So, in line with the recent discussions on pitch correction in another thread, I just watched an online streamed session in Nashville with Benita Hill (multi hit songwriter for Garth Brooks and many others) that included If We Can Just Make it Through Midnight, that was posted here. (Produced with Band in a Box.) Song by Rachel and David.
Benita and the NSAI (Nashville Songwriters Association) staff were smiling and nodding along like crazy the entire time, and the comment was very close to this, if not verbatim:
"I love the vocals! I really like your voice. It really communicates the song. Totally pitchable as is. As an artist or to someone else. [Song is] cool. It's different. Kind of has a cowboy, western feel, which I love. Really really good. I like it!!" [smiling.]
I did not use Melodyne.
I just stepped up to a mic and sang it with my heart.
I don't think you can buy one of those from Sweetwater, but maybe they will go on sale next week.
P.S. They also listened to Rachel on "Big Wide Open Road," also posted here, and Benita made some suggestions [but was extremely helpful] on some stuff because she is a hit song lyricist, but overall, they were also pumped about this tune and the comment was:
"You've written a great road trip driving song girl!"
So I guess Rachel and I will just keep walking down that long, old, dusty, wide open, long and winding road that leads us to your door.....
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
I think why I posted this is because I feel there is SO MUCH that goes into a vocal performance that is never really covered on MANY forums out there and all around the world: a lot of stuff about plugins and technology and other things, which always kind of lead to one of two places.
1.) Your vocal can't possibly work so I guess you'll have to use that AI girl Natalie like everyone else and sound like everyone else because we have now moved into a one voice world. Real voices not allowed.
2.) Why don't you just join the crowd and mind your manners, and sing some faux jazz or the 12 bar blues with a three note melody: or else go hide in a closet. Because I said so. And I should know. Although you have never heard of me.
Uh........no thanks.
Oh, I forgot the 3rd staple of Internet forums (and this one is almost sacred):
"Hey I know I am wearing an avatar mask from a Japanese video game and have the stupidest user name ever invented and no one has ever heard of me, and I really have never actually done anything, but unless everyone on the forum does what I say you will never ever make it in the real world. Trust me, I know. How I know, well, I can't say, but just trust me."
So....
No.
There is A LOT that goes into a vocal that has nothing to do with VSTs and editing.
There is also the SPIRIT of the song, and the HEART and the FEELING that communicates a message. NO robot will ever be able to do that. EVER.
These are things a VST cannot touch. To dwell on them at the expense of all else it simply nuts.
For practice, there are any number of reasonably priced vocal warm up apps that anyone can use at any time to develop more flexible vocal chords.
Side note: I once burst out into laughter watching some dude on the Recording Revolution give a vocal performance lesson (totally serious and stony-faced) where he talked about "hydrating." He is a heavy metal singer and he drank a bottle of water on camera and then went:
"AAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH. Did you hear how I went AAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHHH."
One note and exactly like the sound of a dump truck on gravel.
Wow! I am going to work on that! Thanks for the water drinking tip though!!!
That is to say, there about 5,666,789,976,777,432,156,698 totally crazy videos out there to make your music sound like a "hit."
BUT, even if they DID work, have you ever gone on Spotify and typed in 100 top songs on Spotify now?
How long were you able to listen?
Did it sound good?
Do you understand where the money went when they were producing this??
Do you still want to listen to "advice" from anyone????
Here's what I think:
If they know what they're talking about, sure.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
How come, of all the so-called "advice" out there on how to make your song a "hit," no one ever mentions "write a good song?"
Shouldn't that be step one?
Byron Dickens
BIAB. CbB. Mixbus 32C 8 HP Envy. Intel core i7. 16GB RAM W10. Focusrite Scarlett 18i 20. Various instruments played with varying degrees of proficiency.
"Back in my day, we didn't have autotune. We didn't have any of that stuff. We hardly had anything you know, it was just me and Jooohnnn.
"Really, it was simple, we just had to be able to step up to a microphone and hit the right note, you know what I mean? We had to be able to sing, you know." *
--Paul McCartney
* I heard this on a video and I think I have it exact.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
And then there's: "I am in awe of Paul McCartney. I don't think I've ever been in awe of anyone else but I'm in awe of Paul McCartney. He can do it all. And his melodies are effortless. It's all so damned effortless. Everything that comes out of his mouth is framing a melody. I wish he'd just quit."
--Bob Dylan
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
I just stepped up to a mic and sang it with my heart.
Yes, but you also sang it in tune, so you didn't need Melodyne. Which is the point that Paul is making: they had to sing in tune. Because if they didn't, as Paul writes elsewhere, people would "stand up and walk out on me".
Originally Posted By: Paul McCartney
Really, it was simple, we just had to be able to step up to a microphone and hit the right note, you know what I mean? We had to be able to sing, you know.
Not only could they sing in tune, they could sing in harmony.
And as Dylan says, Paul sings in service of the melody. I assume that's what you mean by "sang it with my heart".
I'm betting you weren't singing out of tune. I know you've put in those hours of work into your singing, the same as you have on the guitar.
In the thread that started this, Nigel wrote:
Originally Posted By: NigelSpiers
Many of the singers are out of tune. Some of them just a bit out of tune and some of them are total non-singers.
For non-singers the answer is obviously to team up with a good singer.
For the others the answer may be:
1. Before posting on the forum send your song to a friend/family member who you know has a "good ear" and most importantly is prepared to give you an honest assessment of your performance. They don't have to love the song - no the key point is they must tell you where it needs improvement. Only in this way can you improve the quality of your songs.
2. Pitch Correction. I don't use this myself but I do use it on other artists' voices whom I have recorded or mixed. If used sparingly and musically then it can definitely improve a performance and a song significantly.
I think it can also act as a great vocal learning tool.
I don't think anyone posting music here wants to sing out of tune. In some cases, they may not even be aware of it, and in others, they may not know what to do about it.
Nigel's first suggestion isn't to apply Melodyne to a song - it's to have someone with good ears have a listen to it before it's posted.
Here's my anecdote. The other week, I was cantoring at church, and there were parts that felt pitchy. I asked someone who I know has good ears about that it, and he he didn't hear any issues. However, the service was recorded, and the tape didn't lie - it was not good. Listening to the performance was painful... and extremely helpful. I went back to the guy and told him in the future I needed him to be brutally honest, not polite.
Nigel's second suggestion - about pitch correction - has the caveats that it be used "sparingly and musically". That is, correction should only be applied where it's needed. And if it's not needed, not applied at all.
Finally, Nigel says that pitch correction can be used as a learning tool, even if you end up not using it. Others on the thread agree to the same point.
Nowhere do I see anyone arguing that every song needs to have Melodyne on it. Because guess who else doesn't use Melodyne? Nigel, the person who started the thread.
I don't understand why you feel the need to set up these straw man arguments.
And if you think I'm suggesting everyone should use pitch correction, did you notice my signature line?
I can see there are some opposite opinions going on here in this thread, as to whether a singer should be performing a song in an in-tune manner, or an out-of-tune manner.
For this topic, I will stay political neutral.
Quote:
Originally Posted By: NigelSpiers "I contribute songs to the "User Showcase" forum on this site and I also listen to all the other songs on that forum. Many of the singers are out of tune. Some of them just a bit out of tune and some of them are total non-singers."
This is a harsh comment. Although I agree with NigelSpiers, I don't think if I would ever have the courage to speak out like this. Honesty is not always a good thing. Telling a singer he is out of tune can be just as sensitive as saying he is untalented.
Quote:
"...to sing out of tune. In some cases, they may not even be aware of it, and in others, they may not know what to do about it."
If a singer's vocal performance is way out of tune, in most cases the audience would just stop listening, and never come back, without the need of hurting the singer's feelings. I don't think the modern audience would stand up, boo the singer, write a negative comment, before they walk out in anger. People don't do that anymore.
Quote:
"Listening to the performance was painful... in the future I needed him to be brutally honest, not polite."
Not sure if this will be labeled as political incorrect. To many people, diversity and inclusion are more important than the quality of their music.
A Canadian music producer, singer songwriter, composer, and professional guitarist.
"To many people, diversity and inclusion are more important than the quality of their music." WHAT?
Paul McCartney - FACT - he'd go back in after ensuring everyone else headed home after a The Beatles session and redo his parts until they were perfect so that he could be whatever it was he wanted to be. OPINION - He was a passive aggressive control freak. Talented though. Ending up writing drivel without someone to directly compete with.
One must establish a rapport that makes it clear what expectations are with someone from whom you want frank assessments.
The User Showcase forum isn't an "audience" in the public performance sense. Generally one has to make it clear that constructive criticism of a piece is welcome.
Nigel may"...listen to all the other songs on that forum." but he only comments on a few & generally visits daily to bump his current track with a thank you which is fine by me. He did start out on the forum being frank, & fearless in his comments but ruffled a few feathers and, honestly, was off the mark on the odd one so has taken a different approach.
I visit almost daily, listen & comment on most songs BUT I don't comment on those who've chosen not to comment on mine for a year or so. There are a few on my ignore list for a variety of reasons. If the singing is pitchy, sibilant, strident in certain freqs I'll mention it BUT if I've mentioned in the past and the poster has made it clear that they don't care about these things or don't care for such commentary I demure choosing to comment on improvements or other aspects.
It's not politically correct to consider people's feelings, address their needs or put their work in context. It's woke though. Woke in the correct sense as opposed to a common label for all things disliked by a demographic.
Cheers rayc "What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
LOL...David, I think I saw an advertisement on Sweetwater for a David Snyder AI VST.
I was going to buy it but the fine print indicated that there was no guarantee of perfect pitch control. Sadly, I decided not to get the David Snyder AI VST because I was so fearful of being disparaged here on the forum for posting something that was not perfectly in tune.
Oh, and by the way, please be careful about what you say about "AI girl Natalie." I have been told, she is very sensitive and prone to self-harm. She had a very difficult childhood and is terribly unsure of how to identify. So if you don't mind, just call her Natalie.
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig? “Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
Not sure if this will be labeled as political incorrect. To many people, diversity and inclusion are more important than the quality of their music.
Who are these "many people" you are referring to?
If you're referring to this forum, it's a special case for people who use the software. There's no minimum skill level required for entry, so the quality is going to be all over the map. On this forum, inclusion is more important than the quality of the music.
But outside of this forum, I don't see any evidence that's the case. And the marketplace certainly doesn't support the claim.
Oh, and by the way, please be careful about what you say about "AI girl Natalie." I have been told, she is very sensitive and prone to self-harm. She had a very difficult childhood and is terribly unsure of how to identify. So if you don't mind, just call her Natalie. Billy
She cried all night, but she's better now. But she is still unsure what she is...
Originally Posted By: dcuny
On this forum, inclusion is more important than the quality of the music.
^^THIS^^ Even my (cough, cough) pop music is accepted!
You are right - I did start by honestly critiquing every song but yes I quickly learnt that this is not what the User Showcase forum is for.
So I do listen to every song but by and large I now only comment on the songs in genres that I know something about i.e. Blues, Swing, R&B (Rhythm & Blues), Soul & Rock N Roll.
I never tell someone they are singing out of tune.
If I really like the song I may suggest a few quick items that could make the song even better.
Best Regards Nigel
Nigel Spiers Christchurch, New Zealand info@nzacoustics.com
I can see some people were disagreeing with my statement of "diversity and inclusion" on poor singers.
OK. Let me rephrase.
As listeners, when we discover a singer has an unpleasant, unprofessional, and cringey vocal, we are not supposed to hurt his feelings by telling him he is out of tune. Starting a mostly peaceful protest, also known as sharing a constructive criticism in the forum, is not always appreciated and considered political correct. Instead, what we should do, is simply skip this singer without saying anything, and move on to the next one.
In this way, not only the singer can continue to enjoy uploading his songs without knowing he is out of tune, but also the listeners can continue to enjoy other people's songs with better vocals. It is a win-win deal, isn't it?
A Canadian music producer, singer songwriter, composer, and professional guitarist.
My impression of the showcase here is that it is for the enjoyment of BIAB customers who wish to share what they've created using the software in a supportive and friendly forum. As far as I can tell the showcase is NOT a place like TAXI where you can receive actual critiques from vetted/qualified industry professionals. Not to say there aren't pros here but in this showcase anyone can post and anyone can critique (whether they are qualified to do so or not!)
My advice would be to NOT offer critiques unless they are specifically requested. Be supportive and find something nice to say instead.
Regarding the whole autotune conversation I'd say use it if you want and don't use it if you don't want to! There is no "correct" answer. If you like the result then do it!
I can see some people were disagreeing with my statement of "diversity and inclusion" on poor singers.
OK. Let me rephrase.
As listeners, when we discover a singer has an unpleasant, unprofessional, and cringey vocal, we are not supposed to hurt his feelings by telling him he is out of tune. Starting a mostly peaceful protest, also known as sharing a constructive criticism in the forum, is not always appreciated and considered political correct. Instead, what we should do, is simply skip this singer without saying anything, and move on to the next one.
In this way, not only the singer can continue to enjoy uploading his songs without knowing he is out of tune, but also the listeners can continue to enjoy other people's songs with better vocals. It is a win-win deal, isn't it?
It's a good starting point for people who are new to the forum
I always ask for feedback, good or bad, because I'm here to improve. There are some damn good ears here. And I can handle negative feedback, whether it's objective or someone just doesn't like my style of music.
When I comment on other people's music, it depends on the person, some can handle criticism very well, others not, some I just don't know well enough. But in any case I am always polite and write constructive feedback.
And my last point: you can't make blanket judgments for everyone. If someone is a great singer, songwriter, producer and whatnot, I address small nits (if there are any). If someone is a beginner or just less talented, I address things that are achievable for that person.
And lastly, I always try to find something good in a song or performance, there's (almost) always something to like about a song, and I want to encourage people to write more music. Even the worst song is better than no song at all. It's all about the music!
I heard Sir Paul in concert a few months ago. All those decades of screaming and smoking have caught up with him to the point where his intonation is in Willie Nelson territory.
Ya know what? It didn’t matter one bit. He was great and everyone had a good time.
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac 24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
Not a straw man argument. Not even an argument, just observations.
People use that straw man thing a lot I guess because it sounds good, but look it up and see what it means. I don't think it means what you think it means.
Will address others in a blanket response.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
Yes there have been some interesting notions expressed here.
My main goal as the OP was to throw out some observations.
1.) As I understand it, the Showcase is a place to experiment and throw out ideas and even working tapes as SONGWRITERS. I never expected this to be a place for final productions.
I do not post final productions here, ever. I showcase works in progress as a user of the PG products, for feedback, from other songwriters I respect.
2.) A final production of an in-tune vocal of a complete piece of crap is still a professionally tuned piece of crap.
3.) If I were a customer, I could possibly be more alarmed by the presence of a song called: "Smell My Dirty Sweet Little Japanese Socks: An Orgiastic Opera" than I would be by a lack of autotune. That might lead, in fact, to the great depression.
4.) Whenever someone bellows that they know everything about a professional mix but have nothing to show for it I can also almost guarantee with 100% accuracy that what they will post will be the worst thing you have ever heard and that you will want to stick pencils in your ears so you will never have to hear any sound ever again as long as you live.
4.5) The people who seem to say "this is nowhere near to being a professional mix" are always missing two major points:
A.) That is not why I post here, or many others I assume.
B.) They themselves probably have a greater chance of having Jesus fly down and personally escort them to their right-hand seat in the Kingdom than they have of ever producing a professional sounding song themselves.
5.) A song has a LOT more to it than the proper choice of a VST and an AI vocalist to go with an AI lyric (or a lyric that sounds like one.)
6.) Real songwriters know exactly what #5 means and people who will never write a good song will always have no clue.
7.) I enjoy the opportunity to hear what EVERYONE is doing because raw creativity always sparks something in me, and makes me more creative, whether it is perfect pitch or not.
8.) Anyone can grab a jazz demo and sing a four note perfectly tuned melody to it. But does anyone care? Still, they are welcome, as everyone is. They should just be the most careful of all with Glass House Syndrome.
9.) I have a great deal of fondness for 99.9999% of the people I have met here, but there are a few who really need to get a life.
10.) The real world is looking for great songs, sung with feeling. That takes talent. And that you cannot buy.
But, you can gain friendship by being gracious towards others and having a realistic outlook on your own abilities.
That is what I was saying, and it was not a straw man argument, just a few thoughts on "Let's Get Real."
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
Not a straw man argument. Not even an argument, just observations. People use that straw man thing a lot I guess because it sounds good, but look it up and see what it means. I don't think it means what you think it means. Will address others in a blanket response.
It's quite a pity that so many wonderful terms and labels are mislabelled & "mistermed". It's often the same with quotations. We had a crown minister who, in 1971, quoted what he believed to be Shakespeare in a deliberately misleading way. There was outrage & protest after he proposed cuts to welfare & essential services to which he responded: "Life wasn't meant to be easy..." This from a chap born wealthy. He, naturally, left it incomplete:"Life wasn't meant to be easy, my child, but take courage: it can be delightful!" It was, of course, George Bernard Shaw's little piece of advice. The misuse and his intentions for it haunted him for the rest of his political life and beyond.
Last edited by rayc; 03/22/2306:22 PM.
Cheers rayc "What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
Not a straw man argument. Not even an argument, just observations.
People use that straw man thing a lot I guess because it sounds good, but look it up and see what it means. I don't think it means what you think it means.
Definitions:
A straw man argument is the logical fallacy of distorting an opposing position into an extreme version of itself and then arguing against that extreme version. (Link)
Often this fallacy involves putting words into somebody's mouth by saying they've made arguments they haven't actually made, in which case the straw man argument is a veiled version of argumentum ad logicam. (Link)
You started this thread by writing:
Originally Posted By: David Snyder
So, in line with the recent discussions on pitch correction in another thread...
I did not use Melodyne.
I just stepped up to a mic and sang it with my heart.
You implied that the notion of singing without Melodyne and singing from your heart is somehow counter to what people in the pitch correction thread said.
But nowhere did anyone suggest that you should never sing without Melodyne. Nigel, who started the thread, doesn't use Melodyne on himself.
And no one has suggested that you shouldn't sing from your heart, or that vocal delivery isn't important.
Similarly, you wrote:
Originally Posted By: David Snider
1.) Your vocal can't possibly work so I guess you'll have to use that AI girl Natalie...
2.) Why don't you just join the crowd and mind your manners, and sing some faux jazz...
"Hey I know I am wearing an avatar mask..."
These "observations" are not accurate representative of what people on this forum have said.
You also wrote:
Originally Posted By: David Snider
These are things a VST cannot touch. To dwell on them at the expense of all else it simply nuts
I'm not seeing anyone who's suggested people should use a VST "at the expense of all else."
That's why I used the term "straw man". I'm looking to see who these people are that are disagreeing with you and... not really finding them.
I assume this thread was something David Snyder started to talk about about the issues around pitch correction software. His personal likes and dislikes.
So...David Snyder, congrats on receiving positive feedback on your vocals.
I seriously doubt anyone here will start using or stop using pitch correction software as a function of anything anyone here has to say.
Pitch correction is very much in use in today's music.
Vocals without pitch correction are also in use in today's music.
What this thread has turned into is a bunch of continuous conversations relating to the agreement and nonagreement on what Nigel posted on another thread. Then we devolve into English 101...lol
So...Let me state my position in no uncertain terms.
I will post things here without pitch correction. I will post things here with pitch corrections. I will sing things myself that indeed can be considered very unprofessional vocals. I will, at times, employ a professional studio vocalist to sing for me. I will, at times, use AI singers. I not be offended by people commenting on the quality of anything I post.
I have to assume that Nigel made his original post in good faith with the good intentions of being helpful. My initial impression was not positive, and I said so in the other thread. I have gone back a reread the thread several times. I stand by what I said.
If I have been remiss in accurately understanding anyone's lofty position in the music world, please post your Grammy nominations and photos of your gold records. Well, your duets with Willie Nelson and Paul McCartney will suffice...lol
Billy
“Amazing! I’ll be working with Jaco Pastorius, Charlie Parker, Art Tatum, and Buddy Rich, and you’re telling me it’s not that great of a gig? “Well…” Saint Peter, hesitated, “God’s got this girlfriend who thinks she can sing…”
But I am missing something because I am so far less clever.
Where do you see me mentioning the other thread in this quote, and where do you see me even mention the PG Forum in general?
My Strawman companion desperately wants to know. Also, I believe my opening sentence said I was "in line with" another conversation on pitch correction, but then went on to say I wanted to talk about other things. But for the things YOU are mentioning, they are here. Do you see BIAB forums being mentioned?
My poor straw man is weeping straw tears and I do so want him to stop. I am swearing to him that no argument has been made. I was being somewhat silly, but I assume that is allowed even if the Straw Man has not given me his permission, right?
Originally Posted By: David Snyder
Ray,
I think why I posted this is because I feel there is SO MUCH that goes into a vocal performance that is never really covered on MANY forums out there and all around the world: a lot of stuff about plugins and technology and other things, which always kind of lead to one of two places.
1.) Your vocal can't possibly work so I guess you'll have to use that AI girl Natalie like everyone else and sound like everyone else because we have now moved into a one voice world. Real voices not allowed.
2.) Why don't you just join the crowd and mind your manners, and sing some faux jazz or the 12 bar blues with a three note melody: or else go hide in a closet. Because I said so. And I should know. Although you have never heard of me.
Uh........no thanks.
Oh, I forgot the 3rd staple of Internet forums (and this one is almost sacred):
"Hey I know I am wearing an avatar mask from a Japanese video game and have the stupidest user name ever invented and no one has ever heard of me, and I really have never actually done anything, but unless everyone on the forum does what I say you will never ever make it in the real world. Trust me, I know. How I know, well, I can't say, but just trust me."
So....
No.
There is A LOT that goes into a vocal that has nothing to do with VSTs and editing.
Yet, as an FYI, there HAVE BEEN numerous comments on numerous threads here that I remember which have said that you simply cannot do a professional mix in a professional world without pitch correction.
And youtubes have been posted with engineers saying so.
And there have been quite a number of people saying in different places over time that if you do only Melodyne will do, and it cannot be Melodyne assistant, it has to be Melodyne advanced, and you have to spend all day.
These are just facts. I have read them, not all in one place, but scattered all over, throughout the years.
Again, these are not straw man arguments, these are facts.
And I simply said, in essence, and clarified it to make sure that I was making this transparent: I would like to discuss a few other things.
And that is a fact.
And a fact, sir, is not a Straw Man argument.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
[/b]Re: Vocal Delivery_Nashville Has Spoken[b] If I have been remiss in accurately understanding anyone's lofty position in the music world, please post your Grammy nominations and photos of your gold records. Well, your duets with Willie Nelson and Paul McCartney will suffice...lol
Billy, The above does a disservice to everything else in your post.
Cheers rayc "What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
I said I thought you were referring to the pitch correction thread. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
Why didn't you choose to first correct that misunderstanding, instead of suggesting that I don't know what a straw man argument was?
Quote:
Do you see BIAB forums being mentioned?
See? You weren't referring to BiaB forums. No room for misinterpretation there!
Quote:
Yet, there HAVE BEEN numerous comments on numerous threads here that I remember which have said that you simply cannot do a professional mix in a professional world without pitch correction.
So while you definitely weren't referring to BiaB forums... if you had been, you would have been 100% right to do so.
But you weren't referring to BiaB forums. Except for that one place where you did, but that doesn't count.
Quote:
These are just facts. I have read them, not all in one place, but scattered all over, throughout the years.
Obligatory xkcd link:
Quote:
I think why I posted this is because I feel there is SO MUCH that goes into a vocal performance that is never really covered on MANY forums out there and all around the world...
As I said before, I'm not seeing anyone disagreeing with this. Myself included.
I was never under the understanding that you necessarily had to make sense on a forum post.
I was under the distinct impression that not making any sense was the name of the game. And what good Straw Man among us would strive to make sense? It would defy our very nature, which is to all be straw men, every man jack among us.
And in that sense we are both straw men, David Cuny, and we are not so different, you and I, fighting and flapping our arms of straw into a wind of insanity that is sure to bring us down into the wretched pit where so many here have gone to rot and fester.
I shall strive to make a better man of myself and walk away from the tomfoolery, if only for a day.
Good night sir.
David Snyder Songwriter/Renaissance Man Studio + Fingers
[/b]Re: Vocal Delivery_Nashville Has Spoken[b] If I have been remiss in accurately understanding anyone's lofty position in the music world, please post your Grammy nominations and photos of your gold records. Well, your duets with Willie Nelson and Paul McCartney will suffice...lol
Billy, The above does a disservice to everything else in your post.
Infinitely more polite than my reaction to that crap. My hat’s off.
BIAB 2025 Audiophile Mac 24Core/60CoreGPU M2 MacStudioUltra/8TB/192GB Sequoia, M1 MBAir, 2012 MBP Digital Performer11, LogicPro, Finale27/Dorico/Encore/SmartScorePro64/Notion6 /Overture5
Tsk, tsk. You come in like the old schoolmarm and take all the fun out of it.
I had to look up what "schoolmarm" meant. The pictures of the stone tablets the definition was etched on brought me up to speed. Now I must insist that you take that back!
Chad (Hope that makes it easier)
TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
"schoolma'am"!!! What does that make me? I'm either a class despot, school yard Simon Legree or a chalky nitpicker according to my own logic, history, proclivities and typing skills. I suspect I need a deafinition to hear what you're saying.
Cheers rayc "What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® users: Build 904 now available!
If you're already using Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, make sure to grab the latest update! Build 904 is now available for download and includes the newest additions and enhancements from our team.
PowerTracks 2026 is here—bringing powerful new enhancements designed to make your production workflow faster, smoother, and more intuitive than ever.
The enhanced Mixer now shows Track Type and Instrument icons for instant track recognition, while a new grid option simplifies editing views. Non-floating windows adopt a modern title bar style, replacing the legacy blue bar.
The Master Volume is now applied at the end of the audio chain for consistent levels and full-signal master effects.
Tablature now includes a “Save bends when saving XML” option for improved compatibility with PG Music tools. Plus, you can instantly match all track heights with a simple Ctrl-release after resizing, and Add2 chords from MGU/SGU files are now fully supported... and more!
Get started today—first-time packages start at just $49.
Already using PowerTracks Pro Audio? Upgrade for as little as $29 and enjoy the latest improvements!
Band-in-a-Box 2026 for Windows Special Offers End Tomorrow (January 15th, 2026) at 11:59 PM PST!
Time really is running out! Save up to 50% on Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® upgrades and receive a FREE Bonus PAK—only when you order by 11:59 PM PST on Thursday, January 15, 2026!
We've added many major new features and new content in a redesigned Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®!
Version 2026 introduces a modernized GUI redesign across the program, with updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, and a new Dark Mode option. There’s also a new side toolbar for quicker access to commonly used windows, and the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, making it easier to customize your workspace.
Another exciting new addition is the new AI-Notes feature, which can transcribe polyphonic audio into MIDI. You can view the results in notation or play them back as MIDI, and choose whether to process an entire track or focus on specific parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
Upgrade your Band-in-a-Box for Windows to save up to 50% on most Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade packages!
Plus, when you order your Band-in-a-Box® 2026 upgrade during our special, you'll receive a Free Bonus PAK of exciting new add-ons.
If you need any help deciding which package is the best option for you, just let us know. We are here to help!
Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® Special Offers Extended Until January 15, 2026!
Good news! You still have time to upgrade to the latest version of Band-in-a-Box® for Windows® and save. Our Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® special now runs through January 15, 2025!
We've packed Band-in-a-Box® 2026 with major new features, enhancements, and an incredible lineup of new content! The program now sports a sleek, modern GUI redesign across the entire interface, including updated toolbars, refreshed windows, smoother workflows, a new dark mode option, and more. The brand-new side toolbar provides quicker access to key windows, while the new Multi-View feature lets you arrange multiple windows as layered panels without overlap, creating a flexible, clutter-free workspace. We have an amazing new “AI-Notes” feature. This transcribes polyphonic audio into MIDI so you can view it in notation or play it back as MIDI. You can process an entire track (all pitched instruments and drums) or focus on individual parts like drums, bass, guitars/piano, or vocals. There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
There are over 100 new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows®.
When you order purchase Band-in-a-Box® 2026 before 11:59 PM PST on January 15th, you'll also receive a Free Bonus PAK packed with exciting new add-ons.
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows® today! Check out the Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.
One of our representatives will be happy to help you over the phone. Our hours of operation are from
6:00AM to 6:00PM PST (GMT -8) Monday thru Friday, and 8:00AM to 4:00PM PST Saturday. We are closed Sunday. You can also send us your questions via email.
One of our representatives will be happy to help you on our Live Chat or by email. Our hours of operation are from
6:00AM to 6:00PM PST (GMT -8) Monday thru Friday; 8:00AM to 4:00PM PST (GMT -8) Saturday; Closed Sunday.
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean