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Hello all. I'm strapped for cash and need to get a few piano and/or guitar tracks for some originals to give to publishers, my myspace, etc. I am primarily a performer and don't play guitar or piano well enough to use for most recordings. I've used BIAB for some tracks but I keep getting the same feedback that the tracks are too generic. I could upload a scratch vocal somewhere, or I could email the vocal to anyone interested.
Let me know your thoughts. If folks who play other instruments are interested, perhaps we could try an entire song?
Thanks for your time.
Ricky
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RickyHarris.com
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Quote:
Hello all. I'm strapped for cash and need to get a few piano and/or guitar tracks for some originals to give to publishers, my myspace, etc. I am primarily a performer and don't play guitar or piano well enough to use for most recordings. I've used BIAB for some tracks but I keep getting the same feedback that the tracks are too generic. I could upload a scratch vocal somewhere, or I could email the vocal to anyone interested.
Let me know your thoughts. If folks who play other instruments are interested, perhaps we could try an entire song?
Thanks for your time.
Ricky, are you working with Real Tracks?? I would be surprized if response was "...tracks too generic" when hearing these real musicians playing real instruments. How you descirbe youself above sounds like BIAB with RTs would be the perfect solution, unless you are not able to creat the backing in BIAB?? Maybe we do need to "hear" what your are doing. I am sure someone will be able to help from here in the forum. 
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OK, I just found your music web page. I will give a listen tonight. 
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It isn't that the instruments don't sound good, but there is a world of difference between what I can do with stock tracks and what seven of the best players in the world can do. Everyone is spending $700 - $1000 for full-band produced demos here. There is no way I can compete with that with BIAB, at least not with my musical abilities. The other option is to do a piano-vocal or guitar-vocal so that they can hear a potential version of the song, but again, a live player is going to play BIAB under the table. So that is what I was hoping to find. I thought someone might have free time and find it interesting to do something different. A lot of times the demo is just so I can get the song critiqued. The song may change a dozen times, needing a new track each time I get it critiqued or I pitch it. That wears on the wallet pretty quick.
Thanks for listening. Let me know your thoughts. You will hear the difference between the tracks I did and the pro tracks.
Ricky
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RickyHarris.com
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You've got some darn fine music with some pretty strong lyrics on Myspace! I like your songs and your vocals are great. Your level of producing is OK. And that's just what is bugging you. Not that you've done really wrong in the production stage, but it's just not at pro-level. And that is the playing-field you want to (and can) be in with your own songs.
I have listened to your songs and I can hear what they mean by generic. I am however not convinced that the tracks you used are to blame (maybe some tracks, but most of them are pretty good). Unfortunately I wasn't able to pinpoint the things you need to improve in the production stage. Harvey Gerst (he visits these forums now and then) should be able to help you out here.
IMHO you have written some fine songs and made good demos of them. A lot of music on certain radio stations you hear nowadays can't even touch your level. It just needs a good producer to do your songs justice and you're ready to go chart-busting!
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Quote:
OK, I just found your music web page. I will give a listen tonight.
I listened this evening. Here is what I heard. Keep in mind, just one mans opinion:
Your vocals are your strength no question about it to my ear - next are of course the lyrics. Original words are no easy task and you seem to hold you own in this area. The music accompaniment does take a back seat. Perhaps primarily because of your vocals which are pushed right up front. As a result the music tends to become much less of the focus.
So whats my point? Perhaps a better mix would improve the overall reception of the song. The music is country so the chords and arrangements are of course a function of the musical style.
Are you trying to sell your vocals, or are you trying to sell the song? I don't know how it works in the music business. I ask only because it seems to me this would be a valid question. I would think your vocals are well presented. But the band (backing tracks) do lack a certain energy when they need to. Is it BIAB? MIDI or Real Tracks? Seems to me they could be "pushed" a little more in the mix.
Wish I had more for you. I guess I would like to here these songs with a band of studio musicians, but I think I would then be lisening to them rather than you. Perhaps something in my rambling will suggest an option for you. Lets see what others my suggest. 
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Hi Ricky,
I listened to your tracks. I've got quite a few pro friends, some in Nashville, Branson and those that play Vegas etc. If it's opinions you're looking for, the forum will give you quite a variety. From my perspective.
If these are BIAB tracks, you are not going to get any better tracks unless you are willing to pay for the pro demo's. If you are looking for song feedback, try getting a few to Craig Bickhardt for some honest feedback that is if he can find the time to listen.
Vocals are great. As was mentioned before, it's the production level that is missing. A good producer can work wonders. As you already know, pros usually get paid for what they do, there is a reason for that. Finding the dynamic mix requires a good engineer and producer. Get that end covered, and you are making headway.
I write for enjoyment, and play for fun and not much money. If wanted to take it to a serious level, I'd have to pay out the bucks, just like you will. Hopefully you will find someone who will do some piano or guitar work for you, there are some very talented people here. You might want to contact Rharv and see about getting him to remix and master a couple of tunes for you and see if you find what is missing. If he gets you closer, you are on the right track. If so then plunk down the money and go for it. I like your stuff.
Rob
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how much does this dude gratis pay?
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Citaat:
how much does this dude gratis pay?
Gratis is the Dutch word for "for free".
I was a bit surprised to see that word in a post from an American forum member. But then again, maybe Dutch will take over English as a dominant language one day 
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It's also "for free" in Afrikaans, Catalan, Danish, English, French, Galician, German, Bahasa Indonesia, Italian, Norwegian, Polish, Portuguese, Romanian, Spanish and Swedish.  The term gratis in English comes from the Latin word "gratis" meaning "for thanks". Thus sayeth Wikipedia, so it must be true. Back on topic: What level skill are you aiming at here? You said you're competing against people who are putting together top-flight demos by some of the top players out there. Are you trying to get to that level, or are you just trying for something better than "generic" backing tracks?
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Um, Don was makin' a joke, ya'll. He knows what gratis means. As Victor Borge once said, "The problem with a Command Performance for the Queen is that at the end of it, you do not get paid."
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Gratuitous information. I'd give you a gratuity, but what you served will earn my gratitude. Gracias.
I tjried to loorn Dutch bjut it wasz dooontzig. Tooj manjy z, j's and o's.
LOL.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Thanks Mac for the gratis information.................
Rob
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to quote mac: "if'n ya gotsta explain a joke then 'taint funny, McGee!" sic
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Quote:
Um, Don was makin' a joke, ya'll. He knows what gratis means.
Sorry... I figured that.
What I had really started the post for was as a setup for a "going Dutch" joke, but couldn't work it in. But the fact that Wiki had an alphabetical list of languages that used a latin term just struck me as funny. And since it included Dutch in the list, I couldn't resist.
Sigh... Yeah, yeah... You're right about having to explain the joke, especially when I leave the "funny" part out.
Last edited by dcuny; 11/09/10 09:38 AM.
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You guys are cracking me up. :-)
Thanks for the kind words regarding my voice and songwriting. I never thought of my voice as a strength. It's nice to add that to my arsenal. :-)
I completely agree about needing a producer. That was my goal when I moved to Nashville. I wanted a production deal because I felt having a producer was what I needed to make it to the next level. Due to album sales being nonexistent, production deals don't exist any longer. You have to pay for everything yourself or find someone who will foot the bill, then pitch the entire album (or EP) to the labels or do it yourself as an indie. I am not financially able to do an EP with a decent producer here in Nashville. Which leads to the reason I was looking for someone to do tracks. If the tracks were good and the songs got positive remarks in critiques, I was going to use them to demonstrate my abilities. I can afford one or two fully produced songs but want at least another two for people to hear when they go to listen or buy my produced songs.
Thanks again for your help everyone. I appreciate your thoughts.
Ricky
________
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RickyHarris.com
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Ricky, Subscribe to TapeOp. http://www.tapeop.com/In nearly every issue, they interview a somewhat unknown producer that has worked magic for somewhat unknown bands, where production played a role in getting those bands more known. Current issue excepted (all about David Byrne and his producers). It's a free subscription and has a great vibe as a magazine. Another option - find your local megachurches in Nashville area. Visit on Sundays and listen for the cats that you think could take your music up a notch. Find out their names and contact information. Chances are, they moved to Nashville with similar dreams. They are almost assuredly hired-in at the big churches with attendance over a few thousand on a weekend. This is actually true for most big megachurches in any city. The musicians are hired-in. They likely won't do this gratis. But they might work collaboratively with you if your songs hold up and their playing enhances your basic songwriting skills and you give credit. Write some songs for them. Barter, trade, etc. See if you can record in the church's studio. Most megachurches have nearly full-on recording and production capability built-in at the church. Normally associated with that is at least one person on staff or volunteering that has recording and production chops. My brother-in-law is the worship leader at a pretty big church in Indianapolis, IN. Meyer Sound wrote up their build in a recent issue of their magazine. Looky here: http://www.meyersound.com/news/2010/northview_church/Their video production suite down in the basement is nuts. Absolutely nuts. I don't necessarily agree with spending so much on a church - but it's happening, and you might be able to make use of it; particularly there in Nashville. -Scott
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Ricky,
Congrats on making the big move. Takes guts. Magic secret word in Nville has always been "collaborate" and I doubt that's changed. Strike up relationships with keyboard and guitar players by asking to write with them. Once you find some people you click with they'll play on your other stuff too. Then if you still need a paid demo everybody chips in. Sometimes you'll be surprised at the equipment some of these guys have in their homes. Or you can get a discount at a studio because so and so knows so and so. Plus if they have connections with publishers or producers you have an in through them.
Go to writer's nights, play at writer's nights and approach people, frequent whatever music store is hot right now, scan the ads in the local music paper and put one in there yourself - your phone will ring off the wall if it's worded right but you'll have to weed through all sorts of people. Ask the people in your apt complex, where you work etc., if they know somebody. Belmont used to have a student project studio that you can get in so it might be worth it to take a production class or make friends with a student there. Join NSAI and go to the workshops. Ask your ASCAP or BMI person to help you hook up.
It's all about who you know. Be nice to everybody - even if you don't click at writing together - you may meet them again in a position of power. And you don't know who they know. Keep writing the best songs you can, co-write and work at making connections and when you make the right ones and hit pay dirt the rest will take care of itself.
The one thing more powerful than a great high priced demo is having a friend of a hot or up and coming producer recommend your work to them. Or having a writer introduce you to his/her publisher because they like you and your songs.
You're welcome. grin.
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Thanks for the info!
Scott, I haven't considered the church angle although I have scoped out the players at my church. I'm definitely checking out tapeop.com
Josie, don't I know you from the JPF website? You are so right about all of it. I've been at this Nashville thing for four years. Been with NSAI and ASCAP for a long time. I'm doing the co-writing thing and writers nights and workshops. I have left no stone unturned. I have been surprised at the number of people who aren't serious about achieving success. They say they want to co-write but really don't. But I still ask every day. Emailed four potential co-writes today as a matter of fact. We'll see how many respond. :-)
NSAI and ASCAP have been of no use unfortunately. At least NSAI admits that they can't help me since I am an artist. I keep going to their events anyway, hoping that the songwriting connections pay off. So far, no luck. I have tried for years to get a writers rep meeting at ASCAP. No luck. They recently had an internal house cleaning and things are supposed to be different. We'll see. I dropped off a demo last week as instructed. My fingers are crossed that something comes of it.
Thanks again folks. I truly appreciate your help.
Ricky
________
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RickyHarris.com
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Ricky,
I've lurked on JPF and know some people there. Great bunch of folks and valuable info. So I don't mean this in a bad way but I got so depressed after reading some of the threads that I don't visit that often. grin.
I think your best asset is that you are an artist/songwriter - more ways to break in. There used to be a few decent indie labels left to get your foot in the door but I'm guessing are all gone now.
Your could get yourself a backup band and build up a following then do a live showcase. Start selling lots of cds at your shows and from your website and get noticed that way.
Keep on making those contacts and don't give up. You'll find some serious people. The place is crawling with guitar and keyboard players trying to break in just like you are - it's always been that way and many of them can't sing.
Keep the faith.
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