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Does anyone here have experience working with BIAB produced WMA files inside of a DAW? I've always exported BIAB to .WAV files and worked with those inside of Reaper. I don't think the sound quality will be any different since they basically start out as WMA (I think) in BIAB. So, why not keep them that way to save hard drive space and "maybe" some processing power when I have multiple tracks in Reaper.
My main concerns are;
1. Will my plugins behave and sound correct?
2. Will it actually save hard dive space and/or processing power?
3. My live instrument and voice recordings are going in as .WAV. So, when I mix down and render to a stereo track would I keep the whole thing as a WMA?
4. Should I just stick with exporting from BIAB in the .wav format?
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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I think your real decision is whether to let BiaB export as wav or have Reaper import it to wav.
The only difference is which one does the conversion.
Either way I think you end up with a wav file(s) in Reaper as far as size goes.
Reaper should adjust any imported audio to the project settings (most likely wav) ..
so really 'six of one VS half dozen of the other' in my experience.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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This is just my own suggestion, but I would personally render and work with a .WAV format when it comes to working within a DAW. There are "pros" and "cons" to using both. WMA is a Microsoft exclusive format, and it's not supported across the board by all media players and operating systems (considering it's Microsoft only). If you are working in a Windows environment, there isn't any harm in working with WMA files at all, and it will help you save space as .WAV files are indeed quite large. WAV files are an uncompressed format, which means they are exact copies of the original source audio. Since they're uncompressed, they do take up extra space that a compressed format wouldn't.
We hope this helps!
Cheers,
Ember
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Just export the files from BB/RB as waves. Problem solved.
WMA is a compressed format so when you render a wave, you're not going to get the "missing" data restored but you should not see a decrease either.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Does anyone here have experience working with BIAB produced WMA files inside of a DAW? I've always exported BIAB to .WAV files and worked with those inside of Reaper. I don't think the sound quality will be any different since they basically start out as WMA (I think) in BIAB. So, why not keep them that way to save hard drive space and "maybe" some processing power when I have multiple tracks in Reaper.
My main concerns are;
1. Will my plugins behave and sound correct?
2. Will it actually save hard dive space and/or processing power?
3. My live instrument and voice recordings are going in as .WAV. So, when I mix down and render to a stereo track would I keep the whole thing as a WMA?
4. Should I just stick with exporting from BIAB in the .wav format? Yes, you can use Biab Track Injector for REAPER if you want to work directly with the wma use version from 6.57. You can also batch encode the wma/wav source files into any format that Reaper supports.
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As far as I can tell, Cakewalk by Bandlab does not support importing WMA files. According to the import module Cakewalk imports WAV or CD tracks.
Jim Fogle - 2024 BiaB (1111) RB (5) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Hi, I can use the BIAB wav files directly in mixcraft !
mvh Dani
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We should be able to import BIAB .wav files into any DAW.
Since WMA files are compressed, what's the point in using them at all?
BIAB 2023 Audiophile, 24/60 Core M2 Mac Studio Ultra/8TB/192GB Sonoma, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP
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So as I understand it..... the files are WMA in the BB folders that it loads when you load the song. So they are already in a "less than a WAV" compressed format. You're working with and listening to the WMA compressed files in your program.
When you are ready to export, you export it in a WAV format since that is pretty much industry standard. Keep in mind however, that you are simply encoding the WMA compressed file as a WAV file. It doesn't magically restore the missing data. You're simply encoding what data that remains in the WMA compressed format, into a WAV file format.
Unless you have the audiophile version and you actually have WAV files to start, you are working with a loss of data from the original.
But it still sounds mighty fine.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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i wish biab and rb could export to flac (or wavpak) so i could go all flac (or wavpk) in reaper.
(i would be ecstatic if bb//rb went all flac as an option.)
ive recorded thousands of flac traks in reaps with not one prob ever including using the pg dx plug ins i like as well as loads of other vst plug ins. i love flac.
i hope one day the industry moves on from wav format.
mebe i'll get 'flac' over the above…lmao.
all i can relate are my experiences including no lag/probs….and pc 'agility' i cant quantify.
reaper was doing flac way way back years ago.
one reason i love reaps.
alternatively i dont know if a all wma recording//playback…reaps//bb//rb combo studio would work…cos i dont know enough about how wma works.
but certainly a all lossless studio for recording//playback//trak generation certainly i find an interesting idea whether flac or other lossless format.
and before someone says i'm 'bonkers' to record n' mix using flac…ive tested the results with all sorts of people over the years from music aficianados to the normal everyday consumer.
i would be a happy likkle piglet if pg shipped the rt's etc etc as flac instead of wma.
om
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justanoldmuso,
While Reaper fully supports the use of FLAC, it is one of the few DAWs that fully supports FLAC. Mixcraft offers "partial support" whatever that means. ProTools uses a conversion tool to convert from FLAC to WAV (I think). That's all I could find while researching what DAWs support FLAC.
With so little support for FLAC, why should PG Music support it?
Jim Fogle - 2024 BiaB (1111) RB (5) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Jim.
Re..why pg might support flac (or another lossless format eg wavpak)
a very good question jim.
my answer as follows.
1..
i think one needs to work a lot with a lossless format to really appreciate it.its not just storage savings, but download time savings…..which the latter i think will become very important as pg offers every year more and more 'content'..
eg real traks as one example…..also imagine if biab over time comes with a massive 'content library' covering not just a huge library of styles but also a huge library of demo songs and real traks. now add in the fact that biab is a world wide product which will entice musos world wide from different countries each often with their own unique and ethnic music creation needs…do you see the implications ?
lets take one example…when i was a kid growing up in various countries in the world i heard all sorts of interesting types of music styles depending the country my parents were working in. i was exposed to all sorts of music.
to support my thesis…already one sees new users posting on the forums often a need for styles and instrument content related to the country they live in.
i have no inside info…but i suspect internally pg sometimes discusses the implications of an ever expanding library of content eg the time to download such a huge library of content for users that might not have the fastest eg fibre internet etc. eg what happens when pg offers 5 times the song demos in the stylepicker compared to today ?
2..
as an example lets consider the implications for one pg product..realband (rb).
would rb be more 'nimble' if it used flac ? lets look at possible benefits mate.
..would high trak count SEQ's load faster and save faster ?
..what about editing ? would copies and moves and complex edits be faster and more fluid ?
..would rb operate more nimbly on even the lowest power or old pc ?
(not everyone can afford i7's//i9's and ryzens…there are many countries whose citizens, sadly, cant afford high end pc's…but would like to create songs all the same. )
in summary all i would suggest is i suspect rb would be more nimble for some low powered pc users.
of course only the pg coders can answer as to, if in fact, rb would be more nimble.
i have only my reaper experience to go on. 'more fluid' is ive found on lower power pc's viz wav.
jim….if you feel i'm 'talking rubbish'...take the clunkiest old pc (like many people have in the world)...install reaps and do a all wav song for 30 traks, then repeat recording and playing etc using flac for 30 traks. and assess for yourself whether running a lossless format like flac realises a more 'nimble experience' for the user. then repeat with high trak counts and see if wav is still nimble compared to wav.
i suspect you will see more and more the difference as the trak count goes higher and higher.
have a great xmas and happy creative 2023.
om
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 12/16/22 01:07 PM.
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i wish biab and rb could export to flac (or wavpak) so i could go all flac (or wavpk) in reaper.
(i would be ecstatic if bb//rb went all flac as an option.)
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As I remember it .. and I admit I'm getting old and have 'sometimers'
When RB imports a file, it is (under the hood) handled as WAV .. ie, it gets converted either during import or generation ..
so I suspect Flac would be much the same. When it gets saved as a SEQ file it is now raw WAV data, not WMA that needs to be converted again
/of course, everything I say may be wrong .. I can't know everything
*Edited to remove the things I may have been wrong about
Last edited by rharv; 12/17/22 03:21 AM.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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(or wavpak) Zoom++ 
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All//ANY SCEPTICS.
run this simple test..(as far as i know flac is truly lossless…see the xiph web site)
i just did this.
TEST.
..import a wav into reaper.
..render said wav to flac in reaps.
(or use another wav >>> flac convertor software if your v sceptical)
..after reaps render you can launch the flac to listen…do you hear a diff from wav ??
OR..
..now import the rendered flac back into a different trak in reaps.
so now we have two distinct traks in reaps…original imported wav and the just created flac trak.
BIG NOTICE >> note that reaps hasnt converted the flac file or added any new files if you look in the dir….cept for a waveform peaks file.
THUS i see no conversion process where the imported flac has been converted to wav for playback. (MCITY please confirm i'm not 'nuts' lol…, i see only the original wav and the rendered flac.)
..in reaps also you can play the original wav and the imported rendered flac….and compare the two traks in reaps.
ps the original wav was about 40 mb.
the flac was bout 20 mb.
a merry xmas to all.
om
ps MCITY. that looks mighty interesting thus i could export from bb and end up with the wav traks as flac or
wavpak ?
Last edited by justanoldmuso; 12/16/22 04:27 PM.
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...ps MCITY. that looks mighty interesting thus i could export from bb and end up with the wav traks as flac or
wavpak ?
Here's the size and quality:  And Biab using Flac & WavePack Zoom++ 
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Also, FWIW I don't think Flac is truly 'lossless' .. in other words if you decompress a Flac file there will be differences between it and the original. Easily proven empirically. I tested a number of compression formats and sample rates some years back, deciding which I'd use. With FLAC, I compressed WAV files to FLAC, then decompressed the FLAC to a WAV, then did a binary compare of the files. They were identical; not a single bit of error. I did that with a number of files and the outcomes were the same.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
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That's good to hear Gordon.
In my testing (much the same method) the file size actually varied when compressing/decompressing FLAC and comparing.
ie, they did not match after the process, whereas with Monkeys Audio they did.
This was quite a few years ago though.
Things change and I can accept that
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Curious. There's always the question of whether it always works as it should and/or of whether the algorithm was implemented correctly in any particular context.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
Kawai MP6, Korg M50, Ui24R, Saffire Pro 40.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11; Win8.1: Scarletts
BIAB2022 UltraPAK, Reaper, a bunch of stuff.
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