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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
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OP
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163 |
I am so frustrated with the BIAB Import Audio/Stem splitter process. I have been working diligently on developing a consistent import, bar setting and splitting technique and have met with nothing but inconsistency in behavior despite rigorous testing and work flow development with tremendous help from this community. I have been at this for a year now with every song I try giving different results and often failure. This is not about just splitting. It is about the manipulation of an imported audio file as noted below.
As far as I can tell the process of importation of an outside MP3 and bar setting is erratic at best. Tonight trying to equalize tempo even crashed the program several times. The chord analysis is often way off. I just cannot take this any more. It is my firm belief that this process is not ironed out sufficiently and is way to hard to understand even after working with it now for the better part of a year and I am usually very software adept.
The splitting of the stems on an imported file seems to work just fine like all the other options out there such as Moises, lalal.ai, Song Master Pro etc. But the bar alignment, tempo setting, chord analysis, attempting to align a track with the BIAB 2 bar drum count-in, etc. just seems like a disaster to me. I am very disappointed in that I upgraded last year for this specific functionality. I just need to stop this incredible time sink and get back to my music. I will most likely just split a track in BIAB and export the stems where I can use them elsewhere or just use some a simpler app for the splits and be done with it.
I have realized that sometimes a process that seems to have great process may just not be clear enough or reliable enough to not cause more frustration and lost time than it is worth for me.
I am not posting this as a rant, but rather many of you have helped with working out of a work flow and I have been so grateful for your help. What a great community. My purpose is to update you on my progress and perhaps let others know that this process of importation and manipulation before splitting may be frustrating and very hard to understand. Progress update and communication is all that I am up to here. And gratitude. Cheers.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,723
Expert
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Expert
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,723 |
God knows you really hung in there, and that deserves respect. Your frustration is all the more understandable because you really pushed the process to its limits with method and patience — far beyond what many users would do.
BIAB is primarily a superb arrangement generator, unique in its kind. But added features like audio import, stem separation, chord analysis, and tempo adjustment often remain unstable or incomplete, as confirmed by many in the community. These peripheral tools often need to be complemented by more reliable specialized software.
The best approach is usually to harness BIAB’s strength for generating great arrangements, then rely on other dedicated apps for fine audio manipulation, stem splitting, or precise tempo adjustments. This avoids frustration and keeps the focus on making music.
So you have not wasted your time; on the contrary, your persistence has made very clear where the software’s real strengths and limitations lie today, which is valuable for optimizing your creativity and workflow.
Biab Audiophile 2025 11.28 Win
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 474
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 474 |
I fully agree, that is why I don’t use the stem splitter, tempo mapper, or chord analyzer in BIAB at all anymore.
These functions seems to work fine in other applications like SongMaster Pro and Studio One Pro etc, with a simple and consistent process, basically just drop the file SMP and for SO add one click and it is all done with good accuracy. It is hard to understand why something similar could not be developed for BIAB. I think BIAB need to look at how it is done in other software just to get the entry point for users expectations on usability at the right level and then improve their own version even further (if they should have it at all).
BIAB 2025, Studio One 7 Pro, Song Master Pro, Win11 Home. i7-9700K CPU, 32GB, ESI MAYA44eX, Guitar Pro 8, Transcribe, (EZKeys2, EZD3, SD3, EZBass, EZMix3)
Amateur: fiddle, guitar, vocal, beginner on bass.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,715
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FWIW - I believe that BiaB should get back to basics. That is keep being one of the best backing track arrangers and stop messing around with all of the peripheral stuff. For those whom want to do everything in BiaB I say use RB. If there are things in BiaB that RB can't do push PGM to incorporate them into RB. I know this may not be popular but it is how I feel. YMMV
I'm no longer allowed to go caroling at the psych hospital.
I guess Do You Hear What I Hear was a bad song choice!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,527
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Mario i whole heartedly agree!!! 1000% I have said for years that BiaB needs to focus on what it does best. and not try to be a swiss army knife. Midi and Audio track generation. Keep refining the process fix old bugs and retune existing processes. Solidify current things not totally completed.
As far as RB goes it has made some very nice progress in the last three years. With a little bit of effort many of these more complicated things could live there and not clutter BiaB.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
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Joined: Dec 2024
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MoultiPass, Thank you so much for this reply. I was so worried that my post would be received as an ungrateful rant, but I really just wanted to express my experience and also thank the community for its support. Your reply put my mind at ease and I actually found it quite soothing. Thank you for that.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
Apprentice
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Joined: Dec 2024
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Thank you shlind, MarioD, and Rob. Your comments were so appreciated.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,527
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We all fall into an angry rant on occasions. Mine usually goes along with a misplaced set of keys or something equally egregious! I truly understand your frustration I have my share as well. Seems the direction of the BiaB system is somewhat brilliant and somewhat not so. While many blame PGM I see it as “be careful of what you wish for” syndrome. People have been begging for more and more complex things some might have been better done elsewhere.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
Apprentice
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OP
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Thanks so much. I really was not angry; just frustrated and a feeling of being thwarted in my intention to make a perfect transcribed and split track. I am now exploring SMP (Song Master Pro) once again. That program is just super easy to use. The only problem I found with it last time around was the difficulty changing the chord designations when they were clearly wrong. Editing the chords seemed very bizarre or not even possible at time due to lack of right click editing controls. BUT, I am going to revisit that. A quick drag and drop split last night went so fast and the speed and looping controls were instant as was tempo, bar lines etc. Twill be a new adventure. Oy! 
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,801
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FWIW - I believe that BiaB should get back to basics. That is keep being one of the best backing track arrangers and stop messing around with all of the peripheral stuff. I have said for years that BiaB needs to focus on what it does best. and not try to be a swiss army knife. Midi and Audio track generation. Keep refining the process fix old bugs and retune existing processes. Solidify current things not totally completed. I agree 100% with both of you that BIAB should focus on its strengths. I really wish PGM would stop the annual gluing on of partially implemented and often buggy features. Anyone remember VideoTracks? Dunno who asked for that or ever used it! Or how about UserTracks? A great idea never fully realized. Recently its "AI-powered...BB Stem Splitter". I've never even bothered to try it. "AI Lyrics Generator"? No thanks. There are far better free options online that drastically improve on a daily basis instead of waiting a year for possible improvements. But I don't see anything changing. PGM seem stuck in an old marketing strategy that believes shiny "50 NEW FEATURES" stickers are the way to sell stuff. And maybe they are right for their market. If the PGM forum is any indication we are an elderly demographic from a different era. But if this is true, that spells trouble for PGM's future because we are not getting any younger over here! To summarize, I have a few suggestions for PGM. 1) Focus on a handful of significant improvements such as the ability to regenerate bar-by-bar. That was an amazing game changing feature! A grand slam homerun feature! Something BIAB needed dearly and you delivered big time! 2) Resist the urge to add complex new features like stem splitters that are already being adequately provided in the markeplace and are likely beyond your core skillset to design and produce fully. 3) Resist the urge to add superfluous features like song title generators and AI lyrics generators. If stuff like that is already being done quite well (and they are!) then skip them! 4) Stop adding features that are not at least as good and bug-free as what is already on the market. If you can't do it at least as well, and preferably better, then don't do it! We all use Windows or Mac and having a feature inside BIAB is often just not that important or even beneficial. 5) Watch companies like Native and Toontrack to see how they upgrade and market their products. New versions should be something exciting and offer real value. Not just 50 new features I really don't want or need. 6) Stop listening to all of us (including me) in the forums! We don't know what your core competencies are. We don't know what your market wants. And just because I pop into the wishlist forum with a weird request that a) benefits myself and maybe 1 other person and b) you realize it would be easy to implement and c) it adds to the 50 new feature count, is no reason to implement it! Just say no! 7) And finally, keep doing what you excel at...RealTracks! Add more variety. Implement ideas like RealTrack sets that just go together nicely. More multi-styles. More modern stuff. Keep your focus on RealTracks! That is where you shine. BIAB is the only tool I use on almost every song! And RealTracks are the magic!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
Apprentice
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I found that reply very interesting. I have to admit that the ONLY reason I bought BIAB in the first place was RealTracks. The sonic quality of this just beat the pants off any other options out there and it seemed to matter to me that the sonic quality of the instruments sounded real. So it was worth it for me to buy in so as to replace all the available MIDI generating chord and chord sheet makers/players. I LOVE that quality. The sounds excite me!
But I have to admit that all the other stuff and the astoundingly antiquated UI and really weird features have just not worked for me. For instance the ability to transcribe a melody with its very odd (to me) controls is just a no-starter compared to professional notation software (I use guitar Pro). I too will keep using the program to make quick customized real sounding practice tracks. YES REALTRACKS ARE AWESOME!!! But I will start using other tools to do other manipulations and stop trying to make BIAB my music Swiss Army Knife. I think this will reduce my stress significantly.
Last edited by Moonbeam9067; 13 hours ago.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,801
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,801 |
YES REALTRACKS ARE AWESOME!!! But I will start using other tools to do other manipulations and stop trying to make BIAB my music Swiss Army Knife. I think this will reduce my stress significantly. I first bought the program in 2012 and it completely changed my songwriting trajectory! I was paying for session musicians and only able to afford to do one or two songs here and there. But with BIAB I was able to give a decent production to any and all songs and that really helps to see their potential! I have upgraded every year religiously to get access to the new RealTracks. And I have mostly avoided the new features they tack on every year, sometimes frustrated to have to trudge through the bug fixes of these new superfluous features to get everything working properly again. The only only feature I can recall that I really benefited from is when they added the ability to generate bar-by-bar (arguably a "feature" that should have been there from the beginning of RealTracks!) Everything else I mostly try and ignore. My workflow in BIAB is get in, set key and chords, choose RealTracks & (re)generate them, export tracks to my DAW and get out of BIAB as quickly as possible. Unlike other music software it just is not that pleasant to use. You mentioned the UI and I agree although they did improve it a little a few years back from the Windows 95 look and feel! But they only updated the main window; as soon as you start clicking on options and dialogs it feels like a bad trip down Windows 3.1 memory lane! RealTracks are awesome! Get in and out ASAP and you'll be very productive with BIAB!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
Apprentice
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Apprentice
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Really found your comments interesting and helpful!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,527
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I don’t mind the lyrics generator. It is just a Chat GPT thingy. Fine use it or not. If you want to add AI focus on something musical. Last year they toyed with a song structure tool that would help those without deep musical theory skills. It never happened maybe it was just not possible yet. Great but in the end not necessary stem splitter nice but there are better ones out there.
JJJ you nailed it focus on RTs and maybe even newer and better algorithms for them. More types and less cluttered or maybe less busy tracks.
Last edited by Rob Helms; 11 hours ago.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2025, Realband, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 9 32c , Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,715
Veteran
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Veteran
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Posts: 23,715 |
............................
JJJ you nailed it focus on RTs and maybe even newer and better algorithms for them. More types and less cluttered or maybe less busy tracks. I agree that RTs are great but lets not forget about the MIDI side of BiaB. The MIDI side is where I live with BiaB. Although on occasion I will use an RT but most of the time I use the MIDI side of the RT. I much prefer to work in MIDI than in audio but I realize that I am in the minority. YMMV
I'm no longer allowed to go caroling at the psych hospital.
I guess Do You Hear What I Hear was a bad song choice!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163
Apprentice
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OP
Apprentice
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 163 |
............................
JJJ you nailed it focus on RTs and maybe even newer and better algorithms for them. More types and less cluttered or maybe less busy tracks. I agree that RTs are great but lets not forget about the MIDI side of BiaB. The MIDI side is where I live with BiaB. Although on occasion I will use an RT but most of the time I use the MIDI side of the RT. I much prefer to work in MIDI than in audio but I realize that I am in the minority. YMMV Love that Mario. For me I know absolutely nothing about MIDI whatsoever.  LOL. Complete ignorance. Mileage may vary indeed!
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
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Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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