The red area above the song is in E major. When the song reaches the yellow area below (starting at 21 bar) I want it to change to A major. Can BIAB do it? What should I do. This is my first attempt at BIAB.
Use F5 bar 21, Key Signature Change. See if it works
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud (Tip: No need to create a SC account to hear music - just hit ESC ).
Based on your tip, I made changes. But I listened carefully and it didn't change. And looking at it with the eyes, the E above has not turned into an A. Is there something wrong with my settings.
Frist let me say, I don't know if this feature works or not. I have done Key changes before using the BIAB-VST and it was painful. Having said that, ...
You must know that the only difference between the Key of E and Key of A is a single D# - D. I think I heard it in your video, but I would never trust my ears. So look at the notation, is the D sharp or natural. And regarding the lack of change in the visible menu, that is typical for F5 changes - they just happen with no indication.
Oh, and by the way, you did regenerate after the change, right?
Good luck
Last edited by MusicStudent; 11/07/2207:18 AM.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud (Tip: No need to create a SC account to hear music - just hit ESC ).
I tried it directly in BIAB on a new song with the same style in the same original key of E, no VST used and this simple test did not work at all. The key should have changed to A at bar 3.
Something is definitely going on wrong.
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Again, only 1 note changes between Key of E and A! What also changes is the pull and push (relationship of the tonic to the harmonic chords) in the scale, but with only two chords in each key and the two keys next to each other in the circle of fifths, there would be no way of hearing this neuance in such a short arrangement. So my question to you is how do you know it is not working? You have to examine the notation. Is the D# (the vii dimenished chord in key of E) changing to D (the IV major chord in Key of A).
I hate to sound like a music nerd, cause I not, I am just a hobbyist, but I am confused how a second report of this is not working has come in. Please try a big change in key which may give you a chance to hear the change since multiple notes change. And make the arrangement long enough so you can hear the change in tonic.
Or examine the notation. For all I know it could be that this key change only effects notation and the chords are actually not changing at all. But we need to do a proper test.
Sorry for the outburst. Maybe it is my fever acting up again. I really mean no disrespect.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud (Tip: No need to create a SC account to hear music - just hit ESC ).
For all I know it could be that this key change only effects notation and the chords are not changing at all.
Page 138 in manual discusses the Key Signature change from the Bar Settings menu (F5)
Key Signature Change to: You can have multiple keys in the same song with the new key signature shown on notation. Select the new key signature you want from the combo list and you will see the new key signature drawn on the notation at that bar
Well look at that, it works. But I have caused enough trouble for one day.
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud (Tip: No need to create a SC account to hear music - just hit ESC ).
In terms of hearing. If I input G#maj in E major alone, it sounds like It's different from the way I play when I type C#maj in the key of A major alone.
This difference, I didn't feel it in the transposition.
....................... In terms of hearing. If I input G#maj in E major alone, it sounds like It's different from the way I play when I type C#maj in the key of A major alone.
This difference, I didn't feel it in the transposition.
[/quote]
My guess is that you are hearing different inversions of those chords?
我的猜测是你听到了这些和弦的不同转位
I hope Google translated that correctly.
Why is it that doctors call what they do 'practice'? If flying is so safe, why do they call the airport, the terminal?
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Hello teacher. You came. Let me think of another way to describe it.
If the KEY is changed. (E major becomes A major)
So III (C#) in A major should sound like VI in E major
The song was originally in the key of E major, but changed to A major at 21 bar.
20bar is 3 (E major III is G#) 21bar is 3 (A major III is C#)
So when playing to 21bar, if you do change the KEY, it becomes A major. Although I entered 3, it sounds like it should be 6.
But now it sounds like 3 at 20bar is exactly the same as 3 at 21bar.
Therefore, I say that from the sense of hearing, it is not achieved that E becomes A
I don't know if this expression can make you understand what I mean. This is my SUG file, please download if you have time. Note the position of 21bar.
The fact is you don't really want to "transpose" a portion of a song (I have never known BIAB to do that), what you want to do is "modulate" to a new key. So you have to just write the chords in the new key while BIAB stays in the original key. Then you can use the F5 to change the notation so those reading it will see the change.
The question is, what will BIAB accompaniment do with these new chords written in the new key? Will it play to the chords or play to the key? My understanding is, it will continue to play to the original key. But I dont know! I said I had done this in the past and I actually used two files of BIAB in different keys and combined them in my DAW. I could find no other way.
But I am going to take a break now. I may be getting way out over my ski's or over my head and I don't want to add to the confusion. Fact is I don't know how BIAB is doin what it does most of the time. Lets hear from some other folks on this interesting topic. I will only add that since Scaler2 came out, I don't worry much about this stuff any longer as it is a very good tool to manage key changes and modulations.
I will download your file and get back at some point. But a chord will never be something different in another key unless you establish the new tonic of the new key. So add a /A to help set the tonic then the new relationship to support the key change is established.
Dan
BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud (Tip: No need to create a SC account to hear music - just hit ESC ).
The fact is you don't really want to "transpose" a portion of a song (I have never known BIAB to do that), what you want to do is "modulate" to a new key. So you have to just write the chords in the new key while BIAB stays in the original key. Then you can use the F5 to change the notation so those reading it will see the change.
The question is, what will BIAB accompaniment do with these new chords written in the new key? Will it play to the chords or play to the key? My understanding is, it will continue to play to the original key. But I dont know! I said I had done this in the past and I actually used two files of BIAB in different keys and combined them in my DAW. I could find no other way.
But I am going to take a break now. I may be getting way out over my ski's or over my head and I don't want to add to the confusion. Fact is I don't know how BIAB is doin what it does most of the time. Lets hear from some other folks on this interesting topic. I will only add that since Scaler2 came out, I don't worry much about this stuff any longer as it is a very good tool to manage key changes and modulations.
I will download your file and get back at some point.
Dan
OK Thank you teacher for always helping me. I see what you mean. I thought it could be done directly in BIAB. See if other teachers have a good idea. Pay attention to rest and have a good dream! Thanks to the teacher for the tip yesterday, it helped me a lot to have SCALER as the default synth for BIAB!
I regenerated the song many times and most of the time I got something like this:
Measure 20 = G# - The notes that are being played from the highest to the lowest note are G#-D-C#-G#-G#
Measure 21 = C#m - The notes that are being played from the highest to the lowest note are E-C#-G#-C#
As you can see the only difference between the two chords is two notes; The G# chord has a D while the C#m has an E.
Personally I heard that difference in each generation even though sometimes some notes were eliminated, usually in the C#m. You might want to regenerate a few times until you get what you want to hear.
Why is it that doctors call what they do 'practice'? If flying is so safe, why do they call the airport, the terminal?
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Key Signature Change to: You can have multiple keys in the same song with the new key signature shown on notation. Select the new key signature you want from the combo list and you will see the new key signature drawn on the notation at that bar.
It appears that it will change the notation but will not start playing the song in a new key. I went from C to Ab to E in 3 measures and I did not hear any change at all.
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Measure 21 = C#m - The notes that are being played from the highest to the lowest note are E-C#-G#-C#
Mario D:
21bar = 3 3=III=C# (in A major)
This is my help query through Scaler2.7 software, it should be correct. But that's not the point of the question.
If the KEY does not change, I want the sound to be what I want. I can change 3 to 6 at the position of 21bar, which is to change vi in E major to VI, which is 6=C#
So, in the SUG file, starting at 21: 6 - 2m - 1 - 4 6 - 2m - 3m7b5 - 4
The above is the writing method of E major, which is the same as the sound of A major.
But I prefer to understand it as transposition. If BIAB can change E major to A major. So starting from 21bar, what needs to be written is: 3 - 6m - 5 - 1 3 - 6m - 7m7b5 -3
The current situation is that I change the KEY through F5. Changed from E to A at 21bar. I generated it countless times and I didn't feel like a transposition.
Although the notes are similar, only a few notes have been changed. But the chord relationship has changed fundamentally. This may be the key to the difference in hearing. It is also the reason for transposition. This is my own understanding. I can't find any theoretical basis. Maybe my statement is wrong. This is not the point. Now go back to the original idea. Can BIAB realize transposition? Does the forum have the function @ official staff?
It appears that it will change the notation but will not start playing the song in a new key. I went from C to Ab to E in 3 measures and I did not hear any change at all.
hello
That is to say, the change modulation function in F5 can only change the score? But you can't change the music. Therefore, the score is changed, but the sound is not changed? To be honest, I've never seen the sheet music. What I hope more is that the music is truly transmuted.
62. How do I change keys in the middle of my Band-in-a-Box® song? Can I display more than one key signature? To transpose to a new key in the middle of a song, you can use the Edit | TransposeFrom...to Dialog. To display the new key signature in the notation window, you can use the Settings for Current Bar dialog (press F5 at any bar).
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