The title says it all. I couldn't figure out what was going on, Reaper kept crashing, by that I mean crashing all the way to the desk top. Check it out in this video.
On a hunch, I opened a new project in Reaper, added one track and loaded it with the BIAB plugin. Then I set up a time selection so that the project would stop playing at the end of the time selection. Sure enough, it crashed Reaper just like in the video.
Of course I can keep it in mind and try to avoid using a time selection, or getting to the end of a time selection, but that takes away an important tool for working with audio and midi.
It would be better if PG fixed the bug.
If there are any other Reaper users here, set Reaper up with BIAB like I explain above and check it out, it would be good to know if others experience this too.
Unfortunately your video is difficult to see, but nice effort? Actually, I don't see the BIAB-VST GUI in the picture at all.
Here is what I can tell you about Reaper and BIAB-VST (I have used this combo for the past three years). The BIAB-VST (v1) introduced in Dec 2018 was very prone to failures unless you strongly painted within the lines. Go outside the lines and bad things could happen. BIAB-VST (v2) introduced in Dec 2019 was marginally improved. Many new features were added but still buggy at times, however very functional by final build. By Dec 2020 BIAB-VST v3 finally lived up to the high expectations we all had. I am pleased to say that as of today BIAB-VST v3 (Build 3.4.6) is clicking on all cylinders in Reaper. But I guess that's not much help to you since you are on last years version.
So first confirm you have the final most up to date build for your V2 in BIAB2020. Assuming we are talking about the PC version, that would be DAW Plugin 2.12.15 Update found here: https://www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm . You should be using the .VST3 version of the plugin in Reaper. Keep in mind you can only have one version of the BIAB-VST loaded in a project. And if you have BIAB standalone open you can not share an ASIO driver so set BIAB to MME or WAS.
You may have to deal with some limitations but it should be functional for you. Just for the record, I never remember any specific issue with using time-selection in Reaper and the BIAB-VST. Like I said, current V3 can actually be enjoyable at time. Good Luck.
TV I. 1. your vid is difficult to see. i'm vision impaired. even with a magnifier. in reaper underneath the top right hand side X. please post those details. what does reaps report ? THIS IS IMPORTANT. ie something like 44.1/24, 5 ms latency asio etc etc. a pic of your reaps driver settings also would be usefull. i'm assuming asio ? 2. what sound card/device are you useing ? usb ? please post a pic of its control panel settings. includeing sampling rate and bit depth. 3. as in 2 but a pic of your win recording /playback settings. sampling rate/bit depth. 4. a pic of your biab audio driver dialog settings.
the above will help people plus pg diagnose the issue in case its not a biab bug. otherwise people are "guessing". also note biab likes 44.1/16 rates. TVI its difficult to help without details of a persons rig. best oldmuso
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 06/09/2101:11 PM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs (90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
Regarding the update, I gave it a try but it's very confusing. The update is clearly labeled: Band-in-a -Box 2020 (Build 803) Update[u][/u]
Thanks again Dan.
Here is the update you need to run. It will install newest version of both BIAB 2020 AND the newest version of the BIAB-VST which is what you need to have installed. Honestly, I don't think it is a bug cause this version was pretty stable at the time it was issued. Good Luck and let us know.
Okay my friends, I want to address and answer all your questions, but before I do, here is another video showing that when BIAB is not floating and showing, then it doesn't crash, but as soon as the plugin is floating and visible, it crashes.
1. your vid is difficult to see. i'm vision impaired. even with a magnifier. in reaper underneath the top right hand side X. please post those details. what does reaps report ? THIS IS IMPORTANT. ie something like 44.1/24, 5 ms latency asio etc etc. a pic of your reaps driver settings also would be usefull. i'm assuming asio ?
Here you go. [44.1kHz 24bit WAV : 4/4ch 128spls ~5.3/7.2ms ASIO]
My current comp is:
Windows 10-Pro AMD Rysen 5 5600X 6-Core 32GB of Ram
I just built this computer a couple of months ago and it's been working fine.
TV I. 1. your vid is difficult to see. i'm vision impaired. even with a magnifier. in reaper underneath the top right hand side X. please post those details. what does reaps report ? THIS IS IMPORTANT. ie something like 44.1/24, 5 ms latency asio etc etc. a pic of your reaps driver settings also would be usefull. i'm assuming asio ? 2. what sound card/device are you useing ? usb ? please post a pic of its control panel settings. includeing sampling rate and bit depth. 3. as in 2 but a pic of your win recording /playback settings. sampling rate/bit depth. 4. a pic of your biab audio driver dialog settings.
the above will help people plus pg diagnose the issue in case its not a biab bug. otherwise people are "guessing". also note biab likes 44.1/16 rates. TVI its difficult to help without details of a persons rig. best oldmuso
Okay oldmuso.
I'm ASIO with a Komplete Audio 6 interface. My block size is 128 samples. I almost always run my projects at 44.1/24bit, this can't be changed.
In regards to the BIAB audio driver dialog settings, I'm not sure where I can quickly get at that, but I assure you it's the same settings that I use for Reaper which is listed above.
I want to thank you oldmuso, I bought BIAB a few months ago and haven't used it much so I still don't know my way around it very well.
Here is the update you need to run. It will install newest version of both BIAB 2020 AND the newest version of the BIAB-VST which is what you need to have installed. Honestly, I don't think it is a bug cause this version was pretty stable at the time it was issued. Good Luck and let us know.
Okay Dan, got the update installed but the same problem, Reaper crashes with the BIAB plugin open. I tried to make sure the VSTi was the latest but I can't find a way of telling that with BIAB VSTi3, no matter where I click, I can't get that info.
Okay Dan, got the update installed but the same problem, Reaper crashes with the BIAB plugin open. I tried to make sure the VSTi was the latest but I can't find a way of telling that with BIAB VSTi3, no matter where I click, I can't get that info.
The Built number is right there on the bottom left of the BAIB-VST in small white letters, see below.
Also I think I see something strange when the VST opens the first time versus the second time. See the proper Setup for Reaper below. You may have both the 32bit and 64bit versions installed? But the resolution of the video is so poor I can't read anything.
TVI. the most important aspect when someone gets a new piece of music software (well any software really) is to understand how to set settings and preferences properly. the bb manuals are on your pc and they are on this pg home site. additional vids includeing pg user vids are on you tube. thus i would suggest you spend some time reading the biab manual etc. (as your a reaper user the slew of reaper vids at reaper.fm are a wonderfull goldmine of info too.)
i know its a "drag" often reading manuals. but just has to be done in order to get best results. its just human nature wanting quick results and maybe not reading the manual first. i'm as guilty as anyone. when i first got biab years ago i was excited cos i wanted to make songs quickly. but after a few mistakes i read the manuals. lol.
BUT there is a trick if you ever get "stuck" and nobody is around to help. and it applies to any general windows questions or any questions bout any software includeing bb. ie just enter in google "biab how to xyz". where xyz is the item/feature you need to know how to do.
first step is confirming your settings are correct. 1. under the X in reaps. thanks for the info. asio good. 2. komplete good choice. its listed in the pg forums by a user as working well with pg and other software. BUT IT HAS A CONTROL PANEL. (see you tube and NI manual re set up for audio/midi) please post a pic of the NI control panel settings. 3. now lets turn to biab. options>prefs>audio please post a pic of big dialog called AUDIO SETTINGS AND THEN clik on AUDIO DRIVERS AND POST A PIC TOO OF THAT. ie windows audio devices. (a lot of info on the dialogs) 4. in reaper preferences post a pic of audio device settings also .
the above will help also pg see how your settings are set. best oldmuso TVI. ADDENDUM. at the NI site are some very good help/optimisation guides that i found in the support section. re settings etc etc. have you read them ?.eg ...
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs (90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
Also I think I see something strange when the VST opens the first time versus the second time. See the proper Setup for Reaper below. You may have both the 32bit and 64bit versions installed? But the resolution of the video is so poor I can't read anything.
Thanks Dan, in all honesty I haven't installed any 32bit blugins for several years. Also I just checked in my "Program FIles (x86)/Common Files/VST3" and BIAB is not there. It is in my "Program FIles/Common Files/VST3" however.
Originally Posted By: justanoldmuso
TVI. the most important aspect when someone gets a new piece of music software (well any software really) is to understand how to set settings and preferences properly. the bb manuals are on your pc and they are on this pg home site. additional vids includeing pg user vids are on you tube. thus i would suggest you spend some time reading the biab manual etc. (as your a reaper user the slew of reaper vids at reaper.fm are a wonderfull goldmine of info too.)
i know its a "drag" often reading manuals. but just has to be done in order to get best results. its just human nature wanting quick results and maybe not reading the manual first. i'm as guilty as anyone. when i first got biab years ago i was excited cos i wanted to make songs quickly. but after a few mistakes i read the manuals. lol.
BUT there is a trick if you ever get "stuck" and nobody is around to help. and it applies to any general windows questions or any questions bout any software includeing bb. ie just enter in google "biab how to xyz". where xyz is the item/feature you need to know how to do.
Thanks justanoldmuso, I have a special folder that I can access with shortcuts from both of my computer screens, and I use various manuals quite often, sometimes several times a day, and I might have 2 or 3 up at the same time. I used the BIAB manual a lot when I first started using it, there are a lot of things that are not in the manual. In fact my last post here was for getting BIAB midi files, at the time I thought there were midi files available for all the styles.
Also I watched many videos on BIAB, and as you say, when I need information I search the net, sometimes several times a day.
Quote:
first step is confirming your settings are correct. 1. under the X in reaps. thanks for the info. asio good. 2. komplete good choice. its listed in the pg forums by a user as working well with pg and other software. BUT IT HAS A CONTROL PANEL. (see you tube and NI manual re set up for audio/midi) please post a pic of the NI control panel settings.
Here you go..
Quote:
3. now lets turn to biab. options>prefs>audio please post a pic of big dialog called AUDIO SETTINGS AND THEN clik on AUDIO DRIVERS AND POST A PIC TOO OF THAT. ie windows audio devices. (a lot of info on the dialogs) 4. in reaper preferences post a pic of audio device settings also .
Thanks again justanoldmuso, and yes, I'm aware of most all NI info. I actually got started with Kontakt-2 and I'm also a Kontakt instrument developer. https://todsvirtualinstruments.com/
Thanks to all of you who have replied, it means a lot. I would like to see this problem of crashing addressed, and if there are any Reaper users reading this I would encourage you to make the simple test I show above, to see if you experience this also.
... if there are any Reaper users reading this I would encourage you to make the simple test I show above, to see if you experience this also.
First thing I did last night with my current 2021 version of BIAB. Open Reaper (current), create new track, place BIAB-VST on the track, open BIAB-VST on-screen. Set the time selector in Reaper to 12 bars and hit play. No problem at all.
Based on your video, you have to admit you are not running the standard Reaper Skin! What is that exactly? Could you simplify the Reaper Gui to the default view and try again? Can't think of anything else. Assuming you have installed the version I recommended I do not remember this problem. I do have a spare laptop I can load the prior 2020 version and try to repeat. I have been one of the biggest advocates of the Reaper/BIAB-VST combo and this is making me look bad. So I hope we can resolve this one.
By the way, I sure wish your video was higher resolution since I can't read anything on it. You are not trying to put the BIAB-VST on the Master track are you? I don't see another track in your mixer??
TVI. thanks for the pics. could you do one further pic please ? > at bottom of bb dialog audio/midi drivers is button bottom right "audio settings" please clik on that and post a pic of the resulting bb dialog . assuming its not a bug in bb TVI i notice the 128 setting. (maybe run a test with larger buffers ?) looking at the bb plug video on pg i notice in reaps a larger amount under reaps X. maybe pg can comment on whether the BUFFER SIZE might make an impact on plug in. cos i dont know.
Dan Musicstudent. do you see anything that doesnt jive with your bb settings and reaps settings ? cos my vision is v poor. under reaps X are you useing a larger amount than 128 ?
i think at this point pg support should jump in given the posted pics from TVI. the other thing i'm wondering re crashes is....is it to do with audio driver or pc resource contention ? but maybe i'm wrong.
best oldmuso
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs (90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
... if there are any Reaper users reading this I would encourage you to make the simple test I show above, to see if you experience this also.
First thing I did last night with my current 2021 version of BIAB. Open Reaper (current), create new track, place BIAB-VST on the track, open BIAB-VST on-screen. Set the time selector in Reaper to 12 bars and hit play. No problem at all.
Okay Dan, that's good news, did you let it play all the way to the end of the timeline?
Quote:
Based on your video, you have to admit you are not running the standard Reaper Skin! What is that exactly?
I've been running Reaper for over 11 years and I do have it highly modified. And yes it's the Reaper-6 theme, but I've modified that too.
Could you simplify the Reaper Gui to the default view and try again? Can't think of anything else. Assuming you have installed the version I recommended I do not remember this problem. I do have a spare laptop I can load the prior 2020 version and try to repeat. I have been one of the biggest advocates of the Reaper/BIAB-VST combo and this is making me look bad. So I hope we can resolve this one.
I'm sorry Dan but the picture above is the default Reaper theme that I've modified. Something that might be throwing you is the toolbars I have at the top and right side, they are tolobars 1 & 2.
You know Reaper has so many settings, it's possible it could be a simple setting, and if so, it would be good to know about it.
Quote:
By the way, I sure wish your video was higher resolution since I can't read anything on it. You are not trying to put the BIAB-VST on the Master track are you? I don't see another track in your mixer??
Actually Dan, you'll notice that the track I put BIAB on is up in the TCP and the Reaper MASTER is in the MCP. I don't know how to make my video at a higher resolution. maybe it's the aspect ratio, I took the video on a 1440p, not a 1080p, could that be it?
TO PG SUPPORT/Simon. need clarification on a couple of points relating to... BB PLUG IN MODE. 1. if a pg user is useing a multi client asio device ; can one assume setting asio in both reaps and bb is ok. and bb plug in mode will work fine ? i notice in the 2019 reaps vid that in reaps waveout is used not asio. 2. if a pg user is useing a non multi client asio device that bb will still work as a plug in; in reaps setting reaps to asio and bb to was driver . correct or not ?? 3. does buffer size setting in reaps (or any other daw like tools/cubase/mixcraft etc etc ) or buffer size setting in sound device control panel have any IMPACT ? reason i ask is in 2019 vid under reaps X on top right hand side its showing 1024 if i remember. TVI seems to be useing 128.
i think what is needed is an extension of the bb plug in documentation going into more detail regarding when useing bb in plug in mode what the recording and playback settings should be in windows AND what the settings should be in the various bb settings/drivers dialogs AND the sound devices own control panel AS WELL AS IMPORTANT DAW SETTINGS. eg in this case reaper. cos even i find it confuseing with so many settings tween daw and bb and sound device and windows. might i suggest respectfully a set of RULES ie an addendum of some sort ? i'm requesting this addendum cos i feel a new user ; especially to setting up a daw project studio must find all the settings rather a challemge.
best to pg and with greatest respect , cos i DO REALISE YOUR CODING/IMPLEMENTING within certain current bounds of software technology you have to work with as well as technology restrictions of current tech. in fact its amazeing what youve accomplished.
oldmuso (who once was a lousy programmer so i moved into management lol.)
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 06/11/2112:22 AM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs (90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
Dan Musicstudent. do you see anything that doesn't jive with your bb settings and reaps settings ? cos my vision is v poor. under reaps X are you using a larger amount than 128 ?
I run Reaper at 48K (MOTU ASIO) with the BIAB-VST with no issues. I do however tend to use a higher buffer set at 256 for recording purposes. But I don't think that is an issue here. While I agree Reaper has a ton of settings which need to be optimized, I don't recall that the BIAB-VST required any thing different than any other VST in the regards.
Quote:
Okay Dan, that's good news, did you let it play all the way to the end of the timeline?
Yes I did. I am likely going to load up my laptop with an older version of BIAB to try to duplicate this on my end.
Quote:
I'm sorry Dan but the picture above is the default Reaper theme that I've modified. Something that might be throwing you is the toolbars I have at the top and right side, they are tolobars 1 & 2.
Those tool bars are news to me. I also have been with Reaper for well over a decade and never ventured into the use of tool bars. Did you create all that custom function or are these available for download? -- Just spent a little time with Kenny on the topic of Tool Bars. I have always been a menu guy in Reaper. I see how these toolbars could permit you and I to have different defaults to many of the features since you have studied these deeper than I.
Quote:
You know Reaper has so many settings, it's possible it could be a simple setting, and if so, it would be good to know about it.
Again, I did not set anything special for BIAB-VST. I run Lots and Lots of VSTs. As many as most and more than some.
Quote:
Actually Dan, you'll notice that the track I put BIAB on is up in the TCP and the Reaper MASTER is in the MCP. I don't know how to make my video at a higher resolution. maybe it's the aspect ratio, I took the video on a 1440p, not a 1080p, could that be it?
Ya, that video is a good effort, but a total bust for our purposes here. I see the Master but don't see the track in the MCP. Tell me your not just using your cell phone to video the screen? There are many fine free tools to get a screen capture video with proper resolution.
Let me fire up the laptop today and try to reproduce with the older versions of the software. However, I just can't believe that will be the problem. I don't think this is a bug in the BIAB-VST. We ran that older version for months before it was retired and it was stable. I am betting on your customization of Reaper! Do you have a Plain Reaper install or can you download the portable Reaper and test??
Dan. thanks for your reply re buffers. (as a result of this thread and many others of its ilk re settings issues ive put up a new wish #4 in bb wishlist forum . feel free to critique.) i think i'm out of ideas why he is haveing probs. but a qauestion dan. your useing asio in reaps right ? so is bb set to asio or set to "was" on your rig ? or is motu multi client ??
best oldmuso
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 06/11/2102:25 AM.
my songs....mixed for good earbuds...(fyi..my vocs on all songs..) https://soundcloud.com/alfsongs (90 songs created useing bb/rb) (lots of tips of mine in pg tips forum.)
question dan. your useing asio in reaps right ? so is bb set to asio or set to "was" on your rig ? or is motu multi client ??
Yes, Reaper is always MOTU ASIO. If I happen to be also running BIAB at the same time, which I will often do, it has to be MME for my system. Or things will not work. There is no audio driver setting for the BIAB-VST. It uses what Reaper provides (as best I know).
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The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.
What are XPro Styles and Xtra Styles PAKs?
XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!
Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!
Get the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Get Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 19 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!
Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:
Purchase your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac during our special to save up to 50% off your upgrade purchase and receive a FREE BONUS PAK of amazing new Add-ons. These include the 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK, Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana, Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes, MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano, Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7, Playable RealTracks Set 4, RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark, and more!
Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
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So I hope we can resolve this one.
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