuso
ps even sounds grrreat on my amazon fire cheapie tablet.

I have 6TB of libraries, 2/3 orchestral. I'll spare you the list. A few thoughts. I own licenses for each of these:

I have Amadeus but it is a little buggy for me; the long promised fixes are way, way overdue but the $149 price is great.

Best bang for the buck, IMO, is Miroslav Philharmonik—when on sale. Has its own player or uses SampleTank 4, a very powerful player—and free (paid versions of ST include more libraries but all use the same, free player). It often goes on sale bundled with SampleTank packages such as Total Studio Max at low prices if you're patient (recently $299). Download SampleTank 4 CS (free) and you will be on their email list. Unfortunately, their last big sale ended April 30 but they appear frequently. Not a bargain at the current $499 price.
Philharmonik 2

UVI Orchestral Suite is very good @ $199 — was on sale for $139 a few months ago. Like SampleTank, the UVI Player is free.
UVI Orchestral Suite

Garritan Personal Orchestra 5 uses the included ARIA Player. Although $149.95 on the MakeMusic web site, many resellers have it for less.
GPO 5

I’ve been looking at this thread and I find it fascinating. I’ve said a few things here as well. Today I started with a different fiddle synth. I could not get what I wanted out of the fiddles or violins I had. So another synth. Went through the manual and some things made sense. They also made sense for the other fiddle synths. Then applying some of the newly learnt ways to handle the technology I realised I probably had what I needed but did not know how to drive it.

A few weeks ago I wrote here about a Steel Guitar and just how good it was but it had some limitations so I tried another “Tod’s Pedal Steel” which really overcame most of the issues with the other Steel Guitars I had. Tod’s Pedal Steel comes with a few really great examples of how to use the product. After going through the Tod’s training (for want of better wording) I am now able to get a lot more out of the other pedal steels. (But Tod’s will be my go to as it is less complex).

I guess what I’m getting at is what I’ve said before. To get the most out of any synth one really needs to know it’s ins and outs.

I don’t know if Tod is on these forum's (I see his name on a lot of Reaper stuff) but I cannot thank him enough. Dealing with and letting the guy behind the sim steer your path is huge. Tod seemed to have no issue with this.

Anyway enough from me.

Tony

Here's a new vocal library from a major player that looks promising:

EastWest Hollywood Backup Singers

Intro price of $149.50 looks really good. If you go for it, let us know how it works out.

Mike.
thanks kindly for those ideas/links.
checking them out.


Teunis.
will check tods out.

all.
one problem i have as illustrated the other day is my wife and i were listening to the tv ; and we both said
"wasnt that intrument sound on something else recently " ?
thus i'm wondering how much one can customise orch libs
and make them unique. so when i put out a song other
people dont say the same of my song efforts.
this is my biggest concern ie how to make a lib unique to me. (as well i want libs that arent hogging cpu processes/power).
best
oldmuso

Off the top of my head:
EQ
Compression/limiter
Blending orchestra presets (for instance free orchestra strings with better ones)
Two or more of the same track with detuning
Effects (chorus, slap delay, distortion, etc)
Blending orchestra presets with synth presets

Maybe it is time to quit worrying and trying some experimentation. Try using some free orchestra VSTs prior to spending any money. Note that I have no experience with the following orchestra libraries:

https://www.orchestraltools.com/store/collections/45#:~:text=Layers%20is%20a%20free%20orchestral%20VST%20instrument%2C%20and,tonal%20colors%20and%20dynamics%20with%20your%20MIDI%20controller.

https://hiphopmakers.com/free-orchestral-vst-plugins-best-orchestral-vst

https://blog.landr.com/best-free-orchestral-vsts/

Google/Bing free orchestra VST to find others. Mix and match, add effects, etc, and see if you really want to pursue this any further.

I say this with respect but if you keep asking for opinions you may get lost with all of them as everyone has opinions. Now may be the time to dive in and get your feet wet.

I hope this helps and good luck - have fun.

Mario.
re "just dive in"
funny you should say that.
good advice and thats exactly what i'm gonna do.
normally i'm just that sort of person.
but for some odd silly reason this orch lib subject has sorta fazed me.
maybe its age creeping up on me.

btw your latest tag line i showed to my wife who then hugged me.
so it was worth it. lol.
actually it made our day. we are telling all our friends that one.
frankly we couldnt stop laughing.
i ask my wife every year if she wants to "still" put up with her big mistake for another year , and amazeingly she
always says yes; even though i'm untraineable. lol.

thanks.
oldmuso.

oldmuso we have a lot in common. After 3 years of dating and as of next month 54 years of marriage my delusional wife still thinks that I can be domesticated!