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Recently I’ve become aware that I’ve been uploading my tracks to Soundcloud in mp3 format when I could’ve been using .wav format. I think I did that out of habit and the misunderstanding that file size might be an issue, rather than SC’s ‘minutes uploaded’ limit. I am going to replace my tracks progressively with wav format.
However, it makes me wonder if it makes a difference at all? I’ve had a few comments on the quality of my mixes, but never had anyone tell me they heard the sampling rate was too low. Was it that forum members were just being kind, or is there no discernible difference to the listener? What format do you upload in?
I’ve recently seen a few comments about the quality being better on SC than YouTube, and assuming that’s true, wondered what causes this? Is it the YT processing engine, or is it because we put the audio through video editor *and* YT processing engine - so in effect it’s getting processed twice? I am assuming - that because each platform has it’s own LUFS standard - that each is compressing/limiting to this different standard?
Andrew
Last edited by Andrew Dee; 05/29/26 04:10 PM. Reason: Grammar
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Andrew, have been uploading .wav files to SoundCloud for a couple of years based on giving them the best quality file I had.
Had noticed recently that one of my song files was labeled "HD" and "lossless" by SoundCloud and I assumed the .wav file was responsible. But now I don't see those labels, so...who knows?
Don't recall anyone commenting negatively on my SoundCloud posts sound quality.
I don't use YouTube enough to have an opinion.
Good questions though...
DC Ron
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A bit off topic but I would love to see a double blind study of music folks attempting to differentiate a .wav vs a high quality .mp3.
Bud
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Andrew, from your comments I believe you're confusing lossless versus lossy file formats with audio sample rates.
I like to think of sample rate as a snapshot of audio at a particular moment in time. For example the audio CD standard sample rate is 44,100 Hertz per second, more commonly expressed as 44.1k, while the sample rate most commonly used with audio associated with video is 48,000 Hertz per second or 48k. Common lossless audio file formats include Wave, AFF and FLAC.. Some audio interfaces can be set to 96k or 192k. The key fact is all audio data gets used and none is discarded.
MP3, WMA and MP4 are common lossy audio file formats. A compression algorithm examines the audio and discards some audio data. As you mentioned the file size will be smaller when compared against an equivalent lossless audio file.
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I use FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) almost exclusively these days. Lossless. Smaller files. Accepted pretty much everywhere.
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I use FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) almost exclusively these days. Lossless. Smaller files. Accepted pretty much everywhere. Not supported in the macOS unless by a 3rd party app.
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…
Good questions though... Thanks Ron - really surprising how much I am learning since joining these PF Music forums! A bit off topic but I would love to see a double blind study of music folks attempting to differentiate a .wav vs a high quality .mp3. Clearly, I can’t tell the difference!  Andrew, from your comments I believe you're confusing lossless versus lossy file formats with audio sample rates.
I like to think of sample rate as a snapshot of audio at a particular moment in time. For example the audio CD standard sample rate is 44,100 Hertz per second, more commonly expressed as 44.1k, while the sample rate most commonly used with audio associated with video is 48,000 Hertz per second or 48k. Common lossless audio file formats include Wave, AFF and FLAC.. Some audio interfaces can be set to 96k or 192k. The key fact is all audio data gets used and none is discarded.
MP3, WMA and MP4 are common lossy audio file formats. A compression algorithm examines the audio and discards some audio data. As you mentioned the file size will be smaller when compared against an equivalent lossless audio file. Thank you Jim – yes, I was confusing things. Your reply has sent me down a rabbit hole! I found the following website had some useful information… https://fileconvertlab.com/blog/mp3-vs-wavWondering what bit depth people use to render their mix to .wav? I’m also wondering if I should render the mix at 48kHz for the purposes of video editing, but render at 44.1kHz for Soundcloud? Thanks also JohnJohnJohn and Mike regarding FLAC information. Andrew
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I use FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) almost exclusively these days. Lossless. Smaller files. Accepted pretty much everywhere. Not supported in the macOS unless by a 3rd party app. So, use a 3rd-party app!  I don't use macOS and my music distributor will convert my FLAC files to whatever Apple wants before they send it there!
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I use FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) almost exclusively these days. Lossless. Smaller files. Accepted pretty much everywhere. Not supported in the macOS unless by a 3rd party app. So, use a 3rd-party app! I don't use macOS and my music distributor will convert my FLAC files to whatever Apple wants before they send it there! I’m not the one who wrote “accepted everywhere”. Of course I have apps that can convert them and use TwistedWave for decoding but no client has asked me to encode FLAC—not once, not ever. I’ve been doing this for decades.
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I’m not the one who wrote “accepted everywhere”. Yeah, me neither. Read it again. You can submit FLACs pretty much everywhere! I’ve been doing this for decades. Hold on, I'll get ya a cookie!
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Originally Posted by JohnJohnJohn
I use FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec) almost exclusively these days. Lossless. Smaller files. Accepted pretty much everywhere.
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Is it the YT processing engine YouTube has two ways for uploading content. DDEX is only available to music label and distributor partners who use YouTube Studio Content Manager and the YouTube DDEX feed with version 3.6+ of the Electronic Release Notification (ERN) standard. The rest of the world uploads 48K .wav, 24bit preferred/16 bit acceptable, FLAC or 320k mp3 (not recommended but you can). -14 LUFS, with true peaks limited to -1 dB or lower to avoid automatic compression or distortion. Google applies their own compression algorithms so they strongly recommend that your tracks be uncompressed. There are many videos in the Google Help Center on how to prepare your tracks.
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I’m not the one who wrote “accepted everywhere”.
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A bit of clarification...I use FLAC for the reasons stated (lossless, smaller files, etc.) And when/if you wish to submit your files to Soundcloud, they accept FLAC files. And when/if you submit your files for distribution to streaming services like Spotify, Apple, etc. your distributor (CD Baby, DistroKid, Landr, etc.) will also accept FLAC files. If you use an OS that does not support FLAC, you may prefer a different format that your system supports! When you upload your FLAC files to a music distribution service (like DistroKid, TuneCore, CD Baby, or UnitedMasters), they automatically transcode your masters into the exact audio formats required by individual storefronts, including Apple Music and the iTunes Store. Platforms process your uploaded files into:
- AAC (Advanced Audio Coding): This is the lossy, compressed format Apple Music and iTunes use for standard streaming and downloads (typically 256 kbps).
- Apple Lossless (ALAC): If you deliver 24-bit FLAC files, distributors will often preserve the hi-res lossless quality by encoding them into Apple's native lossless format.
You do not need to convert your FLAC files to an Apple format before uploading. Simply upload your high-quality FLAC masters directly to your distributor, and their servers will handle all the necessary format conversions for Apple's ecosystem.
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A bit off topic but I would love to see a double blind study of music folks attempting to differentiate a .wav vs a high quality .mp3.
Bud I did some blind tests of 44.1khz 16 bit wav files vs 320 kbps mp3 files. On harmonically rich stuff e.g things with vocal stacks, I could definitely hear a difference - the MP3 sounded a bit smeared or mushy, to my ears at least.
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Since the upper frequency limit of a 320 kbps MP3 is 20,000 Hz, all I can say is that you must have some extraordinarily good hearing, playback equipment, and listening environment. And you are likely 60 years younger than I am.
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I would be the first to admit my ears are shot. I have needed hearing aids for years, but.... hard as it may be to believe, I can hear the difference in audio quality between .mp3 and Flac in all my music during the production stage. I upload only Flac to my soundcloud as a result. I did not know .wav was an option.
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Since the upper frequency limit of a 320 kbps MP3 is 20,000 Hz, all I can say is that you must have some extraordinarily good hearing, playback equipment, and listening environment. And you are likely 60 years younger than I am. Hi Matt, I'm not sure whether you are addressing my comment. If so, yes, human hearing tops out at 20 khz (or a bit less for older folks). I'm not saying I hear a reduction in high frequency sounds, that I ever hear anything over 20k. Rather, I'm saying the quality of what I do hear within the range of up to 20k, when it's harmonically rich, sounds more smeared or "mushy" to me on a 320 kbs MP3 than a 44.1/16 bit wav.
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For streaming purposes a 320MP3 works pretty well though .wav 16 or 24 can get good results IF the LUFS algorithm the site doesn't require the song to be mashed and assuming the playback device is up to snuff.
I use .wav for SC.
For Ytub I work with a 24 bit wav in the project but rendering to MP4 video format reduces the audio to 320 MP3.
I recall when a special suffix was required for a youtube vid to play back in stereo. Old or what?
In the end EARS are the key issue - can one tell the difference in the best of circumstances.
THEN algorithm/processing by the streaming service and
THEN PLAYBACK set up.
I usually listen to streamed audio with good headphones but the playback set up is my computer's audio card so okay but not great.
Cheers
rayc
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Since the upper frequency limit of a 320 kbps MP3 is 20,000 Hz, all I can say is that you must have some extraordinarily good hearing, playback equipment, and listening environment. And you are likely 60 years younger than I am. The difference lies not in the frequency range, but in the compression artifacts, which, depending on the source material, can be very clearly audible even to older people. Of course, a good playback chain and a trained ear help a lot. However, it is always difficult, and sometimes even impossible, to tell the difference between 320 kbps MP3 files and 16-bit WAV files, or between 16-bit and 24-bit WAV files.
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