The Real Book Series for Band-in-a-Box is now complete! plus A 50% off sale on another great jazz collection
I'll keep this short and sweet:
1) The sixth and final edition of the world-famous Real Book series is here at last! Over 400 classic to modern Jazz and Jazz pop standards. Check out the songs and the free samples here: https://www.nortonmusic.com/fake53.html - You'll want to add these great songs to your Band-in-a-Box collection.
2) SAVE $22.50 on the great Real European Jazz collection from Sher publishing. Check out the songs and the free samples here: https://www.nortonmusic.com/fake41.html - Over 175 fresh new jazz tunes with a European accent are just waiting for you. We provide the sgu files and Sher provides the book. **** Book review from Lani Stone: GREAT BOOK! Some of Europe's hippest music. Not the "same old, same old." Many of the players are well known, some are new to me. Even if I don't recreate the tunes, the different chord progressions are mind expanding! Tired of the American Standard Songbook? You're going to love this fake book.
Plus, if you buy both, the discount grows to $24.50. And if you want the book, too, there are links to discounted prices on Amazon.
Have you missed any of the other Real Book disks and/or books? Check these out, along with the free samples here:
I just bought your Beatles fakebook disk. Before buying I read your "README first" page https://www.nortonmusic.com/fake.html and saw that "Norton Music Fake Disks contain chord progressions only..." which is what I wanted as that's how I intended to use the SGU files the songs are delivered as - i.e. open in BIAB and try different band styles / instrument substitutions. I purchased, downloaded and in BIAB (2020) I opened "You've got to hide your love away". All the styles were midi styles. I tried changing the guitars to Realtracks. None will play except one of them, for a couple bars in the chorus. Am I doing something wrong? There was nothing on your site I saw that led me to believe these wouldn't work. Love to get this fixed as I'm around $44 lighter. Grateful for a remedy
I'm sure Notes Norton will assist you to resolve this. Send him a PM perhaps, referencing this thread.
BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Windows 10 Pro & Windows 11, Cakewalk Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Session Keys Grand S & Electric R, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M, Pioneer Active Monitors.
I just bought your Beatles fakebook disk. Before buying I read your "README first" page https://www.nortonmusic.com/fake.html and saw that "Norton Music Fake Disks contain chord progressions only..." which is what I wanted as that's how I intended to use the SGU files the songs are delivered as - i.e. open in BIAB and try different band styles / instrument substitutions. I purchased, downloaded and in BIAB (2020) I opened "You've got to hide your love away". All the styles were midi styles. I tried changing the guitars to Realtracks. None will play except one of them, for a couple bars in the chorus. Am I doing something wrong? There was nothing on your site I saw that led me to believe these wouldn't work. Love to get this fixed as I'm around $44 lighter. Grateful for a remedy
Should be possible to pick a few Realtrack guitars that fit the Timing and Rhythm of the song and put those on the Utility Tracks, the Eye icon near the Mixer Patches, click on it and add a few Utility tracks, then pick your Realtrack guitars, you can always mute any tracks in the Norton style that you don't want.
Windows 10 (64bit) M-Audio Fast Track Pro, Band in a Box 2025, Cubase 14, Cakewalk and far too many VST plugins that I probably don't need or will ever use
Thanks for your purchase, and sorry you are having a problem.
Yes, everything is in MIDI. Why? 1) If the style is in MIDI, the BiaB bot will recommend a Real Style 2) But if the style is Real, the BiaB bot will NOT recommend a MIDI style. Therefore, assigning a MIDI style is the only way to get a recommendation for both Real and MIDI.
As for why they aren't playing when changing to Real, that's a mystery.
I just tried it on my copy of BiaB, and they are playing just fine.
What is my thinking? It's a very simple 12 bar blues song, with nothing fancy, no shots, no pushes, no melody, or anything else fancy. It was made/saved in BiaB with one of my MIDI styles, which your computer probably doesn't have, and it should revert to zzjazz.sty. So the only variable would be changing to the default style when loading something with a Norton style.
Let me know if you can change this to a Real Style and if it plays or not.
I have some other ideas, but this would be my first troubleshooting step if it happened on my computer. So let me know and we'll go from there.
Last edited by Notes Norton; 02/28/2606:13 AM. Reason: Typo. I'm TYPO-Man -- writing all wrongs :D
I tried changing the guitars to Realtracks. None will play except one of them, for a couple bars in the chorus.
Notes, he is trying to use a Real Track!
Midi plays fine with new RS, but does not swap the midi for RTs (which it should. right?). When I then try to substitute a single RT for piano, the Piano track after generation is blank.
I understand that lingyai is trying to substitute a real track for a MIDI track.
I see no reason why he cannot, and nobody else has ever reported this problem with any of my fake e-disk sgu files.
I don't have 2020 anymore, and I suspect it might be a bug in his version, but I want to rule out any possibility that it might be my sgu's fault before I involve PG Music. The techs at PG have enough work, so I want to make sure I'm not wasting their time.
If the little test I suggested fails, I have one more test in mind that I think would completely eliminate my work.
On the other hand, if I find out it's something I did, I'll do my best to fix it.
I ran your little test with current 2026 and it does not appear to be working. It is not just your test file, I have other old .sgu midi style files which also have this same issue. Just sayin...
I ran your little test with current 2026 and it does not appear to be working. It is not just your test file, I have other old .sgu midi style files which also have this same issue. Just sayin...
This is very confusing. I just ran your test file. I replaced the MIDI bass and piano tracks with RTs and everything was fine. I also tried an old 2006 SGU and it worked fine there also. I wonder if this is machine and/or RT specific?
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Confusing, yes indeed - this is BIAB after all . I fully agree that are a lot of potential options for configuration issues here. Midi is playing, it plays with a midi style or a real style. What is not playing is audio on a real track when you allow the midi style to auto substitute. Mario, your picutes do not show if there is any Audio on the Audio track which is what the objective is. My picture shows that I placed a RT piano on the piano track and there was no wave in the Tracks view. If I force the style to change to all RTs it works. Its the auto substituion which failes to switch to real tracks.
Confusing, yes indeed - this is BIAB after all . I fully agree that are a lot of potential options for configuration issues here. Midi is playing, it plays with a midi style or a real style. What is not playing is audio on a real track when you allow the midi style to auto substitute. Mario, your picutes do not show if there is any Audio on the Audio track which is what the objective is. My picture shows that I placed a RT piano on the piano track and there was no wave in the Tracks view. If I force the style to change to all RTs it works. Its the auto substituion which failes to switch to real tracks.
I am sure it is something simple here.
Hi Dan, Well I am confused again, probably my age old eyes and brain again! I thought that the OM could not get RTs to play when they replaced MIDI tracks.
Originally Posted by lingyai
.................................... I purchased, downloaded and in BIAB (2020) I opened "You've got to hide your love away". All the styles were midi styles. I tried changing the guitars to Realtracks. None will play except one of them, for a couple bars in the chorus.
In both of my tests the RTs did play and they played exactly what was shown in notation. BUT like you proved the audio tracks so not show in the tracks view. That happened in both of my tests. IMHO that is a major bug.
In another test I set the tempo to 40 BPM and replaced the bass and piano tracks with 140 BPM RTs. They also played but didn't sound so good ( :D) and again with no audio track views. Thus picking the wrong BPM RTs is not the issue.
I think the OP should clarify. Also I hope others try to duplicate the issue(s)
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
In both of my tests the RTs did play and they played exactly what was shown in notation. BUT like you proved the audio tracks do not show in the tracks view. That happened in both of my tests. IMHO that is a major bug.
Ya, but when the tracks do not appear in track view, we are not hearing audio - it is just midi playing at that point. Thanks for helping confirm the issue. .
In both of my tests the RTs did play and they played exactly what was shown in notation. BUT like you proved the audio tracks do not show in the tracks view. That happened in both of my tests. IMHO that is a major bug.
Ya, but when the tracks do not appear in track view, we are not hearing audio - it is just midi playing at that point. Thanks for helping confirm the issue. .
I am not that familiar with this portion of BiaB. I was looking at the Audio Edit view and not the track view. I took an all MIDI style, copied the piano track 2 times, and in the bass track used a Sax RT. In one piano track I used a piano RT and in another track a guitar RT. No RT track showed in the track view. BUT when I hit regenerate the audio tracks showed and they played; see pic. Apparently you must hit regenerate for the audio to show and play. I have the SGU file if you are interested in hearing it.
Would you confirm this?
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Yes, the track view will show a green name for the instrument, but will not show the actual waveform or play the RT until it is "generated". However, it should regenerate automatically with this type of change when you hit run. But otherwise, what ii is doing is anyones guess here. We should not be seeing this discrepancy with substituting a midi style with a style containing RTs or just by replacing a midi track with a RT - This simple function has worked effortlesslly for years as Notes indicated . I will alert the developers about this thread and ask them to help prioritize a fix. Dan
Yes, the track view will show a green name for the instrument, but will not show the actual waveform or play the RT until it is "generated". However, it should regenerate automatically with this type of change when you hit run. But otherwise, what ii is doing is anyones guess here. We should not be seeing this discrepancy with substituting a midi style with a style containing RTs or just by replacing a midi track with a RT - This simple function has worked effortlesslly for years as Notes indicated . I will alert the developers about this thread and ask them to help prioritize a fix. Dan
Yes, I totally agree. Thanx for both alerting the developers and for helping me understand more about BiaB. I've never changes MIDI to RTs before today so this have been an education for me!
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
I just remembered what Notes and the OP said, "... I purchased, downloaded and in BIAB (2020)". Makes me nervious that our assumption that there is a problem with current 2026 may be missing something yet. Nevertheless, the developers have been alerted.
I just remembered what Notes and the OP said, "... I purchased, downloaded and in BIAB (2020)". Makes me nervious that our assumption that there is a problem with current 2026 may be missing something yet. Nevertheless, the developers have been alerted.
It would be really nice if someone who has replaced a MIDI track with a RT in previous versions of BiaB would chime in, however maybe that person doesn't exist.
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Well, 10+ years ago, when I was a hardcore jazzer, I did this hundreds of times. Am obviously a bit rusty, but when I just tried to convert a MIDI jazz track to a RealStyle, it worked like I remembered: The MIDI backing instruments are replaced by RealTracks and the MIDI melody, if present, is preserved as MIDI. There ARE some weird volume disparity issues that I can't explain, but I'm using a different VSTi now than I was then, too, so that might be related...
Please ignore this if not helpful.
DC Ron BiaB Audiophile Presonus Studio One ASUS I9-12900K DAW, 32 GB RAM Presonus Faderport 16 Too many guitars (is that a thing?)
Thanks, DrDan for alerting the developers and to Ron, Mario, and others for helping.
I wish the OP would rejoin the conversation, as it might help with his personal situation.
I'm not much of a RealTrack guy, I prefer the editability of the MIDI tracks. I just check to see that they are working with my efforts.
With MIDI I can export to a sequencer/DAW and change instruments, chord inversions, drum kits, drum instruments (for example, rimshot to clave), individual notes, and so on. Plus I can make my own intros/endings, change the groove, add song-specific figures and/or kicks, eliminate/change/remove drum rolls, and so much more.
For me, expression is much more important than tone, and I can manipulate MIDI files to get more or more personal expression out of the music.
OK, lets try one more time. First do a return to factory settings (always first thing when BIAB does not do what it is supposed to do), Then set configurations in the following two screens. I think that is what the OP is looking for and I think it now works (for the most part) .
I can get it almost fully working with the selections I show below, (i.e., replace midi style with Real Style and/or just replace individual midi tracks with real tracks), but I still see things which just don't seem correct! some substituted RTs are blank and I don't know why (Bob, are you doing something unque to that piano track in your midi?). Let the buyer beware.
I'm not much of a RealTrack guy, I prefer the editability of the MIDI tracks. I just check to see that they are working with my efforts.
With MIDI I can export to a sequencer/DAW and change instruments, chord inversions, drum kits, drum instruments (for example, rimshot to clave), individual notes, and so on. Plus I can make my own intros/endings, change the groove, add song-specific figures and/or kicks, eliminate/change/remove drum rolls, and so much more.
For me, expression is much more important than tone, and I can manipulate MIDI files to get more or more personal expression out of the music.
That is exactly why I do most all of my work in MIDI. Occasionally I will use an RT or RD but 99.99% of my work is in MIDI.
Originally Posted by Notes Norton
But then, I like editing, not everybody does.
Same here. I much prefer MIDI editing over audio editing.
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
<< It would be really nice if someone who has replaced a MIDI track with a RT in previous versions of BiaB would chime in, however maybe that person doesn't exist. >>
I've done this for years and using Note's test, RealTracks performed normally on my system.
<< In both of my tests the RTs did play and they played exactly what was shown in notation. BUT like you proved the audio tracks so not show in the tracks view. That happened in both of my tests. IMHO that is a major bug. >>
This is correct, but not quite. The RT's play but not the original imported midi data. The RT does not read and sound the imported midi. Generating the RT creates new midi data and that is what's being played and displayed in notation or the piano roll. The audio and midi is new midi data and will change and update with regeneration or partial regeneration.
To prompt a RT to play the original midi data that was imported from a midi song file requires using the Playable RealTracks Feature. A SuperMidi track also can sound out the original data but I encountered issues closing the file and also had to manually display the tracks as they were hidden once the SuperMidi instrument loaded.
A special note to Notes (and Mario and others): The Playable RealTracks concept was introduced in BIAB with a video tutorial in 2011 and updated to include user made UserTracks in 2014 along with the introduction of the Artist Performance File, a variation of a UserTrack but is proprietary to BIAB. This allowed RealTrack and audio editing in BIAB at the same level of midi editing.
I called these custom tracks "Combination Tracks" before Playable RealTracks was introduced in 2022. You may want to consider a deeper dive into this advanced, long time feature that's been virtually overlooked. I have a YouTube video posted in early 2018 of a cover of the Doobie Brothers "Listen to the Music" where a RealTrack modified to feature their signature acoustic guitar lick if you or others want to check a conceptual "Combination Track" out. Listen to the Music BIAB Combination Track
<...snip...? (Bob, are you doing something unque to that piano track in your midi?). <...>
No, nothing unique.
It's a BiaB sgu.
I entered the chords in the BiaB matrix. C in bar 1 -- F7 in bar 5 -- C in bar 7 -- G7 in bar 9 -- F7 in bar 10 -- and C in bar 11. ---- repeat 6 times and a C on bar 13, the ending. Then I chose a style.
Every chord was entered on the first beat of the measure with no pushes, holds, rests or anything else that may be optional.
It's the most basic 12 bar blues progression - without even a turn around. Nothing fancy at all. In the song setting button, "Allow Realtracks substitution based on tempo" is checked.
Have you tried more than one Realtrack substitution? If so, does it exhibit the flawed results with every Realtrack you tried?
Note: I made this file on an old version of BiaB. I do that to make sure they run on older versions. Since BiaB has excellent backwards compatibility of sgu (and other) files it should play on any version of BiaB still out there.
Last edited by Notes Norton; Yesterday at06:01 AM. Reason: TYPO: I'm TYPOMAN - writing all wrongs. :D
Thanks for the clarification Notes - I was pretty confident in that.
Once I report a finding to the developers I stop digging since it is only a bug when they determine it needs to be fix. As we all now, that can take some time. Otherwise, everything Charlie mentions is likely true, but does not address the finding we reported.
..................................... Have you tried more than one Realtrack substitution? If so, does it exhibit the flawed results with every Realtrack you tried? ................................
Yes I did try a number of different RTs and they all preformed exactly like Dan said: "Yes, the track view will show a green name for the instrument, but will not show the actual waveform or play the RT until it is "generated". However, it should regenerate automatically with this type of change when you hit run. But otherwise, what ii is doing is anyones guess here. We should not be seeing this discrepancy with substituting a midi style with a style containing RTs or just by replacing a midi track with a RT - This simple function has worked effortlesslly for years as Notes indicated grin. I will alert the developers about this thread and ask them to help prioritize a fix. Dan"
Love is grand. Divorce is twenty grand!
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
I suppose with a 35+ year program that started out in DOS 5, and with so many features added on year after year, the programming must be very complicated. And that thankfully, there is back compatibility, it's pretty easy for something to break while updating.
But I know that the wizards at PG Music are good at tracking down the bugs and eliminating them.
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Nevertheless, the developers have been alerted.![[Linked Image - Only viewable when logged in]](https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=download&Number=32382&filename=Configuration to load RT.jpg)
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