"You have to remember I am a recent retiree so I am going through a bit of a transition."
Dan, that was a joke. I know how much you like Session guitars, that is why I asked.
My grandma told me a story once... How she and her her "big" (~10yo) brother hunted chipmunks to sell to a local tannery to get money to buy my great grandma a scarf for her birthday. I am wondering if NI will accept squirrel hides for trade? 20 squirrels - 1 Picked Nylon w free shipping. Who knows, maybe new owner wants to diversify payment methods.
---------- Bloc-head, can you possibly share an example of what you came up with playing guitar midi file through picked acoustic (melody)?
I do not know what I am doing wrong, but a playback just sounds lousy to me.
Here is a midi chop using picked acoustic (melody mode / open string) Picked acoustic
Here is same midi ran through SF2, changing nothing: SF2
Admitting, I am not very savvy with midi. Perhaps there is little "something" I forgot to press in Picked A to make it sound amazing. So far, to my ears SF2 wins.
Rustyspoon#, I had the same issue before transposing... Try transposing your midi file up 12 simi-tones... made a huge difference. I'm out of town, and away from my studio, but I'll try to provide an example in a few days when I return and get settled in.
Last edited by bloc-head; 08/18/2105:12 PM. Reason: added text
bloc-head, Thanks! That worked. No need to share file. I used a midi filter to transpose, maybe it will work better if I actually shift notes? But I think it should make no difference.
Ok first impression: While it made a "huge difference" from how it plays out of the box, still there is something unnatural. I tried tweaking "humanize" section, fret noise knob etc. Transitions and slides are a bit mechanical. I am talking about "open string" picking option, does better job in flageolet section, but that is only to be used in certain nuances. Muted was not horrible too, but again that only for certain things.
I guess my biggest issue is that patterns are not programmable and there is no strum option. My consensus, it is good for "certain" picked melodies, but far not for random/average. ---
I tried Sunburst, got a much better result. That is because electric is far more forgiving than acoustic
P.S. I do not want to sound like a fan boy (I actually am) but that is what I love in BIAB, transitions are very natural for the most part, as a human would play. I know I am comparing apples to oranges, I just wish NI would done a more universal guitar plugin so it can eat both strum + picked and be fully tweakable and sound natural...
The transposing is quite common amount guitars and basses. Both are written an octave higher than they sound and this is important depending on what patch you are using. Some patches automatically transpose them for you while others do not, which also can be confusing IF you already transposed them.
Secondly and I say this with all respect your notes are very mundane. You need to liven them up with a few nuances. You might try some of these suggestions: 1-put a quick portamento on a few notes, especially on notes that are on the same guitar string: I can send you a chart on this if you need one. Note that this is not a grace note, it must be a little faster than that. 2-add a little vibrato on a few notes. In your example a very short vibrato would work best. 3-have extreme velocities on those notes: This works only if your sound source has velocity layers. No guitarist has the same initial volume on every note. 4-subtle changes in timing also help. 5-if your sound source allows it choose different picking positions. Picking more toward the guitar's neck will yield a different timbre then picking closer to the bridge. If emulating finger picking and the pointer finger being #1 and the pinky #4 the #3 finger would be closer to the bridge and playing the higher notes while the #1 finger being closer to the neck.
This all I can think of off of the top of my head. I hope some of this will help.
When you are at the checkout line and they ask if you found everything say "Why, are you hiding stuff?"
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Mario, I think you will appreciate the "manipulations" available in this package. As you pointed out... It can take a lot of friggin and fussin to get it right. Like Misha indicated, BIAB has spoiled us a bit with its ease of integration of high quality sound. These midi tools and VSTi require a bit more effort.= - but when you invest more of your effort, the results are more rewarding.
Here is Picked Acoustic which is an older SG product. It provides both a Melody and a Strumming nki. As I have witnessed in SG products each new generation offers more features. I see this in the file organization in the SG Nylon Picked demo. Here I plucked out a simple arp melody on my keyboard over my current chord progress project. Here is the mp3 to give an idea of the sound (as best I can punch out this morning). No adjustments in the DAW - sound straight from the VSTi.
Here is Picked Acoustic which is an older SG product. It provides both a Melody and a Strumming nki. As I have witnessed in SG products each new generation offers more features.
But they did something weird with Sunburst! They don't give you the melody nki unless you pay for the deluxe version (which of course I did!)
I wish they would change the session series so that all of the older models got the new upgrades including patterns. I guess something more like EZ Keys would be nice where they have the patterns available in any instrument. With that said I hate how broken up into individually purchased products the EZ Keys stuff is. I am spoiled by the UltraPAK approach of BIAB.
Dan, that was an outstanding emulation that would fool many guitarist. If you hadn't told me I would have thought that was "organic"!
Yes working in MIDI is time consuming. That is why some of my showcase posts are far and few between. But I much prefer working in MIDI than in RTs/RDs. YMMV
Yes BiaB is light years ahead of the competition in RTs and RDs in sounds and play ability. But it is light years behind other MIDI products like EZKeys and some keyboards. If you want to work in time signatures other than 2,3,or 4/4 and/or you want to put chords on an 8th or 16th note followed immediately by another chord your out of luck.
When you are at the checkout line and they ask if you found everything say "Why, are you hiding stuff?"
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Mario, Thanks for detailed explanation. That was a completely random piece of midi that I tried. Not something I was working on. Just to see how well it will take just "any" guitar file.
---
Block-head, pretty smooth. Thank you for sharing. Was this actually (initially) recorded using Picked acoustics or something else? If the answer is no... did you tweak actual composition (besides 12 semitones) for transitions, etc. or did nothing except for P.Acoustic sound preset?
I'm a big fan of Indiginus' instruments, and if you've got the full version of Kontakt, I'd suggest checking them out. Orange Tree's stuff is great as well, but I just find Indiginus' instruments more fun to play. YMMV.
Block-head, pretty smooth. Thank you for sharing. Was this actually (initially) recorded using Picked acoustics or something else? If the answer is no... did you tweak actual composition (besides 12 semitones) for transitions, etc. or did nothing except for P.Acoustic sound preset?
Thanks!
this was just an old midi file I found online. Don’t know when or how it was recorded. No tweaking.
Nice demo track Bloc-Head. It sounds very natural to me.
I'm disappointed to read the MIDI is a file you found on the internet. I hoped you had spent some time figuring out how to make the VSTi play what you want, not what it wants so you could share your expertise with everyone!
Last edited by Jim Fogle; 08/19/2109:43 AM. Reason: Added comment about file.
I haven’t had the program very long, and so far I’ve just scratched the surface. I still want to try recording straight into cakewalk, and then using Melodyne, convert the audio to a midi file, and play thru the vst.
Nice thread guys. Didn't expect all the interest and input when I posted. Hope we all learned a bit, I know I did.
So who ever is the first to purchase SG - Picked Nylon, be sure to add an entry to this thread to let us know. By the way, I am taking bets on who is the first.
Here is a link to another attempt at demoing my use of the NI "Picked Acoustic" Vsti I made a few edits to the midi file and added Bass, Drums, and Elec-piano...
And while I am here, this vid details much of what we have discussed - adjusting patterns (it can be done to an extent) despite what EvilDragon says. Also articulations like slides, percussion hits and endings are all done with KeySwitches. These illustrated features are common to all Session Guitar products.
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