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What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC #68672 04/03/10 12:12 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 13 Ontario, Canada Putt OP Newbie
OP Putt Newbie Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 13 Ontario, Canada	Hi, My current PC desktop is at the end of the trail. It is several years old. Since I’ve stared using RealTracks, it's been tough with my CPU often hitting 100%. I’ve been told that this is mainly because of an old mother board and a too large 500 gig hard drive I had installed. I have 2 gig of ram. I'm about to purchase a new computer. My concern is getting what is best for my music on the computer. I've looked for comments on the user group and have found little of value about purchasing a computer today, although I've probably missed the right thing. I plan on going PC desktop again. All my software is PC. I'm mainly a BIAB/RealBand user. I use lots of other music software but BIAB/RB are my main software. I use Hyper Canvas by Edirol Software, as well as M-Audio Audiophile 2496 Professional Audio Card. My question, on purchasing the new computer with 7, what should I make sure I have. For example, I will have a lot of ram and disk space, that is very common today. What else should I be concerned with in relation to my music computer? Thanks for any assistance you can give me.

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Putt #68673 04/03/10 12:51 PM Off-Topic
Joined: May 2000 Posts: 22,551 Mi., USA rharv Veteran
rharv Veteran Joined: May 2000 Posts: 22,551 Mi., USA	If you want to continue with that card you'll want to make sure there is an available slot for it (PCI I believe) You may want to weigh the option of 64 bit vs 32 bit. Check the available drivers for that soundcard; see if Win 7 64 bit is supported. If not check Win 7 32 bit. This may be a big deal for the soundcard. Do a little digging for reported problems just as a precaution. Otherwise, I suggest at least 4 gig RAM, and also at least a dual core processor. If you plan to use firewire in the future check that it has that, and hopefully a TI chipset, as this brand seems most reliable. As a side note, I like having the HDMI port for larger monitors, etc. It is very handy here. The number of USB ports is to be considered also, as these fill up fast. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome Make your sound your own!

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC rharv #68674 04/03/10 01:08 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 7,258 Scottish Highlands furry Veteran
furry Veteran Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 7,258 Scottish Highlands	A good fast processor possibly a quad. The more memory you have the better. I run biab from it's own portable drive and It's pretty quick. My own PC is an AMD dual core 2x3 ghx processors. I'd get a 2nd internal hard drive for music like I have myself which doesn't have windows on it. Graham............ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCKBPq93IQFTD3q-zBqxghbQ?view_as=subscriber

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC furry #68675 04/03/10 01:24 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498 Gary Curran Veteran
Gary Curran Veteran Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498	Putt, Whomever told you that your 500 gig hard drive was too big didn't have a clue. Now, it may have been severely fragmented, but that's a totally different issue all together. The first and foremost rule for buying a computer is: Get as much computer as you can afford. That doesn't necessarily mean getting all the bells and whistles, and the stupid stuff that doesn't really matter. It does mean getting the fastest CPU with the most cores, the most memory, the largest hard drive or hard drives, best video card (although that isn't going to play too much into this, unless you're planning on two monitors, or syncing to video). Get the best name brands you can find. A lot of us build our own computers, which isn't that really a difficult task, but for someone who hasn't done it before, it can seem a bit daunting. 1. Multicore processors. Today, unlike several years ago, you have a plethora of choices when it comes to processors. You can get multicore processors which will run multiple tasks at the same time. Kind of like having three or four CPUs in your computer at the same time, only they are all in one CPU. This allows you to run a program like Real Tracks, and the plug in effects will run on a different core, speeding up your program. Hence, the more cores, the better. So, look for a Quad Core processor. AMD and Intel are the two players in this field, one usually trumps the other every other month, so unless you're on the bleeding edge, one is not better than the other. Some music programs seem to prefer one motherboard chipset over another, but if you're buying off the store shelf, it's hard to determine what chipset you have. I would say that for BIAB and Real Band, it's not going to be an issue. 2. RAM. The more RAM you have, the better off you're going to be. We're seeing computers with 8-12 GB of RAM now. However, to get that, you MUST use a 64 bit Operating System. To use a 64 bit OS, you must have a 64 bit CPU. All current multicore CPUs support 64 bit, so not a worry there. The 'traditional' 32 bit OS will only support up to about 3 GB of RAM (in the real world). 3. Hard Drive(s). Multiple hard drives are a good thing. One hard drive can be your 'System Hard drive' and will be used for storing and running your programs on, which the second drive can be used to record, store, and play back audio files from. That way, especially with Real Band and Real Tracks, you'll be accessing audio data from two different hard drives at the same time, instead of trying to get everything off one drive, which slows it all down. 4. PCI slot. To use the 2496 in your new computer, you must have a minimum of one PCI slot. You'll find most computers today have PCI-e or PCI-Express slots, either in the x16, x4 or x1 variants. The PCI card will not fit in any of those, and M-Audio does not yet have a PCI-e card for the Delta series. So, you must have a PCI slot. Most new computers, although not all, will still have at least one PCI slot. Operating System. Some companies are still offering downgrades to Windows XP. I recommend against this. Windows 7 is a good system, the driver support is there for everything you have (including the 2496) and it's stable. Plus, with more than 3 GB of RAM, you won't be able to use XP, since it is a 32 bit system. You'll need to stay with Windows 7, 64 bit. Recommendations: Right now, for 'COTS' (Consumer Off The Shelf) systems, I'm recommending HP. The HP desktops are actually pretty good, built on an Asus motherboard, using good quality equipment, and they tend to be quiet(er). As with most computers today, the power supply is underrated in my opinion, and if you wish to install a better quality graphics card, you may wish to upgrade the PSU to a minimum of 500 watts with a name brand, i.e., Antec, Thermaltake, Seasonic (my fave) CoolMax, or others. You can buy dedicated music computers. http://www.pcaudiolabs.com/rokbox_i5.asp This is a Quad Core CPU, but only a 32 bit OS, and it's $1,600. It does have three hard drives, though. Here is a Dual or Quad Core with Windows 7, and options. Starts at $1,200 for the Dual Core and goes to $1,500 for the Quad Core, before options. http://www.rainrecording.com/products/solstice/ Finally, you might consider this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883147095 This is a Quad Core HP system, 8 GB of RAM, more than enough RAM for the built in video system. You can easily add a second SATA drive to it, something like this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136040 for not much more money. Finally, there are two different video outputs, but I do not know for sure if you can run dual monitors with it, but what I've read says you can. That way, you can spread across two monitors, if you have them. With the price of monitors coming down, two is not unusual any more. Anyway, I hope this helps you. Gary Last edited by Gary Curran; 04/03/10 01:28 PM. I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Gary Curran #68676 04/03/10 05:25 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 2,296 Victoria BC home of PG Music G Glenn Kolot Veteran
Glenn Kolot Veteran G Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 2,296 Victoria BC home of PG Music	Gary's point about getting as much computer as you can afford is very good (all of his advice is good). Case in point - my desktop is six or seven years old, but at the time it was a cutting edge dual core. It can still keep up. As Gary mentioned, PCI slots are necessary for older S/Cs - fortunately, my box has three of them, so I have a better chance of the S/C having its own IRQ. Don't know about other brands, but for my EMU, this seems to be essential. I only know one other thing - if you can, buy something with a large case. Installing additional HDs etc is much easier if the box is large. That way you don't have to call in a dentist to work in the small spaces. LOL. Glenn

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Glenn Kolot #68677 04/03/10 09:17 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498 Gary Curran Veteran
Gary Curran Veteran Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498	Glenn, The HP that I recommended has a removable hard drive cage, making it very easy to replace hard drives. One screw, and the whole cage comes out. Gary I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Putt #68678 04/04/10 10:47 AM Off-Topic
Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 13 Ontario, Canada Putt OP Newbie
OP Putt Newbie Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 13 Ontario, Canada	To Bob, Graham, Gary, Glen and Matt, Thank you very much for your invaluable assistance. I've laboured over what kind of computer to purchase for the last three weeks. Your advice will make it much easier. Once again, Thanks you

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Putt #68679 04/04/10 11:37 AM Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498 Gary Curran Veteran
Gary Curran Veteran Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498	Or, Putt, you can build your own. These are all available, and sourced, from Newegg Canada. Star with a Case. Lian-Li is one of the best case manufacturers out there, and this is lower priced for their line of gear. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112235 $69.99 Shipping: $24.99 Next, you need a power supply. I recommend Seasonic. I've have very good results from their power supplies. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151094 $81.99 Shipping: $13.84 Next, you'll need a motherboard and CPU. I am going to recommend AMD CPUs for you, since pricing is usually better. Personally, I like Asus for my motherboards, they are usually reliable and I don't have any problems with them. This one has built in graphics and 3 PCI slots, allowing you to use your 2496 card. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131398 $114.99 Shipping: $4.99 For the CPU, I'm spec'ing the AMD Phenom II Black Edition Quad Core processor running at 3.2GHz, which will provide for everything that you would want to do. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103674 $169.99 Shipping: $9.82 For RAM, I like several, Corsair, Patriot, and currently I'm using OCZ in my primary computer. This is a 4GB kit, but you can buy two of them and get 8GB, which will suit everything you do. I do like 8GB of RAM in my computer. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227496 $127.99 Shipping: $9.82 You'll need Hard Drives to store everything on. I prefer Western Digital right now, although Seagate is also very good. I have both in my computer. Of the Western Digital, for my server, I use the Western Digital Greens, but for my main computer, I use, and recommend the Caviar Black series. Two 750 GB hard drives will do the trick for you, one for the system drive, one to store audio on. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136283 $89.99 Shipping: $9.82 You'll need a CD/DVD burner. LiteOn or Samsung are usually the least expensive, and both work just fine. Here's a nice OEM Samsung. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151176 $34.99 Shipping: $9.82 The motherboard has built in video, so you will not need to use a separate video card. However, you can buy one if you wish. I will not make a recommendation for one, however. You will need an Operating System. I recommend Windows 7 64 bit. Microsoft offers the OEM for System Builders which is just fine for you. The only caveat of this is that there is no Microsoft support included in this product, but then again, I've never needed any, so it's not a big issue. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116754 $109.99 Shipping: $9.82 You could also buy a Combo deal, which gives you the motherboard, CPU, hard drive, RAM, case and power supply all in one, which is a pretty good deal. You will still need to buy the O.S., however. You will also need to add a CD/DVD burner, same as recommended above. I would recommend adding a second hard drive, as shown above. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.361309 $648.00 Shipping: ?? Pricing on the left is $Can for the cost, and pricing on the right is shipping costs. Gary Last edited by Gary Curran; 04/04/10 11:41 AM. I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Gary Curran #68680 04/04/10 01:56 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,199 Scotland George Nelson Expert
George Nelson Expert Joined: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,199 Scotland	Hi Gary, Could you do me a favour and tell me where I can find all these computer components in the UK. I am also thinking of upgrading my PC. I used to build my own some years ago but have lost all the contacts for parts. Hope you can help because I value your expertise. Best regards michee Windows 11 64 bit, Biab 2024 1111, Realband 2024 i7 Desktop Computer 16Gb Memory

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC George Nelson #68681 04/04/10 04:19 PM Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498 Gary Curran Veteran
Gary Curran Veteran Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 10,199 Lakewood, WA 98498	George, Honestly, I would not know. I only know of the Canadian Newegg because I use Newegg here in the U.S. You might try this: http://www.cclonline.com/ and they have Bundles and Barebones, but I don't know anything about them. That was just done with a quick internet search. I really and truly can not speak of U.K. retailers. Sorry Gary I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Gary Curran #68682 04/04/10 05:59 PM Off-Topic
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 1,992 Canada M manning1 Expert
manning1 Expert M Joined: May 2005 Posts: 1,992 Canada	George Nelson i visit my mum every year in the uk , n i find uk prices are nuts. my advice is stay away from the normal shopping precinct outlets like currys etc etc n go online. or check in your local area for a well respected clone builder by talking to local businesses etc. also look in the yellow pages. or go on line. see my tips for config tips etc. eg amd 620 quad is 40 quid here.. (just the processor.) run dpc latency checker before buying any system. retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE ! "what is the black art of audio engineering ?" my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning see my tips in the tips section.

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC Gary Curran #68683 04/05/10 04:56 AM Off-Topic
Joined: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,199 Scotland George Nelson Expert
George Nelson Expert Joined: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,199 Scotland	Hi Gary, Thank you so much for your help. Much appreciated. Best regards michee Windows 11 64 bit, Biab 2024 1111, Realband 2024 i7 Desktop Computer 16Gb Memory

Re: What is important with the purchase of a New Desk Top PC manning1 #68684 04/05/10 05:02 AM Off-Topic
Joined: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,199 Scotland George Nelson Expert
George Nelson Expert Joined: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,199 Scotland	Hi manning1, You talk of getting the Quote: eg amd 620 quad is 40 quid here.. Cheapest I have found in the UK is £73.83 73.83 GBP = 112.605 USD Any PC Retailers you know that ship internationally? Best regards michee Windows 11 64 bit, Biab 2024 1111, Realband 2024 i7 Desktop Computer 16Gb Memory

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