PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Recording, Mixing, Performance and Production Why Use A DAW When There Is Band-in-a-Box? (Discussion) [Resolved]

Uhhh... Earth to JohnJohnJohn, whoever the hell you are, none of the ones I mentioned are free.

What, do you mean the "Lite" versions given away with hardware?

Oh dear…



There you go again. You just don't know how wrong you are. When pros are under client deadlines, support boards and chat rooms aren't good enough and nothing you say changes that. When Time spent=$$$ wasted, we need answers and sometimes engineering solutions ASAP. That's why we pay what we do. For us, it's a business.

I have no problem with Reaper. Again, it's pretty good cheapware but that low price does come at a cost.

Well, you're wrong! But I'll let you figure out which one it is. A pro like you should be able to figure it out pretty quickly!

It seems funny to me that here we are in the PGMusic forum and all you guys want to talk about is other products.

I own Studio 1 Professional and Logix Pro X. I've owned and used in the past Abelton live, Cakewalk, CubeBase, Sonar, Reason and I have a Home Studio. I've played music since junior high school and I'll be 70 this year, guitar, keys, trumpet and harmonica. I have enough equipment to backline a whole band and then some and I hosted a open Jams at my 2.5 acer ranch every Friday night for 10+ years. sometimes as many as 70 to 100 people showing up. Some of my family members have been nominated for 6 Grammys. I may be a newbie to this forum but not to music so I feel I am qualified to speak on this.

I don't play professional and I don't want too. I love music and I still want to play but I simply can't like I use too. A DAW DOES NOT MAKE MUSIC. That is where BIAB comes in. I've owned BIAB since the early 2000's and have updated many times. I now have over 7000 styles to choose from, most with real musicians playing real instruments. Do you realize what it cost to higher one session player for a project? Let alone a whole band. Well I have over 300 of the best in the business sessions musicians at my beckon call. They don't come in late, get tired, get drunk or talk back. They play what ever progression I want them to and when ever I want them too not to mention royalty free.

Do you know what it takes to come up with 50 new features each and every year? I do, I have been developing software for a company called AllMasterSoftware for 25years now. I have to tell you the folks at PG Music have done a superb job. They have been developing AI software even before it was a thing.

I know that the UI is out dated, when you have been developing a piece of software as long as PG Music has with BIAB it is a big undertaking to rebuild a UI as complex as BIAB.

I love trying to tweak BIAB to come up with some interesting music. I don't think it will ever be a traditional DAW but that doesn't mean we can't hope for some features that a traditional DAW may have. After all why learn another piece of software if you can accomplish what you want to in one.

My three cents.
PShorty

if you read my post 'what do BIAB and RB do differently' in this forum i think you'll see why people use a DAW when they have BIAB

Hello everyone!
I enjoyed reading this thread and want to chime in, even if I am no native speaker. I have been using PG Music Products since 1995 and still love using PTW 3.5e on Win XP, PTW 8.0d on Win 10 and BiaB 2005 on Win XP. I don't like PTW 2018, to my mind it lacks too much features these days.

I start recording a new idea in BiaB, adding backing tracks and laying down a rough midi file. I prefer the notation edit mode in the staff window over any matrix editor.
Then I export to PTW 8.0d which I enhanced with VST-Host "Xlutop Chainer" for using VST (Synths, FX, TapeIt). This combination is a very powerful DAW to my mind, I am using Midi data excessively for automation and mixing.

Greetings, Michael

Look at my signature and you may notice my signature includes the software DAW Cakewalk by Bandlab, a Zoom MRS-8 hardware DAW and Band-in-a-Box. While I most do not use all these tools on every song project I find the project defines which tool has the features I need to efficiently perform different tasks.

Another thread in this Beginners forum section, +++ Can't Hear Instrument Plugin While Recording +++, highlights a major difference between recording in Band-in-a-Box versus in an audio editor, hardware or software DAW. The difference is you can hear what you're recording while you are recording in a most audio editors or a DAW while in Band-in-a-Box you can't hear what is recorded until playback.

Why do I bring that up here? Because the audio editor or DAW is the better solution when that feature is required regardless of the skill and knowledge level of the person asking the question.

Listening to what you record while you are recording is such a primal feature of most audio editors and DAWs that it is almost natural to assume the feature is embedded in all audio programs. However it is not a Band-in-a-Box feature. To perform the task in Band-in-a-Box requires workarounds and quickly becomes complicated.

Now, imagine IF PG Music adds a listen while you record feature. Imagine a new user asks in the forum or one of the Facebook groups how to use the listen to the track while recording feature. I would almost bet that even though a DAW is not mentioned that multiple people would respond, "Take it to a DAW"! I'm reasonably sure that would happen even when a new user hasn't provided much information about their audio production skills or knowledge.

Newcomers may, or may not, have audio production experience which helps in understanding DAWs, signal chains, effects and recording techniques. They may, or may not, have live sound experience which helps in understanding how a mixer works. They may, or may not, know music theory or notation. What we do know they have is an interest in music and have expressed a desire to know more about Band-in-a-Box.

I want to help these people understand Band-in-a-Box features and help them to utilize these features as much as they desire. If they ask about Band-in-Box my response will be about Band-in-a-Box. When the question is open ended and BiaB is not the best tool I state why another tool works better.

The Band-in-a-Box Audio Editor, Utility Tracks, Microchords and Playable RealTracks have greatly enhanced how things can be done in Band-in-a-Box. A DAW will almost always be the best answer for those with prior DAW experience but it may not be for the person asking the question.

But I hope the "take it to a DAW" response will not continue to be so automatic when the question is about Band-in-a-Box. I hope respondents will take the time to investigate and become familiar enough with the Band-in-a-Box enhancements to promote the enhancements when appropriate.

For example, the Band-in-a-Box Audio Editor cut and paste features are as simple to use as the cut and paste features in most DAWs and standalone audio editors. But only if you are familiar enough with the steps-to-perform-the-task in Band-in-a-Box as you are with performing the same steps in your DAW. You likely will not change your workflow to use the cut and paste features in Band-in-a-Box because of your familiarity and experience using cut and paste inside your DAW. But for someone with no cut and paste experience that owns Band-in-a-Box why tell them to take it to a DAW?

This has been an interesting and enlightening discussion with some provoking thoughts expressed. I'm glad I asked the question. I hope everyone responding or reading feel the same.

Jim, with those closing remarks you can now mark this thread "RESOLVED"

That was perfect Jim.

I'm glad that you did ask that question.

The bottom line IMHO is that there are many different ways to use BiaB so use the workflow that works for you but don't criticize someone who doesn't use your workflow.

+1

Resolved

Well,
you're consistent & reliable.
You consistently misread, fail to comprehend or miss the point
Added to that you reliably back yourself to the exclusion of anything that doesn't reinforce your position.
Onya.

Rayc.

this thread is resolved, however your comment to me compels me to defend myself as follows…

1..per forum rules it's my understanding these forums are for discussion of pg products and gear in general in a friendly cordial fashion.

2..further it's my understanding these forums also are for users trying to help existing and new users (which ive done many many times over the years here.)
further…

3..according to forum rules it is my understanding these forums are not for analysis or comment on another users character traits or personality.

Ray we all are different with many differing opinions on topics. and thats fine.

i will not be replying to you further as I find your personal comments concerning,

thank you.

om

Ah, the easy way out.

RESOLVED implies a solution to a problem, or answer to a question, has been found to the O.P.'s satisfaction.
You may infer otherwise but that is a matter of your own reading, comprehension and focus.
RESOLVED may be used otherwise - to close a topic perhaps - but that isn't a logical nor functional use.

Cordial doesn't cover endless, tedious regurgitation.

My comments may be a cause for concern. I can & will accept that.
I have, however, tried to help you understand.

PLEASE click the ignore button and allow me to recede into your past: further even.

For my part I usually ignore your posts but when I see someone expressing their frustration with your posts I do take a peek. I am always happy to read new, interesting, entertaining or education posts & respond.

Why Use A DAW When There Is Band-in-a-Box?

Why drive or ride in a car when there are bicycles?

Seriously!?

I think you didn't read the original post.