This is / was one of the high demanded features. There are several looong threads in this forum section on the subject, including a recent one. I will not go in details of those threads. This is simply a concept of how it can be done visually from user standpoint. This is what I came up with.
To have a multi-function "freeze" (snowflake) button. Press once, turns "blue" - regular freeze. Click on it second time- turns orange, which means it will be ready for partial bar freeze/unfreeze. Click again - clears it.
So the way I see it can work is this. You click snowflake till it turns orange, only on the channels that you want to do this "partial" freeze. Select the bars that you want to freeze->right click on selected->freeze section (or unfreeze section). Frozen section(s) will have slim bar on the top, indicating they are "frozen".
JJJ, Yes, I read what Matt wrote. However, assume you do this exactly how Matt described, what will make these "desired" regeneration(s) HOLD in place if you make a change above or below them? To my understanding, software is designed in such way that it will regenerate whole arrangement, even with minor change. So that section has to be glued / frozen in specific places not to disappear with next alternation to chord grid.
If Matt's idea suggest this by "default freezing" those finished sections, it would still need a visual indication that they are "done with". Same as you do with bar changes - you have indication on chord sheet that they were altered.
Or...If you decide to exclude several channels from bar-to bar generation, how would you do that?
My idea is essentially the same what Matt proposed with 2 differences: 1)Be able to Pre-trigger specific mixer instrument channels or exclude ones which you want or do not want to follow: Select-Regenerate. 2)Have visual on what and were was altered.
That is a good distinction, and it would be important to work this out.
I do realize my little three-step process is really four steps, since you have to specify the track(s).
But you are correct to ask, what happens next, if the user regenerates the song again.
Perhaps the workflow is to regenerate everything until you get a workable set of tracks, then freeze them. Only then are you allowed to use the new technique we are proposing to make tweaks. These would also be frozen after being done. In this way, no visual indicators are needed (the orange versus blue snowflakes) although that approach could work as well.
If you unfreeze, all is fair game for being changed again by a new regeneration. Would that work?
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Matt: "my little three-step process is really four steps, since you have to specify the track(s)." In my concept the orange snowflake is exactly how you do that.
"But you are correct to ask, what happens next, if the user regenerates the song again." Orange + Blue "snowflaked" tracks will stay the way they are, everything else - regenerated.
For example you want to re-generate a section that already was held in place by "generate selected" with orange snowflake... It could just prompt: "Section has frozen bars do you want to re-generate?" Yes/No.
Blue snowflake freeze - will ignore any changes.
The principle and operation is the same: Select Bars->Generate or whatever the "wording" might be.
Again, this is idea for visually seeing what is getting Bar-to-bar regenerated (and held) and what is not, and I think have a multi-purpose "freeze" button which will double as a selector and indicator of which tracks are being grouped for bar-by-bar and slim line at the bar could solve this in minimalistic, yet very usable way.
Like many such ideas we propose, my guess is that PG Music will figure out a good way to implement them. I think the need has been clearly expressed, and from this and many other threads since 2009, there is much interest.
In my case, as a composer, I want to stay within BIAB for as long as possible before getting into production with a DAW. That's why RealBand is not the answer for me. Audio editing of Utility Tracks is likewise possible but also, for my reason, not the answer for me.
Rusty, I appreciate your interest and effort in this topic.
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I am just trying to come up with idea that would require the least amount of modifications to user interface... and make most sense from user end. The logic behind is absolutely same what you described. To stay as long as possible in BIAB without doing crazy stuff with workarounds.
I am just trying to come up with idea that would require the least amount of modifications to user interface... and make most sense from user end. The logic behind is absolutely same what you described. To stay as long as possible in BIAB without doing crazy stuff with workarounds.
I like your orange snowflake proposal. It is logical, and easy to understand and work with.
It hasn't been implemented yet, and yet it feels kind of "right" to me.
What Matt described is bang on too... but your idea of how to represent this visually and allowing for this visual representation to be saved with the session (so you can come back to it later) might help PG Music developers implement this more easily.
This is / was one of the high demanded features. There are several looong threads in this forum section on the subject, including a recent one. I will not go in details of those threads. This is simply a concept of how it can be done visually from user standpoint. This is what I came up with.
To have a multi-function "freeze" (snowflake) button. Press once, turns "blue" - regular freeze. Click on it second time- turns orange, which means it will be ready for partial bar freeze/unfreeze. Click again - clears it.
So the way I see it can work is this. You click snowflake till it turns orange, only on the channels that you want to do this "partial" freeze. Select the bars that you want to freeze->right click on selected->freeze section (or unfreeze section). Frozen section(s) will have slim bar on the top, indicating they are "frozen".
I love that idea - it's close to perfect
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Probably the reason it has not been implemented it that the tracks are currently generated into RAM as the complete track. Maybe in the old days Biab had to do this ? If I do the same in Reaper it is instant but is playing the track direct from disk, I can regenerate any section. Most DAW work like this. If you want Utility tracks to be the same as the BB tracks then they will have to fill up in RAM. If you generate a big song look at the RAM Biab is using, and if you want more than 255 bars how much RAM will that be ?
This is something I'm trying to get implemented with the BBPlugin so we don't have the wait times and a mountain of wav files filling up the hard drive. The files Reaper is using are on an external USB drive playing direct from there and they are 48khz 24bit.
This can be implemented now with an option for old Pentium 100 users with XP to use the current way, but those with modern hardware will play direct from disk same as Biab plays back utility tracks direct from disk. Once Biab calculates the sections of the source RealTrack files, instead of joining them together and writing to RAM Biab will play those sections of the wav/wma direct from disk and cut out the middle man. This will then work as the pic below and easily regenerate any section. As mentioned elsewhere when you freeze tracks Biab will save the RealTrack section data in the SGU then when you open that SGU the next day it will load and write them into RAM, BUT rather than do that it can play those sections direct from disk. This will also allow frozen Biab SGU/MGU to be opened in the BB DAW Plugin with all the same sections and Utility tracks.
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